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Original poster

Is DDs ex being unfair

470 replies

warpeacelove · 18/07/2023 16:19

Hi,
So I'm not sure if I am being biased and just worried about DD. DD is 21, just graduated uni, she has a job lined up for September (civil service grad scheme). She is usually a very smart, logical, loving girl.
She came home last week, distraught, she and her boyfriend of a year and a half had broken up, didn't want to talk about why and I didn't pry.
Last night she was extremely quiet, had been out in the afternoon, didn't want dinner etc.
This morning she came into my room, 5am sobbing, DH took himself to the guest room and she told me is 12 weeks pregnant, she went to her scan yesterday alone etc. She told me she had done a pregnancy test last week but didn't think she was as far along, her periods are irregular, she has the implant etc. She then said that her ex has blocked her everywhere, she doesn't want their mutual friends to get involved so could I message him and say its important.
He eventually replied, and it turned out DD has failed to give me really important information, she cheated on him, DD has now told me it happened once, on a holiday 4 weeks ago with one of her uni societies , there is no way the baby's dad is anyone other than her ex.
He is refusing to hear DD, I ended up having to tell him on a phone call that DD is pregnant to which he said "probably not mine and If it is I don't care".
Now I know DD messed up badly, she shouldn't have cheated but right now she clearly needs support. We live in the North West she studied in and in theory will be working in London, so if she goes back for the job she will have no support at all. I ended up calling in sick to my own work as DD was so upset I couldn't leave her alone, she has spent all day sad in bed.
She doesn't want an abortion, also doesn't want to do it totally alone, doesn't expect her ex to forgive her or get back together but atleast be there for his child.
I'm trying to convince her to just stay at home, give the job up, DH and I can support her for a year or two, then she can find something locally and we can support her. She isn't convinced, doesn't think there will be many jobs her Politics and Economics degree will be useful for in the rural north west (was thinking maybe local council or similar).
Is DDs ex being unnecessarily unfair? Or does DD deserve all she is getting, she did cheat after all!!
I'm terrified for her so goodness knows how awful she will be feeling!!

OP posts:
BadNomad · 18/07/2023 18:21

12 weeks pregnant means she conceived around 10 weeks ago. It is unlikely she would have known she was pregnant in Greece 2 months ago.

Flopsythebunny · 18/07/2023 18:21

MrsRobinsonsHandprints · 18/07/2023 16:54

Also fetal alcohol syndrome is a worry if she has been drinking as heavily as you say.

This is true. My sister has a child with this condition as well as spina bifida. She still denies that her drinking in the early months caused it despite the hospital saying it is.

WhatWhereWho · 18/07/2023 18:21

warpeacelove · 18/07/2023 16:19

Hi,
So I'm not sure if I am being biased and just worried about DD. DD is 21, just graduated uni, she has a job lined up for September (civil service grad scheme). She is usually a very smart, logical, loving girl.
She came home last week, distraught, she and her boyfriend of a year and a half had broken up, didn't want to talk about why and I didn't pry.
Last night she was extremely quiet, had been out in the afternoon, didn't want dinner etc.
This morning she came into my room, 5am sobbing, DH took himself to the guest room and she told me is 12 weeks pregnant, she went to her scan yesterday alone etc. She told me she had done a pregnancy test last week but didn't think she was as far along, her periods are irregular, she has the implant etc. She then said that her ex has blocked her everywhere, she doesn't want their mutual friends to get involved so could I message him and say its important.
He eventually replied, and it turned out DD has failed to give me really important information, she cheated on him, DD has now told me it happened once, on a holiday 4 weeks ago with one of her uni societies , there is no way the baby's dad is anyone other than her ex.
He is refusing to hear DD, I ended up having to tell him on a phone call that DD is pregnant to which he said "probably not mine and If it is I don't care".
Now I know DD messed up badly, she shouldn't have cheated but right now she clearly needs support. We live in the North West she studied in and in theory will be working in London, so if she goes back for the job she will have no support at all. I ended up calling in sick to my own work as DD was so upset I couldn't leave her alone, she has spent all day sad in bed.
She doesn't want an abortion, also doesn't want to do it totally alone, doesn't expect her ex to forgive her or get back together but atleast be there for his child.
I'm trying to convince her to just stay at home, give the job up, DH and I can support her for a year or two, then she can find something locally and we can support her. She isn't convinced, doesn't think there will be many jobs her Politics and Economics degree will be useful for in the rural north west (was thinking maybe local council or similar).
Is DDs ex being unnecessarily unfair? Or does DD deserve all she is getting, she did cheat after all!!
I'm terrified for her so goodness knows how awful she will be feeling!!

