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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To tell pronoun announcing recruiter I don't want the job

430 replies

hursty900 · 23/05/2023 18:43

Had a call with a recruiter today- clearly female name, pic on linked in clearly female & then at start of call she announced 'my pronouns are she/her, may I ask what yours are?'... I mean she was polite, but it just seemed ridiculously performative (I too am clearly female) & has made me question if I want to work for this organisation. I have nothing against trans people etc I just really bristle with all the over the top performative stuff.. Am I just totally out of touch? My current company does not have any kind of stance in this area which I guess is terrible if you are one to name their pronouns..tbh I've got enough shit going on to have to explain my preferred pronouns to everyone I meet!

OP posts:
hursty900 · 23/05/2023 22:33

Chevybaby · 23/05/2023 22:10

During my next recruitment drive I’ll be sure to ask this question to put off all the small minded/bigoted applicants 😂

Good luck with what's left

OP posts:
BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 22:34

Allblackeverythingalways · 23/05/2023 22:19

My pronouns are try/me
Or alternatively use your eyes

You know how pronouns work, right?!
If so I think you'd get a bit bored in RL of "All Black said try was going to me grandma's tomorrow, said try was taking some of me cake."
Outside of saying it on MN for comedy value in the hope of amusing other pronoun refusers

eurochick · 23/05/2023 22:40

@Chevybaby you'd be on thin ice - gender critical beliefs are protected beliefs under the Equality Act (confirmed by the Forstater judgment). Are you planning to weed out Hindus and lesbians too, or are other protected characteristic ok?

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 22:40

TooOldForThisNonsense · 23/05/2023 22:27

Well I’m an actual female, no one has ever got my sex wrong

Lucky you then, passing the "pretty enough to be a real woman" test 🙄 Biscuit
I've been told I look like a bloke before.
Think they needed a trip to Specsavers personally.

Timesawastin · 23/05/2023 22:41

hursty900 · 23/05/2023 18:43

Had a call with a recruiter today- clearly female name, pic on linked in clearly female & then at start of call she announced 'my pronouns are she/her, may I ask what yours are?'... I mean she was polite, but it just seemed ridiculously performative (I too am clearly female) & has made me question if I want to work for this organisation. I have nothing against trans people etc I just really bristle with all the over the top performative stuff.. Am I just totally out of touch? My current company does not have any kind of stance in this area which I guess is terrible if you are one to name their pronouns..tbh I've got enough shit going on to have to explain my preferred pronouns to everyone I meet!

Do as you wish. They'll have dodged a bullet, as they appear to run an inclusive workplace.

StellaAndCrow · 23/05/2023 22:43

Hairbrushhandle · 23/05/2023 20:17

"ah I actually don't bring my whole self to work so I like to keep my pronouns to myself"

Yes, this! They do well to tolerate the amount of myself that I DO bring - they really wouldn't want the rest of me!

StellaAndCrow · 23/05/2023 22:45

Timesawastin · 23/05/2023 22:41

Do as you wish. They'll have dodged a bullet, as they appear to run an inclusive workplace.

An inclusive workplace that would not want employees who don't want to express "preferred pronouns"?

IWilloBeACervix · 23/05/2023 22:51

Mumtobabyhavoc · 23/05/2023 21:46

A few responses from others to my last reply.
This is a very charged issue that has many subparts that would need to be addressed separately. I'm not informed enough, nor eloquent enough, to address it in the thorough manner it deserves. We're all wading through though, aren't we. As a first step all I can do is respect a person by addressing them as they wish and show solidarity by stating my own pronouns. I feel quite lucky that my brain matches my anatomy. I cannot imagine what it must be like to have grown up looking in a mirror thinking, God got this wrong. I liken the issue around trans identity (?) to gay rights, to voting rights, property rights, employment rights, segregation, all previous fights really, in which some marginalized group fought for recognition and standing and suffered abuse by society, those in power and those supporting the power structures of the time . All I can do is accept things are changing and choose how to respond and for me, I am trying to do that thoughtfully and respectfully. I certainly don't have all the answers.

How can your brain not match your anatomy? Is your brain not a part of your anatomy? Do you keep it in a jar?

Didimum · 23/05/2023 22:58

hursty900 · 23/05/2023 22:31

It's 'You're'
And how am I being performative?
And as for that person you cite who is clearly female but wants to be a 'them' ... well I don't have time for that nonsense either.

Ah the grammatical slight. Good one.

You’re being performative because you’re making a song and dance about a simple, quick question. Not every question is designed to for your specific worldview.

You probably won’t be welcome at the organisation you’re interviewing for anyway, so save yourself the trouble.

RoseslnTheHospital · 23/05/2023 22:59

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 22:40

Lucky you then, passing the "pretty enough to be a real woman" test 🙄 Biscuit
I've been told I look like a bloke before.
Think they needed a trip to Specsavers personally.

Women don't need to be "pretty enough" to be identified as female. No idea why you think attractiveness is a defining quality of being female. Women have a different body shape to men, regardless of variation within the class of women. Women walk differently to men because of the differences in skeletons and how the tendons and muscles connect, and because of the differences in fat distribution. Etc etc. In nearly all cases, sex can be correctly identified with ease.

Didimum · 23/05/2023 23:00

StellaAndCrow · 23/05/2023 22:45

An inclusive workplace that would not want employees who don't want to express "preferred pronouns"?

There’s no evidence they aren’t also respectful of people who don’t wish to express their pronouns.

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:02

RoseslnTheHospital · 23/05/2023 22:59

Women don't need to be "pretty enough" to be identified as female. No idea why you think attractiveness is a defining quality of being female. Women have a different body shape to men, regardless of variation within the class of women. Women walk differently to men because of the differences in skeletons and how the tendons and muscles connect, and because of the differences in fat distribution. Etc etc. In nearly all cases, sex can be correctly identified with ease.

Women don't need to be "pretty enough" to be identified as female. No idea why you think attractiveness is a defining quality of being female.
I know that as well as you do you clearly missed the 🙄 and biscuit at the end of my comment, to note the tone and sarcasm

TooOldForThisNonsense · 23/05/2023 23:04

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 22:40

Lucