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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this manager is being unfair?

184 replies

quiettimes · 30/05/2023 14:16

I got pulled into an “informal meeting” today with a male manager because apparently my dress is too short and he will be monitoring my attire going forward. What I’m wearing isn’t against the dress code guidance (which is just “smart casual”. This dress covers my knees and is not a fitted style so it isn’t riding up. I have worn it to work many times before and no issues were raised previously.

aibu to be annoyed about being spoken to about this? Other people not only wear dresses the same length as me, but shorter things. Some are literally wearing things directly against the dress standards such as jeans, trainers, t shirts and hoodies today. They aren’t being spoken to. I feel like it’s personal and nitpicking to raise this. Particularly as it’s also 20 degrees outside and the heating is ON inside, so everyone at work is profusely sweating working through headache inducing heat.

OP posts:
Zonder · 01/06/2023 12:31

Don't suppose you have been promoted over him? That would be sweet!

Freefall212 · 01/06/2023 12:37

Definitely document this and be in contact with HR. Completely inappropriate.

AliceOlive · 01/06/2023 12:38

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

The headband did it for me.

user1471538283 · 01/06/2023 12:51

Email him now with the content of your discussion. Also ask for a copy of the rules he claims you are violating as you need to see it in writing.

Each and every conversation from now on you document.

He cannot just say not to wear something if it is not detailed in the rules.

Angrywife · 01/06/2023 12:56

I'd go in tomorrow dressed like his girlfriend does! But then I do like to be passively aggressively petty

lieselotte · 01/06/2023 13:08

Justalittlebitduckling · 01/06/2023 12:29

Agree with what others have said: I would escalate this by requesting formal clarification. He had walked into an HR nightmare by being unprofessional and I don’t think he should get away with it. On the knee is fine unless it’s a nunnery.

Even if it wasn't ok, it's not for a man to tell a female colleague what to wear.

Congratulations on the promotion OP but please still send the email to him with a copy to HR.

Catspyjamas17 · 01/06/2023 13:08

Perhaps he knew about your promotion when he made the comment?

If he isn't your boss and I knew I was in the right I'd be telling him to back off and get stuffed though I wouldn't have dared when I was younger.

LinaM20 · 01/06/2023 13:25

I would speak to HR and ask someone from Hr to any future meetings.

FedUpBoiledFrog · 01/06/2023 13:31

quiettimes · 31/05/2023 21:53

I don’t mind the article as such, it wasn’t negative against me…but can the posters who asked me to upload a photo understand why I didn’t now 😂

anyway today I found out I secured a promotion!

Congratulations!! Please tell me you got his job since he's only temporary 😂

Imisssleep2 · 01/06/2023 13:31

If dress is as described i think your right and its personal, report to HR

Dulra · 01/06/2023 13:35

Bookendortwo · 30/05/2023 14:31

I'd email and document the conversation asking for clarification on what is and isn't suitable. Plus documenting the actual length of your outfit. I'd also take a photo of yourself in the outfit for future reference I'd its taken further.

Another one that agreed with this.
I am sick of "informal" meetings, basically what it equates to is meetings with no minutes where things are said that would not hold up to scrutiny. I've been caught on this too many times now I take notes on every discussion I have with management however informal it appears. Email him straight away with a summary of what was discussed and ask if he agrees if that is a fair summary of the meeting

MrsElijahMikaelson1 · 01/06/2023 13:36
Hmm
Emotionalsupportviper · 01/06/2023 13:58

quiettimes · 30/05/2023 17:41

thanks for the template. Will definitely use. In the meeting I did push back against his suggestion that my dress was inappropriate.

my impression as the day progressed is that nothing formal will immediately come of this as he already hasn’t done something he said he would to “follow this up” I think if the guidance backed up his actions, more would have occurred judging by his attitude

there likely will be more “informal” bullshit though. I’ll play it by ear. ultimately I don’t think this manager or his friends at work like me. I don’t have a problem with anyone but,
I reckon silly shit like this will always occur as it’s an unprofessional environment. He’s been a manager for a month in a temporary capacity so has no idea what he’s doing and has brought bias and favouritism to the forefront.

there likely will be more “informal” bullshit though.

This is bullying, pure and simple.

Even though you are going to be leaving, make a report to HR. They may not take any action, but if someone else is pushed into making a similar report, next week, next month, next year, there is a record that he has form for this sort of thing.

