Contacting school about male teacher

[Slidingdowntherainbow]

My child goes to a preschool attached to a primary school. The Head is always on the gate each morning welcoming children (and parents) in the gates, we see her every morning.

The other day, I went to collect my child earlier than usual and walked past the playing field as usual, it's on the way to the preschool.

It was a hot day and the Head, along with another female colleague, was sitting on a grass bank watching the children and I know they saw this as they laughed.

A male teacher was walking along the playing field with each hand squeezing two girls shoulders. So he was between them, with a hand on each of their outside shoulders, seemingly squeezing. The girls were giggling and the the Head laughed. Not that I think it matters as he shouldn't be touching them at all, but it wasn't a quick squeeze, he was more resting his hands there for a good 30 seconds I'd say.

Anyway, it may be nothing, but it made me feel very uncomfortable. 1) it's inappropriate to touch a pupil for no good reason 2) he gives me the ick anyway, he's a big presence and I sometimes see him when dropping my child off and I just don't like his demeanor, not sure why.

Do I report this? My child won't be going to this school so I'm not worried about that. More that the Head actually saw this with her own eyes and laughed, so I suspect will be defensive. I then have to walk past her daily, potentially for the next two years. Unfortunately I can't report anonymously as I was the only person walking past at this time.

I'm not suggesting anything more than this has happened, but isn't this a slippery slope? Should a teacher (especially male), be touching pupils necks?

Would appreciate opinions please!

No. I'm saying that calling someone a paedophile is not a joke.

Some excellent points made by posters, especially regarding the clear difference between children and adults, and all totally and utterly missed by the OP.

OP has never been to a sagefuarding training in her life, or if she has, she needs to get her money back.

Never touch a child? What a pile of steaming shite.

That was mutual surely. I personally don’t like it if someone squeezes my shoulders, be them male or female. I don’t do it to others and don’t want it done to me.

the acceptance that teachers are above reproach is very naive

I haven't seen anyone on this thread say that Teachers are above reproach. As a DSL I have raised safeguarding concerns about the behaviour of Teachers in the past, and would do so again in a heartbeat if I had reason to believe a child was at risk. But there is nothing in the OP to suggest that a child is at risk.

There has to be a sensible balance between naively assuming all Teachers are beyond reproach, and assuming that any male teacher who places a hand on a child's shoulder is a risk to them.

well, it's a good thing you aren't a teacher at our school. The poor male teacher in KS1 permanently has a child attached to his leg/arm. He is universally loved by parents and children and the children constantly want to cuddle him. Which is fine becuase they also cuddle the female teachers. DD starts her day with a hug from her (currently) female teachers.... at her request.

I find it strange that you can't type the word sex in full yet collude with your son in using slanderous sexual language about teachers.

You are unaware that kids will refer to adults they find a bit creepy as paedos? Sorry to break it to you but it happens, they do and not just my son. May be some adults need to stop giving off a creepy vibe (and plenty of adults give off those vibes to other adults).

There is a male teacher at my DDs school, he puts his arms around the children, every day he stops them at the school doors, he will have one or 2 hands on their shoulders or across their neck/chest and will not let them go until the appropriate adult collecting them steps forward or he sends them to the back of the queue until someone shows up. He’s doing his safe guarding job making sure they don’t run off without the appropriate adult collecting them.

That actually does seem inappropriate to me. They manage to let kids out only to appropriate parents at our school without being touchy with them. A very occasional hand on arm if someone seems about to run off maybe, but the kids know they are supposed to wait, they don't need holding, mostly the teacher is kind of blocking the door till she spots the parent. Some kids will be really uncomfortable being held like that.

At my kids' primary school the policy is no unnecessary touching. Child initiated contact counted as necessary as long as it wasn't inappropriate. So kid takes teacher's hand in the playground fine, kid hugs teacher fine; first aid fine; steering kid who is about to run off without a parent fine; sideways hug when distressed fine. Walking happy kids across the field doesn't seem necessary so would be against their policy.

It wouldn’t bother me at all. It’s a friendly gesture if that is all there is. Of course we can touch a child on the shoulder! Why not? It’s completely insane and damaging not to have any touch between human beings. We will grow a generation that thinks any touch is inappropriate. If you flip out if someone touches your shoulder you’re the one with a problem.

