Child maintenance one night stand

[Roses121]

I got pregnant from a one night stand 2 years ago. I was 19 at the time and he was 35. Wasn’t really thinking straight and although we used contraception I ended up pregnant.

I made the decision to keep my baby and knew full well I would be raising him on my own. I didn’t want a relationship with him.
I didn’t have any expectations for his father although he said he wanted to be in his life and has been.

My son has never stayed overnight with him as he’s breastfed (16 months now), so we’ve only ever met at public places as I would feel a bit weird having him at my place and vice versa.
When we met I was aware that he had kids (2) and he told me he had split from his ex 3 years prior. Looking back now, it’s possible he lied about the last part just to get me in to bed.
I have not met her or their kids or anyone from his family and vice versa. Contact is not that often, maybe once or twice a month.

I am starting uni in September and will have less money since I’ll have to take on less hours at work. Up until this point I have never asked him for money nor has he offered but after looking at the child maintenance calculator I think my son is entitled to 300-400 monthly.

I know that legally a man is obliged to pay this but morally speaking, would it be wrong to put in a claim since we didn’t plan the baby? Also I will add that although he was shocked when I told him I was pregnant, as was I, he never said ‘I don’t want it.’ I think it’s likely that he pays for his other kids, whether he is in a relationship with her or not, so I think it’s unfair on my son to get nothing but I’m also aware if I do claim it then he’ll have less money for his other kids so I feel a bit bad about that.
I don’t know his salary but Googling average incomes for his job are between 30-50k hence why it estimates 300-400, he is also currently building a house in another country so I know he’s not broke if you get me.

Hope this all make sense x

@CakeyBakeyHeart

Two scenarios for you...

What about a man who says he wants a baby, is fully on board during pregnancy then decides when it's born that he wants nothing to do with it? Should he be allowed to make the choice to walk away with no financial obligation to his child? Is it 'morally wrong' of the mother to pursue child maintenance payments from that man even though they both decided to have the baby? How can the legal system prove or disprove that the man was a willing participant up to a certain point?

What about a man who says he wants a baby, is fully on board until 8 months into the pregnancy then decides he wants nothing to do with the child? Should he be allowed to make the choice to walk away with no financial obligation to his child? Is it 'morally wrong' of the mother to pursue child maintenance payments from that man even though they both decided to have the baby? How can the legal system prove or disprove that the man was a willing participant up to a certain point?

How would your moral standpoint on this work in reality?

Why should two adults not have equal choices?

His equal choices only extend to his body.

His choice is to have sex. Knowing there is always a risk if pregnancy. Also knowing that he doesn't get to decide if a woman continues or ends a pregnancy.

Nor does he get to attend the birth or decide what sort of pain relief is used.

You sound like some kind of incel.

Do you think men should be able to force women to continue a pregnancy? Or that they can withdraw consent for the pregnancy at some stage?

@Roses121 ,

I am not concerned for your son per se. I am concerned about you.

I know a million posters will say that’s not okay but really why is choice only one way!

If you realise that your opinion is probably that of a only small minority, could it be that it's, ya know, wrong?

Okay so I’m intrigued as to whether you genuinely disagree with what I’m asserting or simply don’t understand it. Here we are in the format of an equation:

My assertion is that if -

Decision on whether to keep an unplanned baby = A (does man want baby) + B (does woman want baby) + C (adjustment for all factors relating to ethics) + D (adjustment for all factors relating to biological difference e.g. medical risks of abortion, emotional and physical costs/risks of carrying a baby to term)

and you then remove C and D from the equation you should have a choice where A and B are given equal weight.

Refute at your leisure! (noting that things like do I have financial means, does my existing child want a sibling etc. all fit in to A or B category)

and you then remove C and D from the equation you should have a choice where A and B are given equal weight.

But why do you remove these? They are crucial to decision making.

Eh?
You think that if someone has the temerity to disagree with you, then they haven't understood your point?

This situation is not a formal proof of logic, and doesn't boil down to being mechanically verifiable. I don't agree with your axioms in any case.

Decision on whether or not to keep an unplanned baby ≠ A+B . A&B should not be given equal weight.

Decision on whether or not to keep an unplanned baby = A.

Sorry, B!

@CakeyBakeyHeart

Do you always make decisions like this?

I would just go to CSA and apply tbh. He will soon show his true colours. He is a grown man and knows he can't have his cake and eat it.

CakeyBakey can be as 'intrigued' as they like as they wilfully miss the point: a man can't order a woman to have a medical procedure (terminate a pregnancy), end of. Just as they can't order a woman to continue a pregnancy (up to the point where abortions are legally allowed); women aren't property.

Men do have choices; they are exercised up to the point of conception where they have a myriad of options to prevent pregnancy. And yes, they have to accept that sometimes those prevention techniques don't work. So yes, they have to accept that at that point, should a pregnancy occur, the woman gets to make the final choice in the long line of choices they both had.

You have a lot of support on here OP.
I just hope you have realised that even with all the support, sleeping with men almost double your age that you've admitted you do not even know is not the responsible thing to do at 19, 29 or any age. One can only hope you have learned from this experience and will think more wisely when choosing who will potentially father your children in the future. Obviously he's not looking like he's going to be the best dad or role model to your child and you've said you decided to keep the baby but didn't want to be romantically involved even though he said he would support you (most probably just with a relationship from you I guess!) He used protection that we are led to believe is approximately 97/98% effective, topped with the Ella morning after pill which they claim to be 98% effective which failed for you too. It's obvious, though I'm sure you wouldn't change your son for the world that making a baby wasn't in the forefront of either of your minds that night. I think you need to be a little more cautious when choosing your one night stands and possible fathers for your children.

