Not to send my children to private school even though I can afford it

[AdamRyan]

I believe in comprehensive education and think children should all be educated together, to improve social mobility and prevent a "brain drain" where less privileged children go to some schools, and more privileged go to others.
Am I in the minority and being naive?

YANBU - comprehensive schools are the way to go
YABU - I'd send my children private if I could

My eldest did A levels this year.
I have 3, one with SEN who is struggling.

HEH. Nice to see liberal, tolerant values alive and well on MN

My son was diagnosed with ASD at two and has always been educated in the private mainstream sector. Initially the LEA refused to accommodate the programme of support we had put in place for him. Over time that became less relevant but independent has always been the better choice for him, now because it offers him the best opportunity in the field in which he can excel (music).
children are very diverse, and so are independent schools. This insistence that they are all if a type defies the reality.

I have read your comments with interest, OP. I teach in an independent in what is a broadly very deprived area (think top 10 or bottom 10 of every kind of life indicator that there is). I have worked in the state sector as well locally - for the majority of my career, in fact. The differences are interesting and not necessarily what you would anticipate. I find your arguments based on broad stereotypes, not actual experience and are, at best, naive. The children I work with absolutely have many advantages in life - but some are carers, see their dad beat their mum, have siblings with disabilities, watch a beloved grandparent battle dementia, have parents who are worrying about money, see the effects of drugs and alcohol, are managing mental ill health, lose a parent to cancer or freak accident which ends up plastered across newspapers. - just like kids in state schools. They work hard and play hard. Homework is done, no excuses. They learn for tests and exams. It’s cool to do well academically and at the same time excel on the sports field or in music or drama. There is no spoon feeding - that’s a myth that pisses me right off. These kids work hard for their grades and deserve them. No one hands them to them because they pay for school. There are still idiots in every classroom, still those who want to disrupt the learning of others. We make £thousands every year for local and international charities. People come in and talk to us - we have a comprehensive enrichment programme and work hard in PSHE to educate about the real world. There is no child in school who doesn’t understand their luck to be there in comparison with their peers in the state sector. They don’t exhibit, in my opinion, the much-presumed entitlement: quite the opposite. They give back, volunteer, fundraise and volunteer some more. Our kids are litter picking in the local community, in fundraising concerts and more. They are busy, hard working and have high expectations of themselves.

Bacon that is our experience too (and my children's father teaches in a fee paying school and has also taught in the state sector so we do know about both even though our children are in fee paying schools).

I don't know why Adam thinks prviate school parents criticise other parents' school choices. There are all kinds of valid reasons why state school parents choose particular schools. Those that could afford either can do whatever they like. Nor have I ever said my children have some kind of only route to riches because they went to a fee paying school. Plenty of children particularly from SE posh comps and the few areas with grammar schools do just as well.

Also can it be brain drain if children are equal in both sectors? My children don't have some kind of golden halo of wonderfulness and brains that will rub off on state school pupils if mine had been forced into the same class room. Also plenty of fee paying schools are for children who aren't very bright , not just the very academic privates like Manchester Grammar.

@AdamRyan actually OP I was sticking up for you. I am going to assume that you are having a bad day and this thread is not going your way. If you ask a question and want answers do not expect everyone to agree with you! For me I am bowing out because you just seem to be attacking people now. You are not the oracle on this and others have experience of both sets of schools. I suggest you stick to chat or talk to your friends IRL. Mumsnet has an educated readership (both state and private). We don't like being lectured!

How is this standing up for me? You were basically making the "leafy comp" assertion I was talking about upthread and assuming I live in one of those areas.

The difference between state and private is state do not refuse a place on the basis of SEN. They may of course be shit at support, exacerbated by the relentless budget cuts meaning no funds for support workers.

The private schools can just refuse to take the students.

