Mum friend with possible munchausens by proxy

[Schooldinners1]

What would you do?

I can't go into all the details RN but it's been going on for years.

Constant doctorsce trips in different cities, requesting different hospital when one hospital won't believe here, unexplanable illnesses, lack of diagnosis, mystified specialists, sitting in GP surgery waiting room for hours, hospital waiting room A+E, lots of messages about it all sending people photos.

Teachers suspicious and saying “don't think it's constapation”, doctors refusing to write up letters she's requesting.

Blaming allergies that are unproven and reactions for bad behaviour and constapation for when he's naughty.

Says he can't join in sports or plays because of bib or costume and his “allergies”.

There is always a drama and she seems to get pleasure from telling people about it all. Longer it goes on it looks more and more like her own “accounts” of these things happening.

The doctors stopped listening at a point she then became addicted to the homeopath. Who kept giving “pills” she then kept paying for calls even when on holiday to shamanic therapist cause his behaviour was so bad.

I don't even know when she will stop.

I have a similar situation OP - except the individual I know is the parent/sole carer of a boy with SEN who is now 21. There are a number of us close to that family who are unsettled and think it’s fabricated/induced illness. I could have written much of your original post in terms of presentation. We are at a loss, no one seems to want to listen including social workers and hospitals/doctors can’t seem to follow things up because she moves him from place to place and pays privately. It’s horrendous to see.

My best advise to you is to call your local authority advice and reporting line for social services - a google will find the number - and report a safeguarding concern, you can do it anonymously. Have you spoken to the safeguarding lead at the school?

Well, the only people who seem to listen and give all sorts of tablets are a shamanic practitioner and a homoeopath who she met in the charitable clinic but now pays for privately when she is at her wit's end.

I think people are right to be concerned because it just seems due to his behavioural issues in school she straight away has the defence of it being down to his reactions.

So he hits people, destroys things and throws rocks at others due to his allergies. She will always have an answer to cover up his actions. He can do no wrong in her eyes.

She is now carrying him around as “he's so lethargic” the homeopath just ups the dosage of whatever metals etc she's prescribing.

She has to spoon feed him to eat if he ever does and dress him. It just seems like she enjoys and thrive off the attention and drama of it all and her life revolves around it.

As if nothing in her life is her fault as she's so hard done by having this sick child which no one seems to find the answers for.

Fabricated illness is rare but can be very serious - life limiting / life threatening at it's most extreme. Much more common is parents not being listened to and seeing lots of different professionals before they are taken seriously, a diagnosis is made and the appropriate treatment/support put in place. Somewhere in between will be people who struggle with health anxiety who seek frequent medical advice and need a lot of reassurance.
Have a good think about what you 'know, what have you seen and heard? If you have genuine concerns, then you need to report to children's services. Personally I would not do this anonymously - they may need to contact you to clarify information or ask for more detail.

@ADHDDDDDDDBOOM there's no need to be rude. You are misreading the thread as attacking parents of allergic children because you have an allergic child. When in fact there are multiple MbP/FII/FDIA red flags, and OP does need to report it.

All of this hostility in your posts stems from feeling hostile because you feel personally threatened. But it isn't about you in any way.

My sons school nurse said he was fine when he told her he felt unwell and kept him in school. After school I took him a&e and they had him on morphine for the pain and kept him in. I don't think people on the outside can judge when they don't see everything.

Surely all of this will be recorded in his medical notes and the doctors would have raised suspicions by now?

It's really a bit of a "how long is a piece of string" as far as how rare FII / FDIA is, sadly. There are widely differing estimates, and especially with the explosion of the relatively new phenomenon of "Munchausen's by internet", we may well see this change in our lifetimes. I would hope that better detection systems can develop so that fewer children will suffer, and for shorter times.

Ok, well spoon feeding etc does sound extreme, but you STILL don't get it. She may be wrong about what is making him behave so badly, but something IS, so that needs looking at.

Clearly anyone who could flag/ help, is so busy blaming her, no one is actually doing anything to help the child.

Report it! It’s abuse. That poor child.

There are known red flags for factitious disorder imposed on another (what used to be called Munchausen's by Proxy). That doesn't mean everyone can always assess a situation perfectly, but to some extent, yes, people can judge.

Sadly doctors often hold off on raising suspicions for a whole variety of reasons. Or they do but it doesn't lead to any significant intervention.

I agree too!

Mg daughter had a non ige reaction to cows milk. Her symptoms started a few hours after her first feed. The ONLY reason I was believed was because a health visitor I know (who is not my health visitor) so happened to witness everything. They got in touch with my own health visitor, who got in touch with my GP, who then referred us to an allergist and a dietician. We had been fighting for six months at that point, and a chance interaction was all that got us moving.

