A Baby..is this the beginning of the end?

[HiLee19]

Basically been together with my DH for 14 years, 4 years married.
Before marriage I was always open that I don’t foresee myself having kids, it’s just not something I ever longed for. My husband was undecided at that point but didn’t mind. So in the recent year he has started pestering me about having a baby, yesterday we got into a heated argument about it and he threatened to divorce if we are not gonna try to a baby. The issue is I have no excuse NOT to have a kid. We have a great set-up; a huge house, cars holidays, very busy social life both, DH is a high earner, my income is 65k and with a potential promotion could significantly increase. He is happy for me to be a SAHM but it’s not something I would consider, as I like my financial independence but the option is there if I want it.
Also we have the best relationship, we barely ever argue that why I’m a bit shaken by the argument we had last night. We have everything to give the best life to a child but my biggest worry is that this all will end once we have a child. We have some friends who have kids and who are child free by choice, somehow the ones with kids their happiness have dramatically decline since having babies.
AIBU to think that my life will become miserable once we have a kid? I’m worried that I will start to resent DH, he is not very hands on with household, we have a clearer that comes 2x a month but the most cleaning and cooking is on me. Also at the moment I’m feeling like I’m getting pushed into having a kid but I don’t want to lose my DH. We met when we were in late teens I feel like we have matured and grown up together while building this amazing life together. I love my husband and would even consider to give him a child but I’m worried that will resent him and a baby. So basically is this the beginning of the end of this beautiful life we have built together. Unfortunately I don’t see any way out of it to please both sides. Any advice?

Because that's not what the OP is asking. She not looking for people to convince her that she might change her mind. She knows her mind. It sounds more like she needs people to tell her it's ok for her to feel the way she does. Which it is.

But it depends on whether she really doesn't want kids, or if she is still thinking that just out of habit / not knowing many happy people with kids.

I just think she owes it to her husband and their 14 years together to take some time to thoughtfully consider her true feelings and how they have or haven't shifted, in the context of a concrete life decision facing her right now as opposed to a statement in the abstract. I don't think that's pressuring her to have a baby.

I'm basing this on a lot of conversations I've had with 30-something friends where they've started out saying "I never want kids" and when you probe and really talk about it, it's often more complex than that. Not always, but often. People often use it as shorthand for "there are only a limited set of circumstances in which I'd consider it" and similar. In a situation like OP's it's worth examining whether that might be the case and if there are any ways to make those circumstances come true.

@Middlelanehogger What kind of limited set of circumstances could there be that are realistic and that you could actually control?

What if you want a child only if it doesn't negatively impact your career? It's unrealistic for people to say that's possible without also pointing out that it will cost an amount that is impossible for most people and/or damaging to the child.

No, he owes it to her to respect a decision she clearly communicated to him.

There is a difference between having a child and wanting a child. There may be a limited set of circumstances that would make it suitable to have a child, but that still doesn't mean she wants one. I think the OP has made it very clear she doesn't have nor has ever had the urge or desire for a child. It is not right for people to keep saying "But are you suuuuure? Are you sure that's what you really think? Maybe you only think you know."

No means no.
In sex and in childbearing.
Contrary to you absolute most of "no kids" around my in mid 30s meanno kids.

I don't probe though. Because I don't want them to feel like they have to come up with excuses. Because I hate when peopledo this "but why" game with me and my reproductive system.

@Middlelanehogger

This is the kind of crap I think a lot of people who choose to be child-free deal regularly. People who question our decisions and think they know better and that all they need to do is poke and prod at us before we come to the stunning realisation that actually we've always wanted children.

Imagine if a child-free person took the same attitude that you seem to have towards someone who wanted children. Started to poke and prod at their reasoning, trying to make them see that they really don't want children after all. There would be hell on-and rightly so-but people do this to child-free people all the time and think it's acceptable. Believe it or not, we know our own minds and if we do change our minds, it won't be because someone poked and prodded at us.

Why can't he respect their marriage and accept the fact that she doesn't want children? Why do you and he, in fact, expect her to be the one who examines her choice and makes the change? After all, it is he who is changing the dynamic of their relationship.

She has made it clear that she didn't want children. He was undecided but "fine either way." What does that suggest to you? He stated he was fine to not have kids. He's changed his mind and decided that no, kids are a dealbreaker. OP has not changed her mind.

It is fine that he has changed his mind and it's his right to leave the relationship if he is not getting what he wants from it. However, it's not fine to put it on OP and make her the bad guy. Does it sound reasonable to you that his attitude is "Give me a kid or I'll divorce you?"

Does that sound like a good basis to bring a child into the world? Through coercion? Threat? It doesn't to me. It's one to thing to acknowledge that this decision is a dealbreaker and could end their marriage if they can't agree. That's fine. It's not fine to pose it as a threat to manipulate your partner into doing what you want.

The reality is, it's obvious that he's setting OP as the fall guy for the demise of their marriage. Blatantly. He'll present her as the unreasonable one who just wouldn't, no matter what, give him the child he is so desperate for. No doubt he'll leave out the part where she's always been upfront with him about her lack of desire for kids and work it that she's denying him what he feels is rightfully his.

I am not saying that it's out of the realm of possibilities that people change their minds. Of course, they do. It's a massive decision either way. However, she hasn't changed her mind. So, she doesn't need a bunch of strangers on the internet trying to convince her that they, too, thought they would hate motherhood but they just love it so much and so will she.

How old are you? You've said you've been together 14 years and since you were teens, which tells me you might be early 30s.