Well done on Uni! 👏🏼

I would guess a lot more people would agree that the man is entitled to have a DNA test - to check whether the child is (technically speaking) "his". OP and he don't know each other well enough for him to know whether he can trust her enough to take her word for it that the child is his. I've certainly got a male friend that told me one time that he'd been going out with a woman for some weeks and she came to him and told him she was pregnant and he must support her decision to have/keep the child. At which point he turned round to her and, perfectly truthfully, told her it was literally impossible for it to be his child - as he'd been sterilised some time before (in case of precisely this scenario coming up). At that point she had to admit it was another man she'd been seeing on the side that was the father and that was the end of that as far as my friend was concerned and he was not at all happy she'd tried that on with him (as he knew a bit about the other man, I gather, and she seemed to have chosen to try and pin the "fatherhood" on him because he was the better financial bet out of the two of the men).

It’s astounding that he hasn’t once put his hands in his pocket for his son! Well done for making the claim, absolutely the right thing to do.

Wishing you all the best for your time at uni.

Going to make this my last post on this thread as it’s probably getting a bit boring for everyone. If as stated you were to remove C and D they need to go on the left side of the equation, not disappear to give an assertion I’ve not made. I don’t believe an temerity was used on my part in suggesting you didn’t understand 🙂

I've certainly got a male friend

I bet you have, Eliza.

But ok. DNA tests are usually demanded to insult the mother and hinder the process rather than because there's serious doubt, but ok. Sometimes women are dishonest and a man has a right to be sure.

Having established that it's yours, why should a man be exempt from all responsibility for his own child just because he couldn't force a woman to have an abortion? If you want to be 100% certain of not having a child, you do what a woman who is 100% certain of not having a child or an abortion does, and you abstain.

Once she's pregnant, nothing will be consequence free, whatever she chooses. Why does the mother and the state owe men risk and consequence free sex?

Going to make this my last post on this thread as it’s probably getting a bit boring for everyone. If as stated you were to remove C and D they need to go on the left side of the equation, not disappear to give an assertion I’ve not made. I don’t believe an temerity was used on my part in suggesting you didn’t understand 🙂

" The Left Side " ? What does that imply?

You get that people who are not maths fluent have sex and get pregnant?

Posters arguing that a man should have no responsibility if he took precautions and the woman refused an abortion are making a categorical mistake. A child isn’t a contract that’s negotiated between the parents. It’s a human being with its own rights. In our society, a child has a right to support from both parents, regardless of how it was conceived or what medical procedures the father wanted the mother to have.

It’s really not for the mother to refuse maintenance—the child has a right to it.

Sheesh.

I think you need to reread what we both wrote.
I wasn't critiquing your equation; I was dismissing it entirely as pointless and wrong.

Human situations can't be reduced to such terms.

@ElizaAgainn

I would guess a lot more people would agree that the man is entitled to have a DNA test - to check whether the child is (technically speaking) "his". OP and he don't know each other well enough for him to know whether he can trust her enough to take her word for it that the child is his.

I think it's fine for anyone to want a DNA test.

The fact is that this particular man was happy to take her word for it that the child was his without a test, happy to start and build a relationship with the child without a test... then immediately demanded a test when asked to actually make a contribution towards the child he previously believed was his and had started and build a relationship with.

I personally think he's a wanker for only being bothered about whether the child is his when he's asked to put his hand in his pocket. The thought of the emotional effects on a child of thinking the wrong person was their dad etc didn't weigh on him before. He just doesn't want to have to pay towards the child.

With that in mind, plus the fact he was shagging teenagers in his mid thirties, he's hardly a victim in all this is he?

This thread! 😂😂

<plays sad song on world's smallest violin for the poor menz>

You're doing everything right, OP, hold your nerve. If this man isn't playing ball then don't meet up with him and pursue your claim through the CSA channels.
He's so cheeky to try to be some sort of paternal presence, but contribute nothing to his son's upkeep. And then question if he is indeed, the father.

Good luck with your uni course.

I* wasn't critiquing your equation; I was dismissing it entirely as pointless and wrong.

Human situations can't be reduced to such terms.*

100% 👍🏻

why men don’t get as much control over their dna

Both have choice to have sex or not. Man chooses to release his dna into woman or not.

both have choice to use contraception or not. Women gets full decision making on any hormonal birth control because it is her body. Man can take steps to prevent dna from entering woman’s body.

if a pregnancy occurs, while that pregnancy is inside a woman’s body she is the only one who can make any decisions. Man has no control over his dna.

if a baby is born, baby now has rights and control of own dna. Neither man nor woman has any control over dna anymore.

the man doesn’t get as much control over his dna because it is either inside the woman or it built a baby unless he decides to release it elsewhere.

That’s just about the most judgemental remark I’ve seen for a while! I’m sure the intelligent, sensible OP is well able to make her own decisions about any relationships she may have in the future.

That’s just about the most judgemental remark I’ve seen for a while! I’m sure the intelligent, sensible OP is well able to make her own decisions about any relationships she may have in the future.

Yep I'm sure this intelligent young woman bringing up her child as a single parent needs telling that. 🙄