To NOT expect my DC to clean up after themselves yet

[Goingoutat3]

Me and DH are in midst of a huge argument that started yesterday after spending a week listening to him snap at the DC to clean up their stuff. I mean I'm all for asking the DC to tidy at the end of the day.. sometimes at the end of the activity... But I'm also , I feel, realistic that theyre just kids... They don't realise the impact their "mess" has on the home and probably think the fairies clean their stuff away

DC are 9 and 4.5

DH attitude towards it is if it's not picked up/owned up to/cleaned away he will throw it in the bin

That's what happened yesterday, he semi-shouted from the kitchen "whoever's this is can you put it away or it's going in the bin"

DC9 was in eye shot of what 'this is'. DC4 and I were not.

DC9 said its not mine (which was right in the end as it was DC4's)

He then said okay it's going in the bin

I then shouted out what is it????

He told me it was a mini bowl (of which DC have one each for when they do mini cooking)

I then said can you take it out the bin it's DC4's

He said no you get it out the bin

This obviously pissed me off so I went into kitchen, took it out the bin, put it in dishwasher and told him he needs to lower his expectations of the kids.

This then escalated into a full blown argument about how I:

"Live like a pig" (ridiculous)
"Can't even organise myself to get the food shopping" (like a day or 2 late due to holidays/DC/my activities)
"Don't discipline the DC"

I've been round two seperate houses this week where I have witnessed the mess that other children make and subsequently their DMum or DDad picking up after them (within reason) or asking them to clean up after an activity before moving onto the next.

AIBU
Yes- they should be picking up after themselves every time at this age
No-DH expectations are too high

Anything in between?

Post edited by MNHQ

My children since around 3ish have tidied up after themselves. My 7 year old just made herself a sandwich for lunch, supervised. Never to young to do little tasks OP.

I think expecting a four year old to never leave anything out of place is ridiculous. I might respond by putting the next thing I spot that belongs to dh that has been left out straight in the bin.

Absolutely they should be clearing up their mess!

Agreed. So sick of seeing that phrase on here.

They should be cleaning up after themselves! My DS6 does every day plus does small chores that contribute to the house,

Yes I agree it was a poor phrase to use I'm sorry 😔

I would say we didn't encourage ours to clean up. I can't remember many times they emptied the dishwasher (without being asked) while living at home for instance. Yet mine, now in their 20s and living independently do a great job of doing it. And are the tidiest in their respective homes (one is flat sharing, the other married). No harm done!

Well you're a very decent person to acknowledge that and apologise, so thank you very much for that.

To answer the question, all children should be taught to clean up after themselves appropriately for their age.

However, the thing that jumped out at me was your DH criticising you for not organising yourself to do the food shop. So your DC have to tidy up all their mess themselves but he has no responsibility for sourcing the food that he also eats? Have I misinterpreted that or is that an example of his general thinking?

This then escalated into a full blown argument about how I:

"Live like a pig" (ridiculous)
"Can't even organise myself to get the food shopping" (like a day or 2 late due to holidays/DC/my activities)
"Don't discipline the DC"

He sounds like an arsehole. Is he?

No harm in asking them clear up especially the 9:year old

It is a good life skill

Yabu

4.5 old is old enough to pick up after themselves with some guidance and patience.
9yr old should be able to clean up and help their sibling to do so too.

Well the teenage years ages going to be fun, he’ll be chucking stuff left, right, and centre.

My dad was like this growing up. It’s a miserable way to live as a child. There were other things, not just tidying up, but this kind of response to normal life just meant we were all much happier when he wasn’t home. I can’t say I have much relationship with him now as an adult. (And, like another post I read earlier, he also couldn’t really be bothered about being involved in Christmas or birthday parties.)

No you haven't misinterpreted it at all

He is a very critical person

When we first got together, well , lived together, he criticized me a lot about being tidy

I wasn't the most tidy person but I wasn't dirty. I would just perhaps come home and put my coat and bag on the table instead of ''away" but that task would be replaced by me providing some silly entertainment, doing a silly dance, singing a silly song

Eventually the arguements about me being tidy carried on that I now have a small element of anxiety about tidiness, so I know the house, now, is tidy by above average standards, but the silly dances and silly songs have disappeared.

During these times in our relationship I said to him if you're like this with me what will you be like with children? He said I expect it from children I don't expect it from you.

Yet here we are!

What I don't want is the children to develop anxiety about leaving something out. And them stopping their silly dances and songs, because they're worried the house isn't tidy for daddy.

So I guess all this emotion came out yesterday, in more of a protective way for the DC (I'm not naive to think that an argument in front of them is not actually protecting them at all though) I just couldnt help myself

The opposite would be to be telling off DC4 for looking at a bowl and putting it down instead of putting it back in the cupboard, which i think is U.

Such a drip feed 🙄

If you don’t teach your children how to tidy up after themselves how do you expect them to learn an incredibly necessary life skill? You’re failing your children by not teaching them basic life skills.

And you are still U for not expecting your dc to tidy up, why is a bowl even out?

Umm, no, the OP describes it clearly in her post. Instead of showing the 4 year old how to put away a toy and making it a game to play together, the dad has shouted and thrown it in the bin. It's not a huge presumption to guess that this is what the 9 year old has witnessed since a young age also.

Not following about the silly song and dances.

But he’s hyper-critical, has high expectations and is a bit controlling over his environment. You’re the opposite. You’ve known it for a while, so I’m not sure whether you bring ‘right’ or him being ‘wrong’ is helpful. You probably need counselling together to work through it.

The object itself is irrelevant

It could be a crayon, a doll, a hairband

Would you still question why a crayon was out?

I e. Not throwing a paddy and chucking stuff in the bin

Please can you not use such offensive, outdated and ignorant terms.

Appreciate if you take a moment to educate yourself as to why the term throwing a paddy is rude as fuck.

Yes I agree I apologised earlier in the post

You may want to ask MNHQ to change your OP.

I'm not one for censorship (you said what you said, you apologised albeit you really don't seem to understand why it's offensive) but I just couldn't get beyond it to even answer your question.

Your DH is right, cleaning up after themselves needs to become automatic. Perhaps you are too lax with them OP?