To NOT expect my DC to clean up after themselves yet

[Goingoutat3]

Me and DH are in midst of a huge argument that started yesterday after spending a week listening to him snap at the DC to clean up their stuff. I mean I'm all for asking the DC to tidy at the end of the day.. sometimes at the end of the activity... But I'm also , I feel, realistic that theyre just kids... They don't realise the impact their "mess" has on the home and probably think the fairies clean their stuff away

DC are 9 and 4.5

DH attitude towards it is if it's not picked up/owned up to/cleaned away he will throw it in the bin

That's what happened yesterday, he semi-shouted from the kitchen "whoever's this is can you put it away or it's going in the bin"

DC9 was in eye shot of what 'this is'. DC4 and I were not.

DC9 said its not mine (which was right in the end as it was DC4's)

He then said okay it's going in the bin

I then shouted out what is it????

He told me it was a mini bowl (of which DC have one each for when they do mini cooking)

I then said can you take it out the bin it's DC4's

He said no you get it out the bin

This obviously pissed me off so I went into kitchen, took it out the bin, put it in dishwasher and told him he needs to lower his expectations of the kids.

This then escalated into a full blown argument about how I:

"Live like a pig" (ridiculous)
"Can't even organise myself to get the food shopping" (like a day or 2 late due to holidays/DC/my activities)
"Don't discipline the DC"

I've been round two seperate houses this week where I have witnessed the mess that other children make and subsequently their DMum or DDad picking up after them (within reason) or asking them to clean up after an activity before moving onto the next.

AIBU
Yes- they should be picking up after themselves every time at this age
No-DH expectations are too high

Anything in between?

Post edited by MNHQ

YANBU. It's unreasonable for your DH to chuck things in the bin if they're not tidied away THAT SECOND. It's ridiculous. A huge mess? Yes, I could understand frustrations. A bowl on a chair? No.

Kids create some mess, it's impossible to live in a show home with them, and his expectations are too high. You've said multiple times that they tidy away and contribute to a tidy house overall, so I don't think you've been raising lazy entitled children, as other PP seem hellbent on believing.

Could you have a "junk box" where small things laying around are put in it and the kids need to put the stuff away at the end of the day? That way, he has somewhere to put the stuff (that isn't the bin!), and the kids have the responsibility of putting stuff away.

My dc have been taught to tidy up after themselves since they could understand and follow instructions. When they're very little, you make a game out of it/ make it fun. Then it just becomes part of the routine.

We've always expected 12yo ds to do it. I won't say he's good at it, so we still regularly call him upstairs to pick the towel he's used off the floor and put it back where it belongs, or put his bowl/ drinks can away or in the bin. The the principle is there. We all live here and make the mess, we all the clean the mess up. 6yo dd even knows how to put a load in the washing machine (still trying to train ds on that). If you don't want to raise lazy, entitled adults, the lesson begins when they're tiny.

Your dh's approach is not good (I too have a dh who tries the stick rather than the carrot approach and it does grate on me sometimes). But the concept is right. The 9yo especially should be doing more.

The Bin thing is punitive rather than authoritative.

Any kind of throwing kids stuff away is not on.

Plus it sends a terrible message about valuing and respecting your possessions.

He could have said "DC4 come here and tidy your things please - this goes in the dishwasher".

That both sets the boundary and also provides support and guidance for to it DC to learn.

Crikey. High expectations for young kids. SS here is 18 and does fuck all. DH doesn't think he should either.

@Bloodyleaverspartybollocks

Doesn't your husband want his son to be a responsible adult ?

You’ve had a really tough time op, I’m not sure why.

I do actually agree with your dh in that leaving odd things out is a slippery slope. I have two that leave their stuff everywhere and I wish I could go back and retrain them before this became a habit. That being said, shouting and threatening isn’t the way to deal with this. Kids are kids and a tidy home isn’t the most important thing, especially if his way of managing his expectations is abusive behaviour. And don’t even get me started on the food shopping comment.

I have a good friend who is very tidy, and her toddler dc like to do jigsaws. She makes them put them away as soon as complete and I always look at their little faces and feel so sad. Yes it’s a good habit but she could let them admire their work for a few minutes at least! My friend is lovely though and would never shout or behave like your dh.

Shouting and threatening to throw things away is just horrible and unnecessary. Why doesn’t he ask the children to come and help him tidy up and show them how to put their things away or in the dishwasher. It’s not fair to make young children walk on eggshells because they don’t live up to your standards when they are still learning. This is far more damaging than a small amount of mess. Yanbu op.

Nope I don't think he does.
I've given up tbh it's a waste of my breath.

the 9 year old should most definitely be tidying up after himself at that age, and keeping his room tidy.

Your DH shouldn't just shout, if not everyone can see what he's on about, he must take the object where you can all see it or wait.

And the 4.5 year old should be learning to help you tidy his things away.

I thought you were going to say they were toddlers. Of course a 9 and 4 year old should be able to tidy up after themselves (the 4 year old with some support). Your husband is wrong to get so angry but he's right that they should be able to tidy up after themselves.

DS is 18 months and even he does tidy time before nap and bed? Very late to start

It sounds like your husbands angst is towards you, not the children.

Read back the points you said that he made.
YOU live like a pig, YOU can't sort the shopping and YOU don't discipline the dc.

I agree you've left it late start getting the kids involved with tidying up but you can start asap. Loads of info online regarding age appropriate chore charts as the 9 year old will be able to do more than your 4 year old.

I would also try and hash out what's happened between you and your husband and figure out what his real issue is, because it's not the children.