AIBU to think throwing a mum-of-four in prison for having an abortion is never the answer?

[therescoffeeinthatnebula]

Spotted this on Twitter and haven't seen it already being discussed.

Apparently, a woman is being sentenced today for having an abortion over the limit during lockdown. I don't know of the circumstances (can't find anything other than the Sunday Times article), only that she already had four children and claims she didn't know exactly how far along she was.

I think most of us would agree making medical appointments during lockdown was bloody difficult and that it's even harder to attend any appointment if you have children, given you're not normally allowed to take them with you.

Whatever the truth, I'm appalled to see a woman potentially thrown in prison for trying to seek an abortion during lockdown, especially when you look at how violence against women is treated. I'd have thought referring her for mandatory counselling would be more of an appropriate outcome than prison because finding out you aborted what could have been a viable baby has got to mess with anyone's head.

It's all very sad - she should have been able to access proper services earlier - but prison, to me, should never have been on the table as a consequence.

I didn't actually realise that abortion in this country was blanket illegal and that our rights to seek abortions up to the limit are actually exceptions to that law rather than a piece of legislation that stands on its own.

What country is this in?

The UK... No, really.

UK

I didn't realise it was over the limit. That's pretty bloody grim if so. Either way, I agree that prison is not appropriate, nor will it help anyone.

Really? Was this an abortion performed by a medical professional? If so, are both the medical professionals also being sent to prison for authorising it? Or is it that she used pills when they’re intended for earlier on?

Regardless of the circumstances, if true, that’s a disgrace and shows that the law around abortion is an ass (IMHO). This will help precisely nobody and deter precisely nobody from seeking an abortion.

I only saw this this morning. She obtained the pills online through an online consult during lockdown, but she was past the 10 week limit.

Horrific case. That poor woman.

It's awful that this woman was charged, and even worse that it's progressed this far. I don't see how this is in the public interest. It's a medical issue insofar as she could have harmed herself by using a method of termination that may not have been fully successful and so put herself at risk of infection. But that's it.

I think most people don't realise that we don't have abortion on demand, and that it can be difficult to access abortion at the best of times. With four kids, unable to access childcare, during lockdown, her choices were really limited. She won't be the only one to do what she did, and whoever reported her should be ashamed of themselves.

Is there a link to an article? I'd be interested to know if there is something else going on behind the scenes with this that we don't know (yet). It's so very rare to prosecute for this, and rightly so.

I'd hope there is some strong evidence to prove she knew how far along she was and it wasn't just a mix up with dates.

It was part of the abortion pills-by-post scheme that was introduced during lockdown. You were only supposed to access consultations if you were up to ten weeks, apparently.

From what I can gather from Googling, you would have had to think you were no more than ten weeks gone, and it would have had to seem plausible by dates of when you last had sex, last had a period, etc. If there wasn't a scan - and access to in-person medical services was difficult during lockdown - I can see how a genuine mistake could have been made.

I mean, apart from anything else, she's 44 now. Her periods could already have been starting to get irregular in the run-up to menopause. Without a scan, how could anyone have known for sure?

I think abortion services are insufficiently regulated. I believe they should come in for much more scrutiny, regarding the people they employ, counselling offered and procedures they perform. I don't think the woman should be punished in this way, it will cause unnecessary trauma to her children and is more the fault of whoever supplied the pills.

https://twitter.com/BPAS1968/status/1667992336247169024/photo/1

Is it this story? I can’t find anything more recent https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/women/women-abortion-jail-life-sentence-uk-b2142960.html

https://twitter.com/BPAS1968/status/1667968579474432000

I saw it from BPAS on Twitter.

is more the fault of whoever supplied the pills.

To be clear, I don't think this is likely to be a case of "fault", whether or not the woman knew she was over 10 weeks. However I really don't think the person who supplied the pills can be at fault, assuming that the information the woman gave in terms of her last period, when she had sex etc, was consistent with a gestation less than 10 weeks.

Gah, meant to bold the quote about the person who supplied the pills being at fault.

More to this isn't there. Significantly over the limit I suspect to bring charges against a woman. This decision will not have been taken lightly by the CPS.

It’s absolutely appalling that the CPS has decided to prosecute this.

I think pretty much everything during lockdown wasn't sufficient.

As a country, we were trying to do the best we could whilst everyone was dying around us, and it does not feel in the public interest to prosecute a desperate woman for accessing crappy services at a crappy time.

I don't know how old her four children are, but given she's 44 now, I'm willing to bet at least one is young enough to struggle if their parent is taken away from them.

I found this thread on twitter about the sentencing etc....sounds like such an awful situation
https://twitter.com/HannahAlOthman/status/1668171887115923457?s=20

Even if she knew how far along she was I still don't think she should be prosecuted.

Imagine being desperate enough to take abortion pills at home knowing you'd have to give birth to a dead formed fetus.

It's terribly sad for all involved.

I think it's unlikely the woman could be 28 weeks pregnant and think it was only 8-10 weeks, frankly. That said, it's irresponsible to provide pills by post so that the woman doesn't see a doctor, so I still think the agency is at fault.

Absolutely disgusting. Her 4 babies need their mum and she’s not a criminal or a danger to society so she shouldn’t be locked up.

She will have gone through a big trauma. Physically, emotionally, mentally. What she needs is compassion and support to move forward with her life. This is just dragging it on for her unnecessarily.

Her children will be so confused and will wonder why their mummy has gone to prison. “She had an abortion.” Right- how do you explain that to a child? It’s something that they don’t need to know because it’s so private and complicated.

Horrific. Poor woman and poor children.

Even if she was 28 weeks she should not be prosecuted.

Abortion services are very tightly regulated, more so than general NHS services (I have worked in both). So what do you mean exactly? What people are you objecting to, what procedures? Do you think they can just do what they like?

There's more to this than what's in the report. I couldn't make a decision on AIBU or not, until I had seen the evidence put before the Court.

How desperately sad.