To wonder if there comes a point where you just have to give up work?

[Bluewatersummer]

I’m hopefully not there yet. But while I wish I could be very feminist about this the fact is DH earns a lot more than me and he always will, his talents lie where money is.

With one child we have managed through a combination of part time, taking turns to take time off when needed, and some good luck as well - haven’t had a lot of sickness to contend with. However, I’m due my second any day now and I’m wondering about a whole host of stuff.

It’s going to be so difficult when DC1 starts school and when DC2 is in nursery, reliance on wraparound care and rushing from A to B to C. I don’t honestly know if it is just easier for everyone - not just me - if one parent gives up work and just has their ‘job’ the children and house. Which isn’t very feminist but would potentially make a big difference to stress levels! Honestly wondering what others think: I’m not making any big decisions just yet.

Is part time work an option?

If you do stop work, make sure you still claim child benefit (even if your partner is a high earner and you have to pay it back) because that counts as NI for state pension.

Also, remember if you you get divorced later down the line, that all assets will get split, including pensions.

I'm really not sure why the OP needs to have this level of inquisition!

If she says (repeatedly!) that her DH can not 'just change his hours' then just accept that. What planet are some people on? Can you really not imagine how some people do not have jobs like that? It doesn't really matter one iota what your husband may or may not have done with his work schedule - he's not the OP's husband!

What would be the actual point of the higher earner in a family doing less hours, so that OP can do more hours for less money? It's cutting off the nose to spite the face.

If she says she is not concerned about her pension and she has that sorted - why question that?

If she tells you she is mulling things, then she's mulling things. These situations are not black and white.

It isn’t feminist to stop work. I haven’t really participated in the sub discussion about this - it has been interesting - but I’ve tried to stress here it is the discrepancy between the incomes and not what is between the legs of the people earning those incomes that is the sticking point.

Childbearing is inherently sexist because only women can do it. Our whole lives turn upside down to grow and birth them whilst nothing (practically) changes for dad. Recovery takes time and Mother Nature would have it that baby and mum are attached for feeding and bonding.

As a result the expectations of women in the workplace are different. I remember not wearing my engagement ring for an interview because of the assumptions the panel would have about the 20-something woman in front of them. The gender pay gap means that women are basically unpaid from mid-November every year due to the discrepancy with male wages. Certain jobs are considered for women and others for men. I’ve caught against that my entire working life.

it’s not an accident of fate that you’re less bothered about your lower paid career than your husband. That he has a role that takes him away from home and keeps you there. I know that because I now have that sort of role and whenever I describe my job people will ask whether DD or DH mind me being away, don’t I miss them? Questions never asked of DH when he is away for work (5.5 days a week for the first 18 months of DD’s life).

I work completely flexibly and have control over my travel most of the time. I have no issue saying no to travel that clashes with something else.

DH contracts and works on his own terms. He is in an exceptionally specialist role, always in demand and nobody bats an eyelid at him turning down meetings at school run time.

it is completely possible to create a life where there is equality of role in all aspects. The question is whether you really want to.

@anouskita thank you so much! It does become difficult on longer threads but I just keep endlessly repeating myself and it won’t be accepted and then I’m accused of thinking I’m special and unique - that post was pretty horrible to be honest.

Like you I honestly don’t see what the point would be in him working less hours or getting a new job for (much) less money. I think DH would think I had lost the plot if I made that demand.

The point would be that it would enable him to parent his kids, which he doesn’t do now as he is unreliable and flitting in and out of family life. That you can’t see that is absolutely mind blowing.

The fact that you can't see other people's family dynamics have to work differently to your ultruistic view is mind blowing.

Every family is different. What works for you is not going to work for everyone else.

Sure. But I’m not the one on the Internet complaining that my current set up doesn’t work for me and asking for advice - then ignoring all advice and calling it bonkers. Bizarre.

What would be the actual point of the higher earner in a family doing less hours, so that OP can do more hours for less money? It's cutting off the nose to spite the face.

I guess if you see money as the most important thing, then you're right. It makes more sense for the higher earner to work all hours and for the person with lower earning potential to pick up all of the domestic stuff.

Money is not all-important for me, though, so I see it differently. I see value in both parents having a close, hands-on relationship with their children. I see value in both parents having a life and an identity outside of the home. I see value in modelling a more equal division of responsibilities to your children. And I see advantages in both parents retaining their earning potential.

I see the logic in your thinking. I just don't agree that money is the only consideration.

DH could probably earn double what he does now but would have to be in London/travel a lot more. He earns well and that sort of lifestyle isn’t what he wants. He hated the 18 months that he worked away when DD was born and so has made choices that still allow him to be a parent. It’s also allowed me to climb the ladder.

”He can’t because he earns more” is yet another sexist stereotype that keeps women in this position.

ABSOLUTELY.

This is also what creates different choices for our daughters.

Sorry, meant to quote this. 😴

I stopped working and don’t regret it at all. DH regularly works overseas and I was quite overwhelmed with the idea of juggling everything. Before I did so:

• we agreed how our money would work for both of us
• i was registered for child benefit (didn’t receive it as not eligible) to ensure state pension contributions
• We put extra savings into ISAs to act as a pension for me and went through our plans in case of disaster
• i kept up membership of the chartered organisation I belonged to so I could return to work (cost a bit but not crazy amount)
• we made sure our wills were sorted properly

It worked for us. But I’m fortunate that my DH is quite respectful and seemed to comprehend what was being done at home. We all found the transition back to me working full time difficult- cleaners truly don’t solve all the problems as someone mentioned above. It’s really worth sitting down together and sorting out all the detail before the baby is born. But do remember there is no right way - people will judge and question your decisions whatever you do, just work out what’s right for your family. Good luck!

