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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Flexible working revoked - help!!

410 replies

Tiredofbeingtired1 · 05/08/2023 07:59

Looking for a sounding board for a problem I'm having at work. Not sure what to do really...

So, I had a baby and returned after a 9 month maternity leave, but when my son was 5 months old, I discussed my return to work with my boss (male).

(I work as a PA for two people who own and run the company)

I asked to return to work 5 days a week, but to work 2 days from home and also if I could leave at 4.30pm instead of my contracted finish of 5pm in order to pick up my son from nursery. I was told that none of this was a problem and that I didn't need to be in when my boss wasn't in (he also worked 3 days a week in the office).

So I returned to work with this set up and did absolutely everything to make this work, which included working through lunch breaks and responding to emails from 6am-10pm 7 days a week.

After 8 months of this being in place, I was told (in the middle of the office, not privately) that they were going to need to ask me to return to the office 4 days a week as they couldn't give me something they weren't giving to the rest of the staff. I was assured that this had nothing to do with my performance as they know I'm working all the time, but purely to do with what other people in the office are allowed.

I had many discussions with them about the impact of this on me, and that it would cost me almost an extra £400 in childcare costs per month, to which I was told effectively that if I can't afford to have kids, I shouldn't have them.

At this point, two other women were having their working from home revoked, but they had had it for 11 and 14 years, and their children were in secondary school by this point.

In the discussions for this, my boss (female) had suggested to me that on the extra day I was being asked to work in the office, I could leave early. This was purely her idea and was even suggesting around lunchtime.

After all my protests, I was told they would get back to me...however 5 months later nobody had. As this was being requested to start in September, I approached my boss (female) last week to discuss it before my holiday, and her holiday. She seemed surprised, but thankful that I had put the wheels in motion and was making this happening and agreed that it had kind of been forgotten about (not by me, I can assure you!). When I then raised her idea of leaving early on the extra day in the office, she didn't seem to recall this conversation and actually seemed quite annoyed by it, asking "how early?". I suggested 3.30pm instead of 4.30pm, and as I could see that this request wasn't going down well, I suggested it be for the first 3 weeks to help my son settle in (as this also coincides with him moving to preschool).

She then said that we need to review my leaving at 4.30pm on other days, and would I be willing to leave at 5pm (my contracted time) instead. I said that it wasn't a case of being willing, but that if I left at that time, I wouldn't be able to make it to the nursery before they shut. She seemed in disbelief that it would take me that long to get home, but I pointed out that whilst Google might suggest it is an hour, that is if I hit all my connections and there is no traffic. In practice, this is never the case, and it it always takes me around 1 hour 20 mins.

Her reasoning for asking me to leave at 5pm was again, for parity across the office, but also in case her or my other boss need something urgent between 4.30-5pm. Whilst I understand this, in practice I don't think this is actually the case, as all day I am asked for very little and I am the proactive one asking if they need things all the time. I can't believe that something urgent would be regularly happening in the last 30 mins of the day.

She also said that if they finish a meeting after 4.30pm and I am gone, they might need something, and it's not fair on other members of staff as it puts more pressure on them. Whilst this is true, I have been back through the diaries and in the 201 days I have worked back in the office, they have had meetings that have gone beyond 4.30pm 18 times. Also, they have never had someone come to the office for a meeting that starts after 4.30pm.

Therefore I feel that this isn't a reflection of what actually happens. I can't believe that they ask for very little all day, but in that last 30 mins something urgent comes up. She also acknowledged that I am on email my whole journey home, but it's if something happens that I am needed in person. She accepted the fact I work through my lunch, and from early morning until late evening on emails, but that it was not about total hours worked.

For context, my company are very anti flexible working. I joined 3 days before lockdown in 2020, and went on maternity leave in July 2021, so had spent a massive amount of my employment working from home. They are on a drive to get people back to the office and don't want anyone working from home. They recently conducted a staff survey, and in that almost every member of the office requested more flexibility with working from home. Therefore they are begrudgingly reviewing it, but it seems they are missing the point that flexible working doesn't have to be the exact same conditions for everyone and that it is a case by case scenario.

I am unsure as to whether I am being unreasonable, or if not, how hard to push on this - especially given that I was told by my boss (male) that he asked if he could get rid of me when I told him I was pregnant!!

We are a small team and don't have an official HR department. We recently just got a freelance HR person in, but I'm unsure as to how much I trust them yet. Also, in my capacity as a PA I work very closely with my bosses and maintaining a good relationship is important. I'm not trying to rock the boat or get special privileges, but it's hard to make things work when the agreement keeps changing. I returned to work based on certain conditions and I set my life up around them.

Any advice would be so gratefully received as it is keeping me up at night!

