I voted for Brexit ‘I voted for Brexit and was told it wouldn’t affect expats – now I can’t live in my £13,000 Italian house’

[OhNoOhNo]

Struggling to work up any sympathy…

https://inews.co.uk/news/world/brexit-voted-wouldnt-affect-expats-cant-live-italian-house-2508493?utm_source=flipboard&utm_content=paulchown%2Fmagazine%2FBrexit+Reality+

Ah yes, the good old 'this is not the brexit I voted for', yet you would vote for it again, why? What are the benefits?

I believe you. I don't think you're a troll just on a wind up about how great brexit is. The scales fell from my eyes ages ago on this. Leave voters will NEVER change their minds about brexit, it doesn't matter how much damage it does. There's a big overlap between Leave voters, anti vaxxers, climate change deniers and flat earthers and no amount of evidence will change their opinions. The thing that gets me most about these people though is the arrogance. I'm just an ordinary person, I can't imagine, even for a minute, thinking I know better than the vast majority of nobel prize winning economists, or climate scientists, or historians on Ireland, or constitutional experts, about their subject.

Do tell us, how would it have been implemented better?

Oh dear, a that's not my Brexit - what did your Brexit look like @HaveToHideAsAnon ? And who did you think could implement it? The buffoons leading the Vote Leave campaign?

^this 100% .... Very few people have the humility to admit they were wrong, despite the evidence.... whatever the subject.

If Brexit had been a roaring success, i doubt too many remainers would be falling over themselves to say they were wrong either.... i'd like to think i would but i also can't be sure.

I'm not an anti vaxxer, climate change denier or flat earther!!! :)

I also am not arrogant. I don't think I know better than people. I'd love to sit and chat with experts on both sides, understand more. I've also listened extensively to a lot of remain arguments and understand this position and why many people voted this way (since that is what I'm exposed to as I don't know anyone on the brexit side), though I'm sure there are many arguments I haven't heard, but I'd gladly listen to more and try and understand more.

My observation is that some people (not all I'm sure) that are remain, appear to have quite a negative opinion of those that voted for brexit and a judgemental attitude which is not only sad, but it means those of us that did vote brexit cannot talk about it. We are made to feel stupid and ashamed. We are lumped in with other ostracised groups that are also ridiculed and looked down on. If we want to change people's opinions we need to hear them and discuss them, not force people into silence and make them feel like fools.

So @HaveToHideAsAnon what are the benefits of Brexit then?

If we want to change people's opinions we need to hear them and discuss them, not force people into silence and make them feel like fools.

Go on then, why did you vote Leave and what are the benfits of Brexit

But what did you think you were voting for and how could it actually be achieved @HaveToHideAsAnon? Where was the evidence that you were voting for a set list of changes, as defined by an independent source that actually had the power to deliver what was suggested?

You were basically voting for the contents of a sealed box, which wouldn't be opened until after you had made your decision. It could have been free unicorns for everyone, or a rusty nail, no-one could say.

One good analogy I heard at the time was that all the different EU member states were like children, who'd all been given different colour lego bricks. The children then played together happily for some time until one of them had to go home, at which point the child stood up and said 'my lego bricks are the white ones, and I want all them back now'.

I would like a leave voter to explain why they voted leave. Specific reasons relating to trade, public services, the economy. Why and how would a lengthy leaving process result in a better outcome?
I would really like to understand because I honestly can't think of a single positive outcome.

Well it’s not surprising that leavers are “made to feel stupid and ashamed” - making a stupid decision which has only had negative impacts is absolutely something to be ashamed about. Didn’t make anything better for anyone, just enabled an idiocracy to take power, weakened the UK and weakened our economy.

Almost everyone I know who voted leave is a full on raging racist, maybe you're lucky you don't know Leave voters, the negative opinion Remain voters have of Leavers didn't come from nowhere.

I predict @HaveToHideAsAnon will flounce off in a minute, without supplying any of their well reasoned and stand up to scrutiny arguments in favour of brexit.

But everything including the governments response to Covid was a result of Brexit. We would never have had the governments we’ve had post 2016, without the Brexit vote.

Well I have in the past, under a different username, given my opinions on the benefits that there could be, of a brexit well managed.

However, I was a bit if a lone figure. People piled in to ridicule me, shout me down, tell me how stupid I am, make all kinds of unfounded assumptions about me (from being a racist to an anti-vaxxer) and call me a troll. So I've learnt to not comment. To keep my username anonymous and to never ever speak about my views in real life. The only person I feel able to discuss my opinions (on what, IMO, the benefits of a well managed brexit could be) with, is my husband. It makes me sad that this how society is really.

I bet if we could turn the clock back, but give the bloke in the OP knowledge of how things would unfold, he would 100% vote Leave again, and then be completely bewildered as to why he still can't just move easily to Italy.

So much for If we want to change people's opinions we need to hear them and discuss them, then.

So tell us about the benefits of a well managed Brexit, how it could be achieved and to what timescale?

No flouncing here. I'm not a flouncer :) Why would you assume that?

No-one has been particularly welcoming and non judgemental towards me, so I could understand why someone of my view might want to flounce off. But I am not keen to live up to your impression of me. So I will leave when I feel like going to sleep (which might actually be soon as the eye lids are drooping!) I will not flounce! I will leave gracefully (it's a shame our government flounced out, rather than leaving Europe a little more gracefully, but there we go!)

Does it not give you any pause for thought at all, that you feel you can't tell anyone you voted leave because they'd think you were thick?

What were/ are the benefits of Brexit to the NHS? Or even just one benefit?

So we have yet another Leave voter who can't tell us what the benefits are.

Sure! I question myself all the time. I've felt pretty low once or twice when I've done a bit too much over thinking and wondered if I truly am a waste of space. Then I remember that actually I have some strengths. I'm kind, loyal, caring and friendly (in real life). I remember, when I pause to think, that it's pretty unpleasant of people to call others thick, to judge them based on nothing but a political.opinion, to shout them down without really hearing them. I also remind myself that intelligence isn't really a concept well understood or necessarily something to be revered.

As it happens, as far as 'intelligence' goes, I was once a member of mensa! It got me a job I needed at the time, and then I left. I have an IQ of 155 which apparantly, as far as an objective measure of 'intelligence' is concerned means I'm not 'thick". However, 'intelligence isn't really to me, all about a number or a measure on some test. I have little confidence (perhaps if I am truly honest, that's a second reason I joined MENSA for a year, in addition to it helping me secure a job, I wanted to prove something to myself), I can be quite an anxious person, I clearly don't hold the mainstream view on some topics (brexit being the main one), I lack common sense and I am not always very assertive. So I do think in some ways I am thick.

I don't know if that's the answer you were after kendodd. If I am your definition of thick, then I guess I'm thick. Not sure how calling me that helps anything though.

Well that's all lovely, but please tell us about the benefits of Brexit that you voted for.

We're all waiting.

Ok, well I think it's been about 50 minutes since kendodd predicted I would 'flounce off in a minute'. I'm quite tired now so am heading off to bed and therefore leaving the thread. Not flouncing (though I quite like the visual I'm getting around that!! Maybe I will try a flounce down the hall 🤣. Hec, what's wrong with a good flounce anyway!!? Yeah what the hell, here i go...flouncing! That's a great word isn't it? Flounce!... 🤣 Bring on the flouncing I say!!)