Stealth, I genuinely don’t see that he isn’t parenting his children. He is. But he is sometimes away … that’s all really. Like most people we have a life based on a certain level of income and if I did what you wanted me to do, we’d have to move house, I’d probably have to go back sooner after maternity leave, and so on.

You seem to think it would be as simple as DH applying for and getting another job that pays similarly (or at least, only a little less) and I keep trying to explain to you that that’s not what it is like. Even for me, there’s no way I could get a different job that pays as well as my current one with no prior experience or qualifications in that field and I don’t earn as much.

And money isn’t the most important thing but to drastically reduce our income to the extent that is being pushed at me here especially at the moment I do think would be beyond foolish. I also think it would lead to a huge rift and resentment in this family and beyond even if DH agreed to it.

Can you imagine (honestly) I do what you think I should do here and I insist DH gets a different job. He no longer travels round the country or abroad but he’s permanently based in the nearest city. He earns so much less than he once did, he’s lost the flexibility, the bonuses and everything else. Can you really not see that that’s going to ultimately make him so unhappy and resent me and that would end the relationship?

As it is, I know DH loves me and our DS and will love this child when he or she arrives. He can take a certain amount of flexibility - eg in the weeks after the birth he will be wfh (as I will be having a c section) but as I’ve tried to explain it’s other times when things are unpredictable that are harder.

I really don’t want to argue and I’ve repeatedly said this. But what a minority of posters are pushing as the solution would be absolute madness!

I used to work evenings and weekends when mine were little to keep earning (a bit of) my own money. It did leave me a bit stuck in dead end jobs as I gave up a decent career that would have me earning the same as DH is on now had I continued with it, but honestly I wouldn't have wanted the stress or trying to "do it all". I still don't work FT now 15 years later and am studying for a career that will only ever be pt (although the money is equivalent to most ft jobs). There's more to life than work! Enjoy your children, but have a plan and keep your hand in with something.

but no one is pushing it as a solution - merely as an alternative. Plenty of solutions have been suggested from additional /alternative childcare to cleaners but apparently none of them work. And ultimately you are pondering doing something drastic (giving up work) which you don’t want to do. I honestly genuinely find it madness that you would take this all on yourself without thinking about whether there are other ways you could structure family life differently. Plenty of women have posted about changing jobs or working differently post kids. It’s part of the deal. This is why the thread has derailed into “feminism” discussions - because you are having to bear ALL the burden of having kids.

Anyway, I will bow out now. I wish you luck and hope the rest of the pregnancy and birth goes well!

OK stealth but I really do feel whatever I say isn’t good enough to be honest. I have said and pretty nicely that I just posted a few days ago fretting and being a bit daft due to an exceptionally bad run with illness - I don’t think I deserve the personal comments tbh.

Apologies missed the last post, started typing then got distracted

I guess the difference is that we planned the changes needed to go from two people able to push careers unfettered to what two people would need to do when a child came along without detriment of one party.

BIL and SIL had 3 babies in 5 years. She went back full
time at 9 months each time, chasing promotions etc. (They had pretty full on help with childcare and domestic stuff from PIL, admittedly.)

Anywho, fast forward 3 years and BIL is made redundant from his job unexpectedly. The market he works in has shrunk and he can’t get another job at a similar salary, so he starts a business. No doubt it will be successful at some point. At the moment it’s in the money guzzling phase. SIL is the one keeping them afloat. Had she quit work to look after the kids they’d have been down the river without a paddle.

I don't understand some people on here. Not everyone has an office job with defined hours. If your husband was a diplomat to Kazakhstan, O suppose people on here would still say, 'sorry darling, you need to fly home every day at 5pm to load the dishwasher etc, so I can do my 40k office job that I hate but, you know.... 'feminism.' If he was a scientist on the brink of a cure for cancer, I suppose it's more important he does. 50/50 housework and enables you to do a routine job. If he's on the brink of millions (with a bit of effort), I suppose you'd say - "nooo DH. Leave that opportunity that could put our children through school, Uni, set them up for life and will mean we never have to worry about our pensions or mortgages and you can retire yourself ... Don't be silly. It's more important for me to work for a routine salary and we can just stay static and keep plodding along with a mortgage for ever.,,, " Er no.

We always made it work. I say we. Largely me as my ex worked overseas for most of their childhood. 18 & 15 now, time flies. Mine had a lot of sickness too, but I never considered for one minute quitting my job.

Do people do no planning around having children then? Or not think about whether it’s a good idea to have children with someone that’s never around when there are no/few childcare options?

And they’ll ignore people like me who say they have up work and the world didn’t fall apart. I was teaching, next to nothing after childcare, stressed and sad. Quit, had years off then got a flexible job, mainly working from home that’s more per hour and zero stress. Not a career in the same way, but I just don’t care. Life is good, I love it. Work pays enough to live.

That’s not too bad though is it? Millions of women (largely) do it every day. I used to drop both at separate places then run down to the train station and go into London 5 days a week. I had no family locally either. Their dad did help sometimes but largely fell to me. I mean if you want to be a SAHM, be one. You don’t have to justify it, but it will be do-able what you’re going to have to do a few days a week for a few years until both in same school. Once you’re in a routine it’s really not that bad

@Bluewatersummer I get it, and I feel you are validated in giving up work if you feel it would work for your family currently.