No it isn't. That poster has weird boundaries by the look of it.

You don't touch your colleagues either?
I'm a nurse and work with other healthcare professionals male and female and if we never hugged or used appropriate touch it would be a very sad place to work.
We deal with a lot of emotionally and physically draining situations where a hug or a simple touch of your arm/shoulder is needed.

My daughters school staff are seen hugging the younger children when they are sad etc we had a child during the school nativity feeling unwell and they were sitting on the teachers knee being comforted (teacher was female)

What you have witnessed the teacher doing, he isn't doing anything wrong

Have you thought there's a reason. Like the girls were mucking about or being silly so he is walking them to where they need to be. Or he was walking some energy off them - in a right let's go this way.
My sons have male and female TA who hug them, do shoulder deep pressure (as calms them), often seen walking with hand on shoulder as reminds them to walk and comforts them - all in mainstream.

And maybe adults need not to collude with references like that.

You seem to already have a problem with this teacher and it could be clouding your judgement. If the Head saw it and laughed, I'm not sure she'll do anything if you report. Clearly they thought it was okay.

His behaviour was not in accordance with a proper safe touch policy. If I was a teacher I would not have behaved this way towards students. As a man he needs to be aware that the vast majority of abuse is perpetrated by men. He is in a position of power so he needs to be aware of this and take extra care in his physical interactions with students. If he makes you feel uneasy then there is probably a reason for this. Of course you will be called a hysterical woman. It was ever thus.

I was the child at the school gates being peeled from mum! I spent the majority of reception sat on my teacher’s lap! I can still remember it I loved her so much. I’m gutted my children will never get to have that close a bond with a teacher. There has to be a better way to navigate this than no touching???

It may well be that these teachers were laughing at the male teacher as he’s a reputation for being handsy and in their minds it’s just a bit of fun to them

But did the girls think it was just a bit of fun?

And why should staff think it is 'a bit of fun' if teachers are 'a bit handsy'?

If young girls don't like the physicality of a male teacher, who is clearly popular with the staff team what can they do about that?

I don't think anyone knows the truth about the situation, but the fact is that teachers have power and children don't. They have to use that power - which includes the power of touch (positive or negative) with great care.

Male teachers have additional power a) because their sex gives them higher status and b) they are, as others have said, a scarce commodity in primary schools.

NB. Lots of people had a 'gut feeling' about Savile, but were told how much he did for charity...

My son is in year 2. When I pick him up, the teacher puts her hands on the shoulders of the child at the front and leans in to ask if they can see their mummy/daddy so they can point them out. It's not something I've ever thought about. Next time I will run over telling them to get their hands off the children 🫡

The situation is different to a male boss. Teachers are in loco parents so affection is a bit more natural. Also, due to the height difference sometimes it's easier to talk to them with a hand on the shoulder etc. To make interactions less intimidating.

Yeah you're not breaking anything to me, I'm not an idiot. Kids do all kinds of things they shouldn't do, that's why parents are there to tell them to cut it out.

It's not okay to "jokingly" refer to someone as a paedophile. If that person is a paedophile then it's not something to joke about, and if that person is not a paedophile then it's seriously damaging.

Dirty bastard, squeezing shoulders!

It must be really hard to be a teacher / teaching assistant. I can’t imagine how awful it would be for him to learn there was a complaint of this nature about him. That could really destroy someone. I am going to assume you just don’t like him and are trying to give him grief. It’s just cruel.

Oh FFS!!! No wonder teachers are leaving the profession. Tbh it just sounds like you don’t like this particular teacher because you don’t like his demeanour.

Said teacher was considered creepy by more than just my son I can tell you. I don’t personally think he was anything dodgy he just had poor boundaries but if those boundaries meant he was known amongst the (senior) kids as the paedo teacher then that’s his own fault. No one has reported him so you can rest in knowledge he’s still teaching and probably still invading students personal spaces but he’s not committing any crimes.

Good grief, who'd be a teacher?

Probably been on some kind of "mini" course that's been given by someone not qualified in child protection and doing nothing more than peddling a few half truths and myths, which do more harm than good. Same as happens with amateur health & safety courses that cause the real/qualified health & safety professionals to despair at all the bullshit "taught" as fact by people who've not got a clue!