Thank you!

OP posts:
ShadowPuppets · 05/08/2023 09:57

GotMooMilk · 05/08/2023 09:44

Working 1 hour and 20 away isn’t really practical anyway and I’d be looking for something else. What if DH is away and the child is sick that’s a long time to get there!

How do you think people in commuter towns to London work? I’m lucky that DH and I alternate WFH but when I leave the office it’s:

30 mins - office to mainline station (takes 20 but you have to factor 30 for tube etc and making it to the train on time)
35 mins - train to home station
20 mins - walk from station to home

Fairly standard round here.

watermeloncougar · 05/08/2023 09:58

Yes, it's entirely possible the £400 extra could be commute, additional charge for late nursery pick up etc... but we don't know because the OP hasn't told us!

MillWood85 · 05/08/2023 09:58

It sounds like a small business, and the likelihood is that someone else has complained about your working hours.

You took a job that now doesn't fit around your home life. It's not really their problem to solve, it's yours.

greenteaandmarshmallows · 05/08/2023 09:59

Mamansparkles · 05/08/2023 09:48

No, because she doesnt take a lunch break, logs back on in the evening and finishes half an hour early in exchange. So she is doing all her hours and more.
There is no issue with the number of hours she is doing.

Ah I see.

ActDottie · 05/08/2023 10:01

I’d find another job, there’s much better roles out there with better flexibility. My office you have to be in 2 days a week but I mostly only do one day and work whatever hours I choose. I work for a large company they tend to have predefined flexible working packages.

lulublue32 · 05/08/2023 10:02

Do you have a partner? What contribution do their employees make to the family flexible working requirements? As a manager, I do find it frustrating that my largely female workforce request flexible working plans - which I try very hard to accommodate. However, there has to be some balance with what works for the company and often, people only see things from their perspective. 9/10, the father or partner has made no flexible working request to their place of work so I feel like I’m the one always compromising and making adjustments when frankly, it doesn’t help the company. I feel much more positive about flexible working when the other partner’s company is also taking some of the burden.

Nevermind31 · 05/08/2023 10:02

Are you saying that you have your child at home with you when you are working from home (as you will have extra costs)?
i can understand that your employers wouldn’t want that. However, if they are not willing to do flexi or part time I would look for something else.

Yellowflower47 · 05/08/2023 10:03

Sorry but not once in this whole post have you mentioned your DP/DH and their contribution. Why are you breaking your back and rocking the boat so much in your job when your child has another parent to share the load with?!

Schoolchoicesucks · 05/08/2023 10:03

If you have an agreed flexible work request that states you are in the office 3 days a week and finish at 4.30 then refer them back to that.

If you don't then submit one now, including that you are starting earlier/taking a shorter lunchbreak, are willing to check emails once home to deal with anything urgent.

But stop responding to emails between 6 and 10 every day. And do reassure them that you have childcare in place while you are working.

If they refuse then I agree you should find another job.

babyproblems · 05/08/2023 10:04

They sound shot to be honest. I would explain you’re making an official flexible working request and if they can’t be accommodated that I’d be looking to leave for an employer who understood flexible working! If you love working there I would maybe try and explain what flexible working means and that equality doesn’t mean being the same for everyone! It’s about accessibility

Ombrémermaid · 05/08/2023 10:04

Personally, I would be looking for something else too.
I work from home permanently, have a wonderful boss, and the whole team all work all over the country. It sounds like your company don’t trust their staff to be competent and they seem to like micro managing their employees. I respect you OP for having stuck it out for as long as you have. The PAs at my company all work remotely, and I believe for the right team of people, remote working increases productivity.

There are good companies out there with management who understand family and work/life balance. Don’t settle for less. Hope you find something better 💕

JustaChristian · 05/08/2023 10:06

Unfortunately jobs cannot be flexible if they did not employ you on the rota you wanted. I personally can work only school hours and put that upfront on my cv or letter or in word all the time, and have been always employed exactly ( stated in my contracts ) the hours I can do. If I have a chance I do more hours and they pay it. I am not a PA though and office jobs are not my cup of tea, after being in the office world for ages. So this is how I do it now, and it has never been a problem.

Mummyoflittledragon · 05/08/2023 10:08

I’d be working to rule from now on. Hopefully you can get a better job for more money.

Soapyspuds · 05/08/2023 10:09

Find another job and work to rule. No more responding to emails or calls on your breaks or evenings.

Soakitup37 · 05/08/2023 10:10

SpainToday · 05/08/2023 08:19

I’m a PA to a senior person in a large organisation. Even pre COVID, he was out and about a lot, so we maintained contact via email and phone. During lockdown obviously I never saw him at all, but we had daily teams calls, so that worked fine. We are now on a hybrid working pattern (2 days in the office, 3 at home) and even if our days don’t align, it still works out fine due to teams, email and phone.