No her ex is not being unreasonable in not wanting to support her or be there for her. He's hurt and angry because she cheated, which is understandable. However, if it turns out to be his he of course has a responsibility to the child. However, getting proper medical advice now would seem to be the priority and deciding what she wants to do. What's in her best interests too. People mess up all the time.

"Or does DD deserve all she is getting, she did cheat after all!!"

I do not know why anyone claiming to be a concerned parent would say that. Makes it seem less likely to be genuine.

ThinWomansBrain · 18/07/2023 18:21

At 21 she is an adult and the choice is hers to make.

If so adult, maybe she should stop lying, sleeping around, drinking heavily while pregnant, and behaving like a stroppy teenager in 'refusing' to speak to OP.

JellyBeanFactory · 18/07/2023 18:22

I wonder if she really is pregnant? Could this be a ruse to get boyfriend back?

HowcanIhelp123 · 18/07/2023 18:25

BadNomad · 18/07/2023 18:21

12 weeks pregnant means she conceived around 10 weeks ago. It is unlikely she would have known she was pregnant in Greece 2 months ago.

Tests can work from 9dpo. If she conceived 10 weeks ago, period would have been expected 8 weeks ago. She could have been a couple days late when heading to greece and did a test.

We don't have dates. Greece a couple months ago could be 7/8 weeks ago. Lots of people have their '12 week scan' at 13 weeks.

Unexpecteddrivinginstructor · 18/07/2023 18:27

I would definitely look into foetal alcohol syndrome, it can't be detected before birth and is associated with substantial learning disabilities.

DMLady · 18/07/2023 18:28

ReachForTheMars · 18/07/2023 17:20

I think she needs a hug and to be told that you understand kids are messy and she is your daughter and you're going to be there but she needs to tell you what being there means to her.

She needs to decide of she is having a baby and where she is raising it.. That means staying near you and halting the career or ploughing on (with no realistic concept of what that looks like).

My advice to you, is say nothing, be a listening ear, and answer questions as realistically as you can (like about how much financial/practical support you can offer). But do not do.or say anything that lends itself to her re-writing history as you pushing her into a decision.

This!

Workquestion11 · 18/07/2023 18:29

Twilight7777 · 18/07/2023 17:00

She’s lying to you again, no one would get a 12 week scan that quickly in our current failing NHS.

I have done, more than once
So the daughter isn't necessarily lying

MammaTo · 18/07/2023 18:30

I think I’d be getting her to think about her choices long term. An abortion may seem like a terrible thing in the short term but a baby is going to be there for the rest of her life. She sounds like she has great prospects within her degree and line of work - her life’s only just beginning.

HowcanIhelp123 · 18/07/2023 18:30

Her drinking and drugs does not mean baby has definitely been harmed. Some people don't know they're pregnant and binge drink and have a healthy baby, others drink less than them and have an affected baby. Because we don't know exactly why some babies are affected and some not we don't know a safe level so zero alcohol is advised. Every drink and drug taking increases risk so if she is serious about keeping the baby she doesn't touch another drop of alcohol or a single molecule of drug. And she tells the professionals and lets them work out the risk and monitor, not listen to mumsnetters saying the baby is 100% destroyed.

landbeforegrime · 18/07/2023 18:30

i'm really sorry OP. you must be having a horrible time. if your daughter really has been drinking to excess and using cocaine knowingly pregnant and yet wants to keep the baby then on this front she sounds like an incredibly selfish and immature person. that's before the cheating (and lying) gets thrown in the mix. i get the whole her body, her choice, but if her ex partner is the father he is potentially on the hook financially for this child until they turn 18. why should he want anything to do with her, or the child, when she has behaved terribly and he no doubt does not want to be connected to her in any way shape or form for the rest of his life. if he were my son my view of your daughter would be so incredibly low and i would be supporting him in his decision to have absolutely nothing to do with this mess. what if her drinking has caused additional needs and this poor child is born with foetal alcohol syndrome etc. She is not ready to be a parent on so many levels and whilst you don't need to tell her to have an abortion/have the child adopted, I am not sure why she should expect your support just because she is your child. She is an adult and has acted terribly. The idea of not wanting an abortion is up to her, but why - what is she bringing a child into the world for when they won't have a loving father and quite probably (and understandably) their existence will be resented? She is being selfish again in this decision - no one "wants" to have an abortion but some people realise it's for the best so put themselves through it because they don't think they are the only person who matters.

SlightlygrumpyBettyswaitress · 18/07/2023 18:32

Well. She can still do the grad scheme. Civil service can't discriminate. If she is determined to do it. She needs to plan accommodation, maternity leave and then nursery.

Original poster
warpeacelove · 18/07/2023 18:32

I've had a chat with DD. I showed her the message from her ex, she was understandably angry with me but said she was willing to talk.

Her story of events is

  • In feb she remembers going out using cocaine and drinking, she woke up in bed with another lad, neither remember if they actually slept together, she says she thinks they didn't but told her bf anyway, he believed her and they moved on.
  • She missed her period and thought maybe she could be pregnant but wasn't sure, sent her ex the message, his response was "not sure, wouldn't you just abort, why?", fearing it could end her relationship and with exams going on, she just left it, her periods used to irregular she hoped it was that again.
  • Went to Greece, cheated, intended to tell him when she got back but the other guy bet her to it.
  • Came home, still no period, got a test a the Friday before last, freaked out and ignored it for a few days. On Wednesday she googled a private clinic near us, got an appointment, she showed me some leaflets from them etc.
She swears other than potentially in feb, and greece she hasn't slept with anyone else. She kept drinking as she was sure she would have an abortion, just wanted a scan first to make sure. Now she is saying she's spoken to some friends and might still have an abortion. I wanted to ask more, but she got upset and told me she was going a drive. I told her we will support her no matter what, but she has to be honest and I need time to process everything, as will her ex right now.
OP posts:
DogsDinner · 18/07/2023 18:33

I don’t think you should have gone behind your daughter’s back badmouthing her to her ex. And then to take everything he says as gospel. I’d find it hard to forgive you for that if I was your daughter.

And I don’t know why the ex is being painted as the righteous hero on this thread. Even if the baby is his, he intends to wash his hands of it. Yeah, great!

I think the best thing you can do is to continue to offer your daughter support, and not try and talk her into any particular course of action.

A baby at 21, with parental support is really not the end of the world.

AvanGelist · 18/07/2023 18:34

HowcanIhelp123 · 18/07/2023 18:30

Her drinking and drugs does not mean baby has definitely been harmed. Some people don't know they're pregnant and binge drink and have a healthy baby, others drink less than them and have an affected baby. Because we don't know exactly why some babies are affected and some not we don't know a safe level so zero alcohol is advised. Every drink and drug taking increases risk so if she is serious about keeping the baby she doesn't touch another drop of alcohol or a single molecule of drug. And she tells the professionals and lets them work out the risk and monitor, not listen to mumsnetters saying the baby is 100% destroyed.

You're not great at statistics are you?
Nobody has said '100% destroyed', but an elevated risk.
It's up to her if she wants to take the chance, with the risk worked out by professionals but she should be aware.

In any case, any child can be born disabled. Nobody should be a parent unless they are mentally prepared for any eventuality..
Including that.

landbeforegrime · 18/07/2023 18:34

Workquestion11 · 18/07/2023 18:29

I have done, more than once
So the daughter isn't necessarily lying

Show quote history

recently? in the north west? can also confirm that maternity services in the NW are rammed. i'm 31 weeks and scans are constantly being delayed, appointments cancelled and the time frame for appointments not followed. 3 years ago it was not like this at all. it was fine then but things have changed a lot since then.

LilacOrange · 18/07/2023 18:35

hiding5675687 · 18/07/2023 18:08

Someone needs to look at the legal protections of the grad scheme to see if she can take maternity leave or defer. If not she should contact them to see if it is an option. Then she will know if this is still an option.

