Sneaky mums

[Catguru]

I don’t want to be too outing here so NC. I have a 1 year old DC and met a group of mums at NCT in pregnancy, we got on really well although I always felt like a bit of an odd one out (me and my partner had our DC unplanned, had been together the least amount of time and I am the youngest).

During mat leave we all met up very frequently and had a group chat going which was always very active. I struggled a lot in the early days and had a traumatic birth and found the group of new friends priceless as I had no other mum friends who I could speak to about my worries and anxieties, I really thought I’d hit the jackpot with friends here.

fast forward a year and me and my DC have walked into a cafe and have seen them all sat there laughing and joking…. I approached them and was met with awkwardness, stuttering and just sheer embarrassment. It was clear they had planned behind my back and left me out. When questioning them later it turns out they’ve basically said I moan about my problems too much.

is this really my fault? Have I been unlucky and met a group of horrible women? Is my DC going to loose friends in the future because of me and my ways?

I have since met a lovely friend at soft play & another at the barbers whilst getting my DC first hair cut!

Often when you lose one friend unjustly, you get two better ones.

I hope your little one is doing well, OP.

I do think that these groups change a lot around the 9-15 month stage when people head back to work and have more on their plate. It seems to shift from deeper discussions of problems, experiences and issues to more of a playdate with light chitchat.

@candlesflamesandbrooms enjoy! The episode in season 2 where she's lonely and looking for mum friends always made me cry cos I felt exactly like that when my son was a baby. He's 12 now and full of sarcasm and sweetness and we have friends but I always remember the isolating loneliness of being a mum of a baby.
The show made it feel like that was ok, or maybe I was just crazy hormonal watching it first time and it's stuck with me 😂
Either way! Enjoy x

The problem is that first time mums to newborns don’t have a lot in their cup to give to others. I remember how much I struggled and I couldn’t provide much support to anyone except ranting over coffee about how tired I was and my nipples hurt.

If you end up in a larger group friendship in the future try to make sure there are at least two or three who you have a proper deeper connection with away from the group.

Dd started secondary and made a new “friendship” group. Her shoelace came undone and none of them waited for her. She came home ans wisely said “then I realised none of them were really my friends mummy”. So she binned them and found a much nicer group.

OP, that's a horrible thing to happen, but I can see how you can have a miscommunication like that with new friends, who then don't know you well enough to say, hang on you're not the only one here struggling right now, and so it's easier to just cut you out. Doesn't matter that you may have had the 'hardest' birth - someone might be massively struggling with a refluxy baby who doesn't sleep, someone else with stitches that won't heal, someone else's relationship might be collapsing, but if you're not being supportive back, by not giving them any time to air what's going on for them because you're talking about you, you're being just as unsupportive as you think they are.

Bumping into them is not a bad thing. You could get back in - you could send the group apologising, saying that you've thought about what they said, they are right, on reflection you did talk about yourself too much, but you're getting counselling now and you would really like an opportunity to meet up with them again and promise not to be moany.

Then go and see them, but don't talk about yourself. Sit back a bit, and see what the group vibe is like - do you actually like them, what are they chatting about, what are they struggling with? They've met you at your worst - now it's time to show them you at your most friendly.

It's rare to get a second chance with new friends but you've got one. You never know as well, this brutally honest situation might be something you all end up laughing about in 20 years time, having become really close friends. Equally, you might meet them again and realise they aren't really your people. So I wouldn't flounce off thinking you're better off without them as some pp are saying, without giving each other one more chance.

Honestly this sounds like it could have been either one or two options and only you know which is accurate.

1. they’re all mean horrible people who were rude to exclude you and did it because of nasty reasons

or
2) you were overloading the group chat with negative energy whether intentionally or not and they didn’t want to meet up with you in case you brought the meeting down as they wanted it to be light-hearted

I can’t say which one of the two it is. I suspect if two of the women out of three messaged to tell you it’s because you’re always moaning- there may be some truth in that.

Honestly sometimes you just don’t want to deal with negative people and the connection you all had was flimsy at best. So they probably didn’t want to deal with it. I know it’s harsh but they’re not there just to reassure and support you. That expectation right there is where you went off.

It does sound like you’ve had a tough time and need support from real friends or people who have been in similar positions.

I get that. They aren’t newborns anymore they are toddlers, over a year and half.

Do you think there may have been others who felt left out when you split from the main group?

No not at all. It was very much split into 2 due to geographical location, no one was left out. It was either us, or them. And the big group with all of us still met up occasionally. No single person was ever left out, I wouldn’t have let that happen.

It sounds like you’ve had a really hard time OP but these nct mums aren’t there to be therapists and listen to your woes. I think private help could be really helpful for you.

I have found that in groups new people who are negative/down are often avoided, they aren’t friends. They’re relatively new acquaintances and the groups have been so much brighter and relaxed without the struggling party.

As for if this will impact your child? Quite possibly, when mine were at school there were often mums who were avoided in the playground.

Gosh, I hope some posters here don't ever find themselves struggling and feeling down and in need of people to chat to!! The OPs updates clearly show that the group all shared their woes - that's what the NCT group is for surely? In mine, we all had our problems, and we discussed them and helped each other through them at the beginning. I would never have excluded someone because they were having a hard time and wanted to talk about it - I would have encouraged them to talk about it to see if I could help. Our group faded in the end, but we had a good few years pre-school where we were there for each other. This will not impact your child in any way. That's ridiculous. You will find other friends and groups who are more sympathetic, kind and understanding. As a new mum, it is essential to discuss things that are worrying you with others - I often found that mentioning things I was worried about meant that other people opened up about their problems. It made me feel less alone. Your description of what happened doesn't suggest to me at all that you were overly negative and I don't understand the posters who seem to be focusing on this. These people weren't the right people for you and that's ok. You had a hard time and deserved more understanding.

