AIBU to not need "the village"?

[holycannaloni]

Prompted to ask this by a number of threads over the last few days, and particularly today (childless friends with friend with baby, person whose family is all on holiday without them, childless weddings), where people end up asking "where is the village nowadays?" The concept of needing "a village" to be a parent seems to be such an online Mum-ism of the last few years, and I just don't get it. I've never felt the need for a big group of friends and relatives to pitch in with child-raising, or for me to pitch in with them, and I don't see it in the parents around me either.

I suppose I'm lucky in some senses as I have a great husband who is completely 50/50 on all home and children things, and we earn enough money that we have been able to pay for the nurseries that we've needed over the years, but that's not to say it's always been easy. But we've just gotten on with it, as have most of my peers who have children. Both our sets of parents are abroad, and we don't have other family in the UK, so it's not like we're getting loads of family help either.

I guess I just don't recognise this craving for a village, or a bemoaning that the UK isn't like other countries who apparently are better at child raising in this collective way. It's nice that our children (and us!) have close friends and that our families love our kids and feel close to them, which they do, but this collaborative parenting isn't something we've ever looked for.

Does anyone else feel that the mystical "village" actually sounds a bit OTT, or am I just the odd one out on here?

I'd turn the question around.

Why WOULDN'T you want a village? Why would you want fewer people to love your kids? Why would you want to limit their chances to find people they adore?

Dtwins are in nursery, stop for lunch. Their dinner lady is DS's friends Mom, she's my friend. We pick up each others kids if needed (both of us have engaged husbands, they just can rarely do school runs). When Dtwins see her in the street they run and hug her. I'm showing her I laws where to go at school pick up next week. She's collecting DS is I'm late the following day. If she goes into labour unexpectedly I'd have her daughter or go to hers. God I'd even hold her hand whilst she delivered if she needed me to. We're in each others villages. And were both just one part. I can phone a handful of Mosk and say Omg I need someone to grab DS from school and they would. They'd even grab my feral 3 yos. They'd feed my kids if I needed them to. None of us are single parents. None of us are without local family. But why wouldn't we want each other too?

So were you not allowed friends and those sort of social activities if that's what you wanted, even when you were an older child and could presumably make those friends under your own steam?

My oldest daughter is dance/drama/theatre mad and is part of huge communities of children of all ages doing that, and has been from a very young age. My youngest plays a lot of a particular sport outside of school and has a community there. Plus their school friends - my oldest is always having friends over or at theirs. They're not cold or introverted children at all.

My understanding of "it takes a village" wasn't so much family childcare but societal expectations that children should behave appropriately when in public and if a member of public sees children without adults - say at a park - they can pull them up for bad behaviour affecting others use.

Hence the village approach. I thought it went back to the days of village bobbies who would also tell children to behave in public and parents supported the fact other adults would help.

I also have a great husband who is an amazing father but I still appreciate the fact that we are extremely lucky to have massive family support that allows us to go on date nights and have time together just the two of us, people who will pitch in if we're stuck for childcare if we need to work odd hours here and there. I'm pregnant with my second child now and have a lot of appointments to make and my hospital only allows one visitor after the birth, no siblings allowed so it's great that I know my parents will take care of my son while my husband visits me.

Most importantly our son has an amazing relationship with his grandparents on both sides as well as his aunt's, uncles and cousins and he is honestly adored by so many people. Family life would honestly look a lot different for us if we didn't have all of this support.

I can only imagine how difficult it is for people who don't have this support.

The village aren't just people who help with childcare. The village are school teachers, sports coaches, dance teachers, other adults who are good role models, anyone who interacts with a child and teen as they grow up.

The concept of needing "a village" to be a parent seems to be such an online Mum-ism of the last few years

It really isn't a new phrase.

It sounds like you DO have a village of friends though?

The majority of our friends have lots of family nearby. This means:

They always have someone to babysit the DC

They spend weekends and holidays with their families often - so often aren't around to spend time with us

They have people to call on in an emergency

They have people to spend "special days" with

They have, heavens forbid, people who would look after their children if something happened to them

We feel the lack of this keenly.

This.

To me, it means the community. It means strangers not crossing at the red man when children are there. It means when your children go out to play alone or with other kids that the neighbours are looking out for them. It’s shop staff teaching children manners. It means if someone else sees your child misbehave they tell
them off. I think all of that results in more independent, well rounded, resilient children.

We are now a world away from that, and sadly (in my view), actively discourage that type of behaviour. On here, ‘village’ can be taken as family, friends etc but you seem to be in an extremely privileged position so it seems weird you can’t empathise enough to get why others might need more support.

Plenty of people make do without the ‘village’, but I truly think society would be better off if all children were raised by a village.

It's not just to raise children per se. You need a village to navigate life.

No one person is an island, nor one couple. Nor should they be.

Extended family and their close relative, communities are extremely important for the human condition.

If we ever start to think otherwise it will be to our peril.

@SnackSizeRaisin I meant tribes of friends/family helping in a hands on childcare way (outside of school provision) like the mum in the main posts OP refers to wanted of her childfree friends.

I think it's interesting how people define a village.

I think of you don't notice them, or need them, tbh you're fairly priveleged.

I am grateful for every person in our village - those who are paid to help my child (tutors, sports coach, therapist etc.), those who are the close friends who advise, help and run to do so when the shit hits the fan, and those who just notice our teen, help to boost them and feel validated, or steer them in the right direction when they're being a dickhead.

I don't have family who help, and I worked hard to create the networks of support to keep my child afloat. I am painfully conscious that as a parent of a disabled child, they may need that village as an adult when I am not around.

Examples of how I've needed a "village" over the past 12 years (children 10&12)

The neighbour who looked after DD1 when I was in labour with DD2

Childcare swaps for birthday parties

The neighbour who saw DH being taken away by ambulance who not only claimed the children.... but her husband drove 40 minutes round trip to pick me up from the other side of town so I could be home quickly

The neighbours that keep an extra eye out for DD1 after school when I'm at work.

Not to mention the more regular playdates, babysitting, birthday parties etc.

I am often surprised at the number of people on MN who seem to have NO support and get in a fix e.g. hosp appt and NO one to care for children, giving birth - no one to ask to care for older children, car broken and need to get somewhere, poorly and can't get children to school, childcare broken down.

Some people seem to have not a single person they can call on. I guess in RL if those people are around me, I don't know who they are since they must be very isolated, but thinking about all the school parents I've known, I'm pretty sure all of them would be able to call another parent in an emergency.

Op, you are very lucky, not everyone is so fortunate in life. Also, everyone is different and needs different things in life, is that really so hard to understand?

Our families live far away and we moved to a new city when the children were small so we had no "village" really, no family or friends nearby. I have to say I missed the support. I would have loved to have lived close to my family or my in-laws and had more friends. I believe families used to live near to extended family and have a lot more involvement.
I live in an area of the UK with a lot of Muslim and Indian families and I really see what a strong "village" they have. So many relatives nearby to provide support. The families we know spend a lot of time with grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins etc. For example my son has a few Muslim friends who come round to play. They are often picked up from our house by an auntie or a grandma or an older cousin.. How wonderful for the children to be surrounded by so much love.

I have a village, it does not mean childcare.

To me a village means my kids have close relationships with aunts and uncles and grandparents they can talk to if they need advice and dont want to talk to mum and dad. They have cousins and friends children to play with. I have friends with kids we spend time with and I can vent to or get advice from.

I would find life much harder if i didnt have friends and family around. They would help in an emergency but no regular help with kids.

It takes a village is an old phrase and I think it has some value.

It's not about tit for tat free childcare. It's about having a community of people who can share wisdom and tips, or if you're stuck you know someone is there to help, and you're also willing to help out. It's knowing that when you go to a playgroup you can go to the toilet and other parents will keep an eye on your child, or that you and your neighbours might take it in turns to take the children to the park. It's all the other positive adults figures children have so they learn that other adults can, and will, correct them or challenge them if they're doing something they shouldn't. It's the people in the local shop who are patient when your DC is learning how to buy things on their own.

I think people mean if there was an emergency would you have support? So if one if you was serious unwell in hospital would you have someone else to pick up the children or stay over the night. This can obviously be paid for but that might not give you the emotional support you need.
I think it's easy to take for granted and then you see some threads where people literally don't have anyone who could care for thier children

If you've never needed someone to pick up a kid in an emergency, or run you over supplies in a fix, lend you 50p at the school gate, watch over your kids at a party you can't stop at, then I'd say you're just very fortunate. If you've never been willing or able to do this for someone else, I'd say you're less fortunate.
Most people's lives are just messier that way tho

My neighbour has the village and I’m deeply envious. Grandparents who do some of the school runs or drop-off/pick-up to after-school
activities, so both parents can work full days without the running around. Regular babysitting so they can go out without the extra cost, and getting kids used to babysitters. Extra pairs of hands at eg birthday parties and on weekends, so they’re able to DIY, for example. The money they save on babysitters, wraparound care and DIY is then used for a cleaner, so more free time, more kids activities, so more child-free time, holidays, etc. They’re extremely relaxed and have never had to do the sick kid/working day juggle. Village-less me is a headless chicken!

@TheOrigRights I think some people as well are just much more self-sufficient in that way, for a lot of things I wouldn't call a friend, I'd just find a way to sort it myself, unless that was impossible. I've always been like it (possibly because I moved to a different country when I was 18, so got used to being this way). I suppose when I sit here and think about it I could call friends in any of those scenarios, but I probably wouldn't.

I have a great husband who is completely 50/50 on all home and children things, and we earn enough money that we have been able to pay for the nurseries that we've needed over the years

Ha, mystery solved then.

In the modern world we are effectively collaboratively parenting with nursery, school, childminders, to a lesser extent other adults who have charge of children at various points... handing over aspects of their physical care, discipline and education to someone else who will do it differently to the way you would and bring their own influence to the child.

I know it's a regular refrain on Mumsnet but I truly, truly am so dispirited to see how many people are calling out having a 50/50 husband as being such a privilege, on the same level as being able to afford childcare.

As I often read on here, we have to demand more of our men in parenting. This shouldn't be considered out of the ordinary. It's so sad that it is.

I think it's more the idea that input from a wider range of sources builds more rounded, interesting people. Children brought up solely by two adults means they have only ever been given those adults' perspectives, have only had their interests shared with them.