In 2023 your PA doesn’t have to be perched outside your office, that’s such an old fashioned practice.

I’m a PA in a similar role, I wholeheartedly agree with this. I’ve done flex for 8 years in my role and been at the company over 10 years with a glowing eoy report every year. It can and does work.

PatchworkElmer · 05/08/2023 10:12

Was your contract changed?

Honestly I’d just look for something else, closer to home. They don’t sound very supportive of working families or flexible working.

Itsnotrightbutitsok · 05/08/2023 10:13

I think YABU

You knew before you had your DC what the working pattern was like and that it was office based.
You chose to have a baby knowing this situation and knowing that you were able to do it whilst being a mum.

At 5 months old you them asked for flexible working and they kindly gave it to you.
They could have easily said no but tried to be as accommodating as possible.

They now have to make it fair (probably because there’s been a complaint which is why it was done in front of everyone) and have everyone working in a similar way.

Lots of posters are saying to find a new job but I think they’ve been incredibly kind and accommodating for 8 months and have saved you lots of money and stress.
I personally would want to work for a company like that.

It’s almost like they’re being punished for being so accommodating, as if they’d said no right from the start no one would be telling you to quit your job.

Is there any way your DH can have some flexible working?
Could you afford to both drop one day?

You’d need to work out the financial side of things but if you’re paying for full time childcare anyway then I don’t see how this is going to affect you that much tbh.

AnneAnon · 05/08/2023 10:13

Apologies if I have missed this but where is your other half in all this? Are you on your own?

mariiiaa · 05/08/2023 10:14

Yellowflower47 · 05/08/2023 10:03

Sorry but not once in this whole post have you mentioned your DP/DH and their contribution. Why are you breaking your back and rocking the boat so much in your job when your child has another parent to share the load with?!

Did the Op say there is one??

BitOutOfPractice · 05/08/2023 10:15

While they have been deciding what to do (5 months!), I hope you have 100% been working to rule. No emails outside your contracted hours

Puzzledandpissedoff · 05/08/2023 10:15

I feel that this isn't a reflection of what actually happens

Maybe, but they don't - and in a small set-up it's them who'll call the shots, which they're perfectly entitled to do if they can prove there's a good business need

Also agree with PPs that this doesn't sound as if it's been done on a formal basis, and that the figures around "what it'll cost you" don't add up. I strongly suspect that you've been looking after the DC while "working", and with a company who you say are anti WFH in the first place this was never going to fly

Overall you'd be best advised to just get another job, but please don't let on at interview that your overriding concern is childcare since that's not an employer's concern

GirlOfTudor · 05/08/2023 10:15

I haven't read the whole post, but yes, it is something you should've considered before having your child. If it doesn't work out with this employer, start looking for a new job who are more flexible. Maybe look for suggestions from fellow parents or via friendly contacts. It might be difficult, but unfortunately we do have to make sacrifices as parents.

mariiiaa · 05/08/2023 10:15

Itsnotrightbutitsok · 05/08/2023 10:13

I think YABU

You knew before you had your DC what the working pattern was like and that it was office based.
You chose to have a baby knowing this situation and knowing that you were able to do it whilst being a mum.

At 5 months old you them asked for flexible working and they kindly gave it to you.
They could have easily said no but tried to be as accommodating as possible.

They now have to make it fair (probably because there’s been a complaint which is why it was done in front of everyone) and have everyone working in a similar way.

Lots of posters are saying to find a new job but I think they’ve been incredibly kind and accommodating for 8 months and have saved you lots of money and stress.
I personally would want to work for a company like that.

It’s almost like they’re being punished for being so accommodating, as if they’d said no right from the start no one would be telling you to quit your job.

Is there any way your DH can have some flexible working?
Could you afford to both drop one day?

You’d need to work out the financial side of things but if you’re paying for full time childcare anyway then I don’t see how this is going to affect you that much tbh.

Flexible working requests have sweet FA to do with other employees and whinging that it isn't fair.

It's between the employee and employer and what's workable.

Comtesse · 05/08/2023 10:20

Call the Pregnant Then Screwed helpline. You have gone above and beyond on your commitment to this job and it is disappointing they are not prepared to remove your flexibility.

Blondebutnotlegally · 05/08/2023 10:25

Sugarfree23 · 05/08/2023 09:33

Where's the extra £400 child care fee coming from if she's not wfh with child?

The extra few hours a day childcare plus extra for having early/later hours. (Normal where I am) not to mention here in SE we are paying 7/8 an hour for childcare and 400 for 2 days of full childcare would be an insane bargain and really unrealistic!