"Therapy" is no better than a natter with a friend or a placebo.

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I am starting this thread to see what people think of therapy. I am personally convinced it is at least 80% useless - I am not saying completely useless, as I am sure talking about a problem makes you feel better, although you can talk things through with your pet rabbit - I used to as a teen! There is also some value in learning some techniques such as CBT, but that can be learnt from a book, so again, not sure of the value of an actual therapist.

I've come to this conclusion through two main sources, children and holocaust survivors.

I have known thousands of children through teaching, and fostering, and many many of them have seen therapists. My main observation is that huge expectations are placed on therapy as some sort of magic bullet that is going to cure all problems, but the result is inevitably disappointment, as nothing changes. Parents, and children too are left wondering what magic was supposed to have happened, and why it didn't. One fostering social worker once mentioned to me that she thought it was a complete waste of time after the age of 8, and I think she was right. Between the ages of 5 and 8, you can possibly use therapy to teach children a bit about the emotions they are feeling, which can help them understand themselves, but beyond that there seems to be no benefit

My other source is coming from a family of holocaust survivors, who never had therapy, and survived by not talking about hte past - Many went on to have long, happy, successful lives, married and raised families, ( including me!) . They did not discuss the past, and I was told not to ask questions. They were not totally without problems. I was aware of the occasional nightmare, and several of them were binge eaters who became obese in old age. However, they lived with this problems quite happily, and there was no talk or expectation of "therapy" of any kind to address them

So I have started this thread to see what others think. Maybe I am wrong - I am open to being told that I am wrong in this. My experiences have not given me any confidence in arranging for therapy for any child, or suggesting it for any adult, but please tell me if it is really in fact a wonder drug and I have missed the point somehow!

I should say I have been sent for therapy twice myself - once after being in a road accident in which my closest school friend died, ( aged 16)it was awful, made me cry every time, I felt so much better when I was allowed to stop, and once sent by my employer after I was knifed ( quite gently!) by a student at school - I was taught some useful CBT, but in my opinion a book would have been more helpful than a difficult journey to speak to someone who was basically going very slowly through what I could have read for myself in half the time without the train journey.

so:

YABU - therapy is helpful - and please explain how!
YANBU - therapy is a waste of time /a money maker/ sending someone for therapy or providing it is just a way of letting someone feel they are doing something useful, when they are not

I had EMDR as part of therapy for PTSD and even though I was the biggest sceptic about therapy it was life changing.

I am not saying holocaust were "cured" - I am saying they chose to cope with the past by not talking about it, which was normal then, and seemed to work very well, better than I have seen therapy work

What on earth are you basing this on? Holocaust survivors experienced awful rates of mental and physical illness plus high suicide rates, from immediately after the end of WW2 and at every point since. Even the children of Holocaust survivors are affected. Have a look at https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3181591/, https://www.aaets.org/traumatic-stress-library/holocaust-survivors-and-their-children-a-search-for-positive-effects, https://www.theguardian.com/science/2015/aug/21/study-of-holocaust-survivors-finds-trauma-passed-on-to-childrens-genes

There is an abundance of research to support the efficacy to different therapies. Maybe have a Google before coming here to spout your I'll informed opinions as fact.

I've had counselling. I found it really helpful - she was able to make connections and help me understand things that I just couldn't by myself or chatting with friends.

I've never had therapy but I'm not sure if you have that you can say it didn't work for you because you actually have no idea what the outcome might have been if you hadn't done the therapy. I don't think it will be helpful all situations and to some extent you are correct that there's an element of just needing to get on with it. Many people who have been through difficulties do exactly that. However, I have seen many people who do appear to need some sort of therapy because they fail to acknowledge what has happened or fail to process things or cannot accept their feelings etc and for those people it can be hugely beneficial. Perhaps it should only be on the table when people are unable to function and move past things that have happened to them.

A lot of it is a money racket to exploit the vulnerable.

What a breathtakingly cruel thing to say. One of my friends is in mental health crisis at the moment, she is surrounded by people who love her and who will listen but none of us are qualified mental health practitioners and we simply aren't equipped to give her the support she so desperately needs. But sure she's a loser for seeking therapy, nice one.

I think there are a lot of bad therapists out there. I also think that for some personalities therapy can just lead to rumination and being stuck in the past.

Good therapy is life changing though. I think a good therapist challenges you so that you get real change. I've had terrible therapy which just left me in a worse place and amazing therapy which has drastically changed how I function in the world. I'm much happier for it and much more able to deal with my bad memories and with the difficult relationships in my life. It's not perfect though and a lot of the results you get come from how hard you work.

I think with the Holocaust you have to remember it was a collective trauma. That changes how people respond and cope because no one person is isolated in it just having been them that survived something awful. And with a lot of survivors there has been damage that you wouldn't spot unless you look closely - there are people whose parents were in concentration camps and they will tell you they had no real attachment to their parents or they watched their parents cope quietly by drinking and keeping that quiet. But the damage was there. Even Primo Levi is thought to have taken his life ultimately. But I do think Holocaust survivors are utterly inspiring and I do think of them when I'm down and needing to give my head a wobble about the scale of my problems. Humans are remarkably resilient and many people do just do best in getting on with things and focusing on the future. There's no one size fits all with anything in life is there?

Therapy can be helpful if you are able to have unlimited visits.