My daughter is still under paediatrics for non ige reactions and associated digestive issues (chronic constipation being the main one)

She has definitely reacted to other foods over the years but none of those were ever “official” - most recently, kiwi made her lips swell, so we now avoid kiwi too.

The problem when your child reacts to something is that it’s very difficult to pinpoint WHAT they reacted to. Or what symptoms are allergy related and what are completely unrelated.

Oh, and also, my daughter is still allergic to cows milk, but she can have some cows milk. Work that one out.

She will collect all the hospital appointment letters to show the teachers and school and seems pleased when she hears the likes of “oh you have a lot to deal with”

Then she will say things like “they realise I'm telling the truth, I'm not bulls**ing, look at all the appointments I have to go to, I showed them all”

But there's is no answer or outcomes just appointment after appointment.

It seems she really enjoys the investigation process so when things have gone quiet for him and his tests she then moves on to herself and getting tested for fibro, leg pains, breast lumps, headaches... Whatever that gets her in and out of hospital to have tests done. None of this seems to have diagnosed her ailments either..

EDS, POTS and autoimmune diseases can manifest in that way. Especially if neurodiversity (very common with EDS) is chucked into the mix. They can also take years to diagnose, frequently with the parent being dismissed as a hysterical woman - or, as is all too common now, being accused of abusing her child for benefits and attention. Oh, and if you're the kid who is feeling like crap a lot of the time, it's also emotionally damaging to be told that you don't really feel like crap and aren't genuinely in pain/overwhelmed, Mummy made it all up because she's bad/mad and you're just a lazy, naughty child.

So your well-meaning report could prevent him accessing diagnosis and treatment, result in him being taken into care and her criminalised.

YANBU I know a woman like this. It's terrible as she has ruined her daughter's life. Of course allergies are real and one of my own children has a conditional known to be a favourite of "munchie mums" but doctor shopping and multiple trip to try and get diagnosis isn't. What annoys me about these parents is that they detract from what children with actual medical conditions go through.

@Schooldinners1 Everything you describe is alarming. I would suggest you stop posting more details, and submit it all to school safeguarding person and to social services. There will always be people on sites like this who dismiss the risk of MbP or have personal issues with your concerns. But you are right to be worried - if it turns out she isn't hurting him but just anxious and he is sick, it may even speed up getting them both some more help.

The school reported to social services in this case and after that she was home schooled for 2 years. Now struggling at the local secondary school.

Again, as with some other commenters on the thread, this is a projection of personal experiences onto the situation. There are red flags for MbP/FII/FDIA in what OP describes and there is nothing particularly suggestive of EDS. In fact it's more harmful to genuine EDS patients to bring the condition up in relation to every possible MbP case.

I have decided I will be doing so. Considering he is in swimming and rugby lessons weekly but apparently so weak she has to carry him around and have him in a wheelchair in airport and get a lanyard for him.

Again special attention in the airport and all these people getting around and helping which obviously when she seems the happiest.

Absolutely agree with you. People misguidedly (albeit with kind intentions) white knight for mothers with factitious disorders, and it sadly only further cements the links between factitious behaviours and certain conditions which are regarded as easily faked (and to some extent are relatively easier to acquire a "bad" diagnosis of). I'm not necessarily blaming people who, because of their own trauma, feel the need to do this, but it doesn't help real patients.

Mention it to school and also social services. The poor kid

I realise it hardly counts as a controlled study, but a good % of posters here have dealt with being seen as the mad mother, so maybe we can take that as evidence that it's not just one poster making it about her and her child?

Tbh, I completely understand the slight hysteria-tinged victory of someone believing you when no one else will.

One of my children was ill all the time, and yes, I thought I was going mad because everyone thought I was just "letting him get away with it"... eventually discovered he has a genuine illness that needs careful handling, and he's currently part of a proper hospital study, and suddenly everyone is saying "aren't you marvellous, I don't know how you manage". Having a sick child isn't that tough. 2 years later, in still really scarred by the way I was treated by the school, family, and friends.

Anyway, that's just anecdotal!

I was wrongly accused of FII (new term for munchausens) it was fucking horrendous and so called professionals made stuff up to for their narrative it was awful.

luckiky I had copies of test results and care plans, emails to and from school, things which seemed to ‘disappear’ once it all started). Receipts for medical stuff etc (accused of misappropriating money) and I was able to counter all allegations with proof but it was HELL

@IntoDeepBlueSea But no one is denying that false claims of MbP also exist. It's simply that in this particular case, OP has listed many, many things which are well documented red flags. Dismissing that based on anecdotes is really not responsible or the right thing to do.

There is a related point, which is that linking conditions to MbP accusations by implication and in a generalised and clumsy way is actually harmful to real sufferers of those conditions.

I would turn round and run run run.