@AdamRyan you are actually reading my posts incorrectly. I get that you want to assert your opinion but others have them too. Do not come onto talk and expect others to say how marvellous you are to choose a state comp when you can afford private. How people with children in crisis would love that choice. Too many people have told you you will not find diversity. You are inexperienced at best or ignorant. I was both privately and state educated. My mother was a Cambridge scholar. I read Law at Oxford after going to a comp, what's your background OP? SEN is difficult to place anywhere. Do not tell me how to suck eggs. You have been exceptionally aggressive with so many people. It's your money, your thread but I would recommend one of the top five private schools because there are plenty of people there you might get on with😁

Your last sentence is completely untrue. The equality act applies to private schools. They cannot have a blanket policy of refusing kids with SN. That would be completely unlawful. please people, don’t believe this nonsense and slink off if your child is a victim of discrimination! They have rights!!

@AgathaSpencerGregson quite. All my pro bono is on inclusion.

Also some state schools will be selective eg all boys or only those who get certain marks in the exams ( state grammars) which then lawfully refuse entry to someone with a disability which means an IQ of 80 for example.

I chose single sex schools for my 5 for various reasons (in the private sector) and also I wanted selective private schools like Haberdashers (rather than those that take a broader range of children in terms of exam standards). Other parents pick private schools for other reasons eg music - Chethams or a fundamentalist Muslim UK boarding school etc. just as in the state sector some might choose our local hindu state primary school (one of the few in England ) or a jewish or muslim one.

no, this isn’t right. You don’t get out of the EA by saying “we are only for clever people”.
the school would have to show that reasonable adjustments could not be made.
I so wish this was better understood.

@AgathaSpencerGregson i think @Xenia is a lawyer. I'm not. Xenia can advise I'm sure. Race, religion is exempt. I only help SEN people and tbh I find private better for inclusion if it is mild ASD.

I think you’re right, but this is clearly not her field.
as a matter of law, the reasonable adjustments requirements apply across the board. There is no “get out” for the “clever” schools. Reasons for this are surely pretty obvious!
whether any parent of a child with cognitive difficulties would seek admission to such a school is a separate question. The law is the law.

@AgathaSpencerGregson indeed. And I am glad of the educated debate! 😄

Wow, you make thousands each year for local and international charities, is this due to benevolent motivation or lets face I good PR that justifies the charitable status.

You know it may shock you to know that state educated children,so that is 93% of the school population in this country, also correspondingly manage to excel in their academic performance and in music and sport. I mean talk about resorting to stereotypes, you just have implying that at state school children think it isn't cool to study. Unlike their private school counterparts they have had to motivate themselves largely as there is simply not the resources to instruct them on every step. I absolutely have experience in the private school system and then in to a comprehensive state school in London akin to Grange Hill, there are a world away from each other. My family had DC studying for GCSES this year like my DS but unlike my DS they attend private school and they are micromanaged, they are spoonfed and they are considerably pressurised which I think is awful tbh. I have know of someone whose DC won't talk about their private school experience due to the toll it took on their mental health, they are only 19.

The OP has absolutely not been aggressive but unfortunately for the OP, this thread is like bees to honey for those who have children in private school, bitterly and rudely defending their position.

The toll it took because the school only wants you to get 7, 8s and 9s, your pretty much a designated loser if you don't.

Not really. This thread was started because the op incorrectly assumed stuff from another thread.

Besides why shouldn’t private school parents reply?

What makes you the gate keeper on education threads

Of course they are going to reply, that's the point, in numbers and a balanced debate it will not be.

You have made your point on this thread. No one has stopped you

Why try to stop others just because it’s not your view too

People have certainly argued back against unevidenced assertions , untrue statements and ignorant stereotyping, yes. How very naughty of them.

It's not a view on the topic we are debating though it is a sanctimonious ticking off from that poster, it is a personal dog, that isn't debate.

Attack not dog

Yes, they are certainly many opinionated posters vehemently defending the notion of school education as a commodity, that commodity producing superlative pupils because of their benevolent outlook and litter picking - 🤔