Sorry this happened to you OP, it sounds extremely hurtful the way you found out that you were no longer part of the group. I’m not saying I think you were like this, but there were five women in my NCT group and four of us did end up meeting regularly without the 5th - she was so competitive about every single little thing and was a complete energy drain. Not only that she was pretty bitchy too, making comments about others weight and appearance. It all just got too much.

Normally I would be totally against leaving just one person out but for our collective mental health we kind of had to. I’m sure if she told things from her point of view, we were extremely out of order to stop seeing her, but mine and her kids actually ended up at the same school, and unfortunately for her this woman has managed to alienate most of the school mums with the same types of behaviour all these years later so some people never change.

For your situation OP, if you were going to each other’s weddings and planning holidays together though, there must have been something specific for them to suddenly turn against you. Is one of the group more approachable than the others? Would it be worth meeting them one to one to try and get to the bottom of things?

NCT groups are a little notorious for this unfortunately. It’s a shame when you think you have supportive friends and they aren’t.

However, my rule of thumb - very close friends/family share problems
friend groups that you don’t know well- try to add some value and that means not sharing problems. Wish I had known this earlier!

Don’t worry OP you will meet lots more people at playgroup/nursery/school etc.

Sorry you found out in such a horrible way. Ine friend accused me of moaning about my ex (we get along these days and I hadn’t mentioned him once) and I realised that me mentioning everyday things about my life was apparently uncomfortable for her, even though I wasn’t moaning. People can be strange at times

Just a small thing, you mentioned collective mental well-being so I'm assuming you discussed the issues with others in the group .

Did you ever discuss it with the women you stopped inviting ?

Obviously everyone's entitled to do whatever they want, but I find it honestly baffling that you can discuss the problem with the group. But not with the person you have a issue with ?

I suppose the argument maybe that you didn't want the drama, but then I suppose I would see having a collective discussion about one singular person also drama making.

Whilst hard to hear, be glad they were brave enough to say why you hadn’t been invited. This way it is possible to rebuild the friendship if you agree that your company isn’t always the best. Maybe seeing this group with the mindset of not talking to them about your trauma will lift your spirits. Meanwhile you could look to getting some therapy to overcome the trauma.
I was guilty of being a fun sponge during an incredibly stressful and worrying time and sadly lost a group of friends. They weren’t mean, just moved on. They looked forward to fun times together and I put a dampener on things. I’d do things differently now but it’s history.

Yet another person who clearly hasn’t bothered to read the updates. I had to call them out on it to get any form of answer. Haven’t even heard from one of them, the replied rudely and in a hostile manner and I suspect if I hadn’t of messaged first I wouldn’t have got any answer. I did not ever bring a downer when we met up, it was always fun, laugher and supportive chats.

Hmm, I agree with this.

I bet it's been a horrible experience for you but equally it sounds like they didn't set out to hurt you and in fact were trying to spare your feelings. Friendship is a voluntary thing and if you were really bringing down the group dynamic or directing all the convernsations to your problems then it's ok for them to choose not to want to spend time on that anymore. Sometimes it's easy to get into a bit of a weird dynamic with a particular group, so maybe see if you can reflect on what they have said.

Clearly thta wasn't their experience.

And I agree with PP, when you have small kids you just don't have the extra to give to a needy new friend who brings you down.

It sounds like you weren't their type of person in the beginning. It's no fault of your own and says more about them than you. Your group clearly progressed beyond the regular nct stuff if you kept in contact daily and have attended weddings. That I would consider friendship so the way they excluded you was ride and hurtful.

It will have no bearing on your child and as he moves through playgroups, nursery or school you will meet parents you enjoy having a chat with and some might progress to friendships. If they don't that is OK too. I have two school aged kids who are doing well making friends but I wouldn't say I'm close at all to their parents, I'm pleasant in the playground but almost always in a rush.

*rude

@Catguru you said the other mums said you moaned too much. You need to take it on the chin and accept that you were not the fun company you thought you were. You come across as a bit prickly tbh.

Agree with this. The group lacked empathy and one way to look at it is they got you through maternity leave, now you can look for newer friends more aligned to your interests.
You've been through a very difficult time so this has hit harder than expected and it would be a good idea if you could talk to someone or get some help to come to terms with that difficult time
It doesn't mean you shouldn't be allowed to talk to friends and share the load at all.
This lot were just not in that mind frame and were not that nice really.
I also think that being nearly a decade age difference in the group played a part. Not saying that you can't have friends of different ages. But I know what it is like to be the only one in a to have a significant age gap - when my youngest went to school. You sound like a lively intelligent person who won't have trouble making new friends of any age and will find some friendship groups who are kinder. Enjoy your baby and try not to let this weigh you down.

Obviously everyone's entitled to do whatever they want, but I find it honestly baffling that you can discuss the problem with the group. But not with the person you have an issue with ?

Apart from being an emotional vampire, she said something quite cruel to one of the group and I and another mum did call her out on it but she wasn’t interested - said the offended mum was being over sensitive and doubled down on what she said 🤷🏻‍♀️ Everyone had had enough of her by that point after putting up with her previous comments/behaviour. There was no more to say to her that wouldn’t have just been an unproductive character assassination and I certainly felt it wasn’t my place to do that and had no interest in helping her with self improvement etc. Unfortunately the apple didn’t fall far from the tree and her 7 year old son has got a reputation for being the class bully and other children tend to avoid him.

I thought these girls were here to reassure and help me

This but stood out for me.

It sounds like you were too intense and became complacent about their help.

It’s good that the group provided a support for you when you were a new mum, but it’s not their job to reassure you and help you. It’s lovely when people do that but it sounds like you became dependent on them and they felt stifled by you.