Unfortunately for many, the NHS often only offers a limited course of counselling so you will sometimes find that the lid is gradually lifted during the sessions but when they come to an end, your problems are left simmering, leaving the patient troubled, unsettled and at a loss with all these memories and emotions that have been brought to the surface.

Social connections and being involved within a community so your sense of belonging is achieved will make you feel better than therapy.

I use Maslows hierarchy of needs to meet my needs. Belonging is so basic and if you think about it, most people are in therapy because of feeling unloved/unwanted as a child. So their basic need of belonging was not met. Meet that need and the others and you will reach self actualisation.

I definitely agree with this.

I would absolutely not want therapy and I think it would make me incredibly defensive.

However, ironically, I think I would make a very good therapist and understand how it helps other people.

Therapists aren't supposed to give you advice and answers. You don't attend with a problem and leave with a solution. They help you to mull over your thoughts and things have happened to you; give you alternative viewpoints to think about; help you with identifying where you may lack boundaries; self-reflection on how and why your responses to things may not be helpful or healthy; identify patterns of behaviour; highlight abuse...

I think you have to want it though. If you're resistant to therapy then you won't get anything from it.

And there are a lot of therapists working for peanuts because their clients can't afford their full fees and they want to help people above all.

Plus however rubbish the NHS is, it does still deliver a lot of mental health support completely free. And many charities offer free therapy too.

I'm going to get this wrong because it is a distant memory, but didn't Freud say that therapy doesn't make you happy it just helps to make you as miserable as everybody else.

I honestly think however that I would not be here to day if not for therapy throughout the years. I know this to be true in my case despite my thinking at times that therapy is "useless". It isn't a magic bullet, but something magical happens between sessions where the subconscious seems to be altering and shifting. This is particularly so when you leave therapy and all the new knowledge you have "beds in". But you have to engage. I find that therapy requires work on the part of the client. In fact, all the work is done by the client and that can make it feel as though the therapist is redundant. However I find that they play a crucial part as they are a neutral witness to my story and good ones gently challenge me when my perception may be "off".

You say that many of your relatives suffered with binge eating. This was one of my problems and I find that the right therapy can really help with this. Your relatives may well have seemed happy (sugar does give you a high) but the feeling of being out of control around food can be hell. Also, when you give up the binge eating you are left with the residual symptoms of the trauma that propelled it. No amount of therapy can make what happened to you go away, which I think is what I secretly hoped for when I started therapy. I thought that my brain would be zapped and memories of trauma would disappear. Unfortunately, the trauma will always be with me in some way, but it won't destroy me, although it could have if I hadn't received counselling.

I have had very expensive therapeutic treatment for my binge eating and I have to say that it has worked. It was money very well spent. I am not obese but became slightly overweight as a result of the treatment, but can happily say that my weight is slowly and naturally adjusting.

None of your friends will be able to sit and consistently listen to you tell your story. And they shouldn't. Especially not if it involves deep trauma. Perhaps the testimony to therapy is what people consistently say about me: they say that I am calm, sensitive and that they love being around me.

My main beef with therapy is that good treatment is so expensive and I just wish it was available to everyone who wants it.

Yeah, sweeping generalisations with no distinctions made between different types of "therapy" or therapist.
The very attitude that guilts people out of seeking help, as if it's a quick chat with your pet should suffice.

I think it is completely unfair to expect family or friends to carry the burden to be your sympathetic ear.
if you lean to heavily it will have an impact on their mental health and life, and they are connected to you so cannot just distance and switch off after the chat.

Yabu. But with a caveat- it has to be a decent therapist.

I went to one I was referred to by my GP (for pre natal depression) and she just trotted out trite platitudes like "I'm sure it will all be fine"

But then with severe PND I was referred to a psychologist and she was amazing and helped me find the insight to see how my (now ex) abuse was at the root of my mental health and helped me find the strength to get out

And then when DH and I were struggling with my ex and his continued abuse his work paid for a therapist who we now pay for ourselves, and she's very good and switched on and I always come away feeling like I have gained some insight or perspective or just even offloaded in a safe way.

I see paying for a decent therapist now as important as my gym membership or healthy eating

Thank you for reminding us of this. I didn't think about this when I posted a reply.

@CattyCattle it's my 'naval gazing' over my childhood that led me to understand why I am the way I am. I had so many penny dropping moments it was unbelievable. In fact it was a million pounds worth of pennies raining down on me from a great height. It was so freeing. Like I'd spent my whole life underwater. And definitely not something I would describe as naval gazing.

I know because they told me. These are people I was close to for 30-40 years! We might have gone 10 years between conversations specifically about the holocaust and how to cope with the memories, but still that added up to a lot of conversations with a lot of different individuals over that time

You are definitely wrong

I also agree that many (most) people are carrying things that they can't easily burden their friends /family with

If you think this is what therapy is, then you’ve got bigger problems!

Exactly this.

Some of the famaging beliefs on this thread are why so many children end up needing therapy.

How convenient to think therapy is the problem.

Is it?

I wanted to train as a therapist, but it appears to be so difficult to find paying clients and make money from it, that I didn't bother pursuing.

@Market1 You might find it interesting to read the books of Edith Eger - she is a holocaust survivor who became a therapist precisely because she saw the benefits of it.

And her books are amazing anyway and I would say a good addition to therapy) alternative to if for those who can't afford it.