To intervene in DS's relationship?

[AlyssaHasAChaaaaild]

DS and his girlfriend are both 20. Met in 6th form and have dated ever since, now both at different Unis and keeping things going long distance.

She is from a strict religious background and made clear at the start there would be no sex before marriage. 2 years in they are being a bit physical but not even close to or considering having sex.

Her mum has got wind of this and is furious, and blames DS for "corrupting" her. There is no question around consent, it's just the religious principle that she can't accept that her daughter would do anything physical before marriage and so he is to blame.

Her mum has said the relationship can only continue if he agrees to go and have a sit down chat with her so she can explain why she is angry with him and set some ground rules. Girlfriend seems to agree this is a reasonable idea, DS is pretty horrified at the prospect but feels if he doesn't agree then the relationship will end.

I'm trying to bite my tongue because I know he adores her and I have seen how happy they are together. But FFS this seems insane to me and I want to tell him to run for the hills. I feel like even if he does this it's only a matter of time before the mum pipes up and interferes about something else.

TBH it's the girlfriend I'm most angry with as I feel like she has thrown him to the wolves and is letting this happen. I think she is a bit scared of her mum but that doesn't excuse her letting DS get painted as the bad guy.

But if I say this to DS am I being interfering too?

Absolutely 100%!!!

They're 20, not 16 and they've been together 2 years, not 2 months!

Does the GF actually hold the belief of no sex before marriage, or is she just tied into her mother's beliefs and opinions?

I would be worried about whatever else the mother thought she was entitled to control.

What if they don't/aren't in a position to get married until their mid to late twenties? Are they both going to be happy with just kissing and the odd fumble here and there?!

Your son and his girlfriend need to really think about this. It's bizarre

I would be really unhappy about this and would probably try to engineer lots of chance meetings with single 20 year old girls in the hopes that he'll have his head turned and realise what a bum deal this is! Don't like the sound of the mum or girlfriend.

Has he had sex before, OP?

He's 20, he really doesn't have to submit to a dressing down from anyone about his sex life.
It's really, really creepy.

And I agree with your worries he's being set up for taking all future blame and for further abuse, he he goes along with this, then they'll push for something more.

I can only presume “treat her like a wife” means they get to do the really kinky stuff.

This is nuts.
They are both adults.
Adults do not get to interfere in other adults' relationships.
Except (eyeroll) if you are 'the church'
Mommy dearest is not the church
Very religious yet do not go to church? Cof E? What a load of controlling bollocky tripe! (Sorry). As one who was raised CofE and went to church quite a few times, this does not fit with any of my experience.
Maybe I've watched too many 'I escaped from the mormons' things on youtube this week?
Yeah, OP, go with him if he has to do this, a witness would be a good idea. For his protection.

This is the first physical relationship for both of them.

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

It sounds really hard OP because you’re doomed if you do and doomed if you don’t. But maybe some support that makes him aware this isn’t a “normal” situation.
More of a hand hold for you rather then advice sorry.

How bloody hypocritical! 🤣🤣

I did think that I should go along too as moral support / stop him being blamed or accused of something

But tbh my belief is that the mum is mad for interfering, so for me to involve myself like that makes no sense.

It's been billed as a bit of a dealbreaker, you have to come round and listen to her, she is angry, she wants to set you straight, we can't see each other out of the house until you do this, you'd do it if you loved me...... and the girlfriend is happy to force him into this

This is what would worry me most of all. DS sounds like a very decent young man, and if he gives in to this what else will her mother expect to dictate, with the GF trying to force the issue?

You said yourself "he knows it's not right", so while you obviously can't tell him what to do I'd encourage him to think more deeply whether this is what he wants - not just on the basis of "now", but what it would almost certainly become in the future

And yes, if they did choose to eventually have sex without being married and she told her mother about even that, I'd worry about what accusations she might be harrassed into making

He should definitely go to the meeting just to ask her if that’s what she means. Tell her that he’s been desperate to try it.

Bonus points if he brings props.

He needs to run so fast.

Just because people believe in nonsense- doesn’t stop it being nonsense. Freedom of conscience is a well established principle in our society since the enlightenment.

Religious; don't attend church
Had sex before marriage herself; what a hypocrite!!
Anyone who says 'if you loved me you would do this' is manipulative & controlling.
I'm wondering how the a 20yr old brings up in conversation with her MUM oh me and bf were touching each other, what do you think??
All sounds very dysfunctional and frankly weird.
My DS, I'd tell him to run.

This woman is batshit bonkers.

I’d love to know if this “agreed to get married” was an official proposal? Or was it a chat to merely justify them having sex.

I’d pay to see her face if your son and his GF told her they’d “agreed to get married, you know, in the future sometime” during this dysfunctional meeting.

This whole horrible situation is purely about controlling her poor daughter.

Under normal circumstances, yes. But if your DS does decide to go then I think you need to go with him because otherwise it sounds like it's going to turn into a kangaroo court.

I also think it would be good for the GF to learn that your DS also has a parent on his side who is prepared to fight his corner to ensure fairness. Instead of a load of bollocks about how she was persuaded/pressured/coerced and "honestly mum I didn't want to..."

@Saltired

Thanks for inviting me so we can discuss what's ok. Can you give me your honest thoughts on the following .....removes prop number 1..... yes or no? Wifey or No-wifey?

🤣

Sounds like the woman in question is 39/40; which makes it even more mind boggling that she thinks it's appropriate ask.

I think she wants them to get married, or at least engaged.

I feel sorry for the daughter, it sounds like her mum is incredibly heavy handed and she may also want to get married in order to leave home and establish herself as an adult.

The question is, is this the way your son wants things to go? If he's not completely averse to the idea it might be worth him having a think beforehand about how he will handle it if her mum moots this idea (for my money I'd suggest he insists that they both need to finish their education before thinking of engagement, but it's his life).

The mum is 40

I would be inclined to see if I could have a frank chat with the girl. She has been brainwashed, obvs. Or if not you, is there someone else (one of her friends?) who could listen to her and point out that her DM"s way is not the only way? The DM made decisions and lives her life to suit herself. Presumably the main point was to avoid an unwed pg and all the 'shame' and problems down the line that that would bring. If the GF could be convinced to talk about sex and relationships and her DM's views? Her own views? It's a way of opening up her mind after the brainwashing. Bloody hell, she's at Uni. You'd think she would start to draw away from DM a bit. She needs to be encouraged to think for herself and square it with her own beliefs. Maybe she'll change, maybe not. But I would try to ask her why she wants her DM involved.

@AngelinaFibres Me too! I found out the day I got back from honeymoon, aged 21, that not only had my father left my mother for another woman during the week I was away, but my mother had been 3 months pregnant with my older brother when they married...and had been living with my father for 6 months prior to that!

Considering I'd only got married as they'd threatened to disown me if I lived with my then boyfriend...well you can imagine how angry I was with their hypocrisy. That was 34 years ago and I doubt I will ever forgive it.

It's not interfering if DS is determined to go and would appreciate your support, so you could consider offering (and of course fully go along with his choice)

In your position I'd be interested to meet this woman for myself, and if he wants to it would give DS the opportunity to bounce whatever's said off someone else afterwards

If it comes to that though, I'd do very little talking but a LOT of listening ...

Girlfriend is in her first year of Uni and hasn't settled very well. She went home to Mum every single weekend, not sure for whose benefit that was.

She hasn't made any close friends there and as far as I know her only real friend is someone she knows via a church youth group she attended during her teens. She's also an only child and mum is a widow.

So basically it's her and her mum (and Jesus) so she isn't getting any other opinions from anyone else.