Fraaahnces · 01/06/2023 13:58

Congratulations on your new promotion! No wonder he’s being a dick. It’s his last chance to throw his weight around, the soggy-dicked little gnome. Please tell me that you are going to be equal to or further up the food chain than him!!!

momtoboys · 01/06/2023 13:59

Bookendortwo · 30/05/2023 14:31

I'd email and document the conversation asking for clarification on what is and isn't suitable. Plus documenting the actual length of your outfit. I'd also take a photo of yourself in the outfit for future reference I'd its taken further.

This.

neilyoungismyhero · 01/06/2023 14:05

Perhaps you can tell him what to wear now.

AliceOlive · 01/06/2023 14:05

If a temporary manager, not in my line told me anything I’d laugh. Then I’d have a laugh with my own manager.

If one of my direct reports asks me what to do about someone else, not in our CoC telling them what to do, I tell them to ignore it. In this case I’d be pulling this guy into HR with his own manager and asking exactly WTF he means by “monitoring” the skirt length of my female employees

PosseGalore · 01/06/2023 14:15

Haven't read the whole thread, but please listen to people who tell you to document everything and at least email someone you know so that there is a written record about what happened.

My jaw dropped open while reading your OP. What he did to you was so off that I couldn't believe what I was reading. At first it sounded a bit kinky and I wondered if he fancied you or something, but you obviously think this is not the case. Whatever, it is discriminatory, really off.

Congratulations on the promotion - don't be surprised if he starts to persecute you.

daisychain01 · 01/06/2023 14:27

Other people not only wear dresses the same length as me, but shorter things. Some are literally wearing things directly against the dress standards such as jeans, trainers, t shirts and hoodies today

^ this - and the fact you asked him for the management position on what constitutes 'in policy' work attire and his dickish response - is a clear sign he hasn't got the slightest clue about what it takes to be a manager, nor how to resolve issues with staff. You would be well within your rights to lodge a grievance against him.

My concern is his outlandish behaviour is because it's tolerated in your place of work, but it shouldn't stop you 'getting his card marked' via the grievance process, with the ultimate aim of having him stood down as a manager because of his sheer incompetence.

Whiteroomjoy · 01/06/2023 14:54

FedUpBoiledFrog · 30/05/2023 14:34

Do you have a HR department? If so I would ask them if your clothing was appropriate for work.

This.go to Hr without delay in dress you’re wearing.ask them what about it is breaking dress code

WesterChick · 01/06/2023 21:44

In my 20s - oh 20 years ago Blush my line manager did this to me. And couldn't explain exactly what was inappropriate about what I wore for work. I was (and remain) a small boobed pear shaped size 10. He said my low cut tops were inappropriate. And said I should wear more dresses (I would wear naice top and work trousers as per 2000s) and in that convo also referenced a more senior woman, middle level, with large boobs who wielded them in such a way that conveyed authority and maybe I should do the same Confused

He on other occasions complimented my patent leather shoes because 'he could see the reflection of my panties' and asked me if I wore matching bra and knickers. He also asked me when I was going to start going to the gym, pointedly when I was lifting things to a high shelf , re my arse.

Actually it all came to a crux when he invited me to his house for a meeting where we had to go through a load of stuff and he made it make sense to meet at his. His wife was away for a few days Hmm (he had two kids) and the entire meeting he was angling for hugs and to get me upstairs... I visited the loo at some point and came out and he was right outside.. then said he wanted to show me their new expensive Feather and Black bed.

I was so naive. I didn't realise anything! Bloody hell. I did laugh it off and go downstairs which took some courage tbh.

This is in secondary school teaching too - not high finance in the city.

Thing is - I'm actually an intelligent and emotionally articulate woman nowadays, and so it makes me sad that I was so receptive to this bullshit in my twenties. And I have no reason to think that anything has changed. And so I fear for my 8yo daughter when she enters a male dominated workforce.

SaltyCrisps · 01/06/2023 21:51

MrsAnon6 · 30/05/2023 18:01

This sounds like straight up bullying to me. I would print off your dress code policy, take a photo of you in the dress and enlist help from HR. His behaviour is bang out of order and you need to nip it in the bud before it gets worse.

This

Clarabell77 · 02/06/2023 19:18

I wouldn’t email him or engage with him again on the subject (or at all). I would speak to my own line manager and make an informal complaint about him. He has no place monitoring what you’re wearing and you’ve been singled out.

Emotionalsupportviper · 02/06/2023 19:55

Agree with @Clarabell. Don't engage.

walkingismedicine · 02/06/2023 20:34

Bookendortwo · 30/05/2023 14:31

I'd email and document the conversation asking for clarification on what is and isn't suitable. Plus documenting the actual length of your outfit. I'd also take a photo of yourself in the outfit for future reference I'd its taken further.

This