If so, I would agree to park it for (say) 3 years. Tell your dh that right now if it's now or never it will be never, but that you are happy to see how you feel in 3 years. If you both still feel the same after 3 years, you can agree to part ways. He will have an opportunity to have children with someone else, he doesn't have the biological constraint.

I know a number of women who were happily child free (myself included) who decided they wanted dc after all in their late 30s. Some were able to have them, some were not. Right now you are having a good time in your relationship, it would be a shame to pack it in and decide in 3 years that you want dc after all. And if you don't, you'll have had another nice 3 years. If he is not willing to wait 3 years for you to decide whether you're ready, then he's not the partner you thought he was. Better to know that before you even contemplate having dc with him.

You don't need an excuse not to have a child , you don't want one , that's enough.

He's changed the goal posts in your marriage.

@CleverLilViper yes. Everything you said. Yes.

@CleverLilViper i often think what if i spoke to people about other of their life choices like their careers the way they spoke to me when i didn’t want kids. Tried to persuade them for exampld to work in my profession because i’m good at it and enjoy it.

They would rightly push back that perhaps they didn’t have the skills or inclination to work in my field! They might have other dreams and aspirations.

To which maybe I could take offence! Ask them if they think my profession is not a good one? If they think their profession is better? Maybe i’d get angry and tell them I think THEIR profession is only for rubbish selfish people with no moral fibre and all the best people would choose to be in my profession.

And of course the whole thing makes no sense at all. Because different people have different skills and desires which make them suited to different careers. Just like some people are suited to parenthood more than others. Just as i’d never judge someone their choice of career, or try and force someone into mine, i’d never question their decision to parent or not because i’d assume they would be best placed to decide that themselves!!!

Are you all aliens?

I talk about kids with my friends (childfree, ones considering children, ones who already have children) because I care about them and they care about me and we talk about big life decisions we're thinking about and we support each other through them - which sometimes means asking "are you sure?"

I am childfree. The problem with they "are you sure" is thatyou just never feel you can say "I just don't" because to mamy it just seems weir, not enough etc. So I say things like finances , travel, just not the right time career wise...
My friends would never question me so never had to actually come up with excuses beyomd "I just don't 🤷"
Caring doesn't mean grilling. Which these questions feel like quite often bwcause they usually are

From your post alone.....don't have one. End of. yanbu

Yeah, I've never had a friend ask me if "I'm sure" about any decisions I have made. Nor have I felt the need me to ask them that. They're smart people, they know their own minds.

Draw up a list of day to day care needs for a baby and see what he commits to doing. Then consider what you really want and what you can live with. If the relationship were to end anyway would you still be okay with a child on your own?

I am childfree. The problem with they "are you sure" is thatyou just never feel you can say "I just don't" because to mamy it just seems weir, not enough etc. So I say things like finances , travel, just not the right time career wise...

This. Many simply won’t take “I just don’t” at face value. They are convinced that deep down you do want it but are in denial, because they don’t understand how anyone could genuinely not want it, and and that if only they can unpick the reasons why you are in denial you will have some big revelation that of course you want it.

The reason older people don't believe women when they say they don't want children is... well... they've seen so many who actually did change their minds.

Maybe are in that category themselves (I am).

It's not that they "genuinely can't understand how someone could feel differently".

I never try to convince women that they should have kids though, in my experience it does become clear to the woman in question if/when it does. Changing your mind doesn't imply you didn't know your own mind before.

If all of this gentle questioning is so good for us childfree folks and indicative of a great friendship, tell me why I’d be in hot water if I started asking my friends if they’re sure they want to have kids.

I’ll wait.

My childfree friends do in fact ask this, not sure why you think it would be an issue.

It has been quite helpful in thinking through the consequences and impact and helping me understand what it would mean (I don't have kids, currently TTC) and what I'd be giving up. I respect and appreciate the perspective.

Have you or any of your childfree friends changed their minds because of being asked "are you sure?" ?

"We're not having children."
"Are you sure?"
"Oh shit. No, we're not sure. Thank you for asking. You've helped."

Exactly.

Maybe the ‘Are you sure?’ people imagine themselves being feted at the resulting child’s wedding as guest of honour, with the father/mother of the bride speech being an emotional tribute: ‘Let’s all toast Brenda, without whom our daughter wouldn’t even exist! Just those three little words ‘Are you sure?’ made me completely rethink my desire not to have a child! Because I WASNT sure! Eureka! Suddenly I stopped seeing the world in black and white! etc etc.’

"Are you sure?" just means "Explain your reasons to me so I can judge if you have thought of everything."

If you don’t want a child, then you should not have one “for” your husband. It’s not fair on the child, if nothing else. A child should be wanted by both parents, for their own sake. They shouldn’t be conceived to placate a partner or a sense of guilt or obligation. You aren’t wrong to choose to be child-free. It’s a perfectly valid choice, you don’t need a complicated reason- simply not wanting one is a good enough reason.

Equally. Your DH is not in the wrong to want a child. He wasn’t sure, but clearly uncertainty has turned into “I do want children”. I’m not sure if that is changing the goalposts or not, because he has always been clear that he was undecided and “I don’t foresee myself having a child”, which doesn’t necessarily mean “absolutely do not want children”. Though I’m also not sure if it really matters- the question is can you come to a mutually agreeable decision?

There isn’t really compromise to be had- you either have a child or you don’t. If you are sure you don’t want children- and that is what it looks like from what you’ve written- (it’s not just “I don’t foresee myself having children”, it reads very much “I don’t want children, at all”)- but your DH definitely does want them, then I would say your marriage is in trouble.

You need to think carefully about what you want, and speak to your DH. He should listen to your feelings/concerns, you listen to what he has to say and take it from there. It is probably better to find out now, rather than dragging it all out.