I'm sorry I've not read the whole thread but I was able to defer the same Graduate Scheme due to pregnancy. This might be good as this would give your DD time to understand if she could make the job work and if thats what she would want.

Additionally, it is possible to ask for a relocation restriction if you have extenuating circumstances (e.g. single parent / caring responsibilities etc). Not sure where you are based but quite a lot of roles in the North West and there is a lot of hybrid working in the CS now. She could also apply for part time working for a year or two - I was able to do 4 days per week at the Line Manager's discretion. I am not sure if this would vary depending on her stream (I.e. if she was going to do a specialism) but she could potentially ask to transfer to the Generalist Scheme as I believe this would offer the most flexibility.

I understand there is a lot to work through for her (and you) on this but it may help her feel better if she knows the job opportunity isn't necessarily fully closed off to her if she continues with the pregnancy - thought ofc it won't be easy and it is a demanding development scheme so worth considering that side too.

thatsnotmylifeitstoocrazy · 18/07/2023 18:35

DogsDinner · 18/07/2023 18:33

I don’t think you should have gone behind your daughter’s back badmouthing her to her ex. And then to take everything he says as gospel. I’d find it hard to forgive you for that if I was your daughter.

And I don’t know why the ex is being painted as the righteous hero on this thread. Even if the baby is his, he intends to wash his hands of it. Yeah, great!

I think the best thing you can do is to continue to offer your daughter support, and not try and talk her into any particular course of action.

A baby at 21, with parental support is really not the end of the world.

Its not the end of the world but will change this young woman’s life massively.

hopeishere · 18/07/2023 18:36

I think she should have a termination for a number of reasons - she's obviously still young and wants to live a life.

Possible foetal alcohol syndrome and taking cocaine in early pregnancy.

BadNomad · 18/07/2023 18:36

HowcanIhelp123 · 18/07/2023 18:25

Tests can work from 9dpo. If she conceived 10 weeks ago, period would have been expected 8 weeks ago. She could have been a couple days late when heading to greece and did a test.

We don't have dates. Greece a couple months ago could be 7/8 weeks ago. Lots of people have their '12 week scan' at 13 weeks.

Show quote history

So she finds out she's pregnant, then goes on holiday where she drinks and take drugs, cheats on her boyfriend a month later, plans to move to London to start her career...all while knowing she's pregnant and planning to keep it?

Hotpinkangel19 · 18/07/2023 18:36

DogsDinner · 18/07/2023 18:33

I don’t think you should have gone behind your daughter’s back badmouthing her to her ex. And then to take everything he says as gospel. I’d find it hard to forgive you for that if I was your daughter.

And I don’t know why the ex is being painted as the righteous hero on this thread. Even if the baby is his, he intends to wash his hands of it. Yeah, great!

I think the best thing you can do is to continue to offer your daughter support, and not try and talk her into any particular course of action.

A baby at 21, with parental support is really not the end of the world.

It's not the end of the world. She's 21. I was 21 when I found out i was pregnant. My daughter is 17 now. My parents were lovely, obviously disappointed and talked through my options with me, but never pressured me. I'll always be grateful for that.

Newjobformoremoney · 18/07/2023 18:37

Hi OP
I wish you and your daughter all the best. I fell pregnant when I wasn't ready, and though having an abortion was horrendous, it was the right decision. I now have a DD when I was ready for it, and it's been the best experience of my life.
Whatever she decides it won't be easy.
And honestly, the drugs and drinking while in uni are behind her. Lots of people experiment
I hope you find the right outcome for all of you

AlanJohnsonsBeemer · 18/07/2023 18:37

You sound like a lovely mum OP, your DD has been incredibly silly on various fronts and she is very lucky to have you to support her. I had a baby at 21 and it has all worked out fine, in the end. However now my beloved baby is 21, if they were in this situation and asked my advice it would be to terminate.

Clymene · 18/07/2023 18:38

I'm another one in the termination camp. She thought she might be pregnant and her reaction was to not do a test but to carry on partying. She's pretty much giving every sign that she doesn't want a baby or to be in a relationship with her ex.

If she has a termination, she can put this whole unfortunate chapter behind her and start her new career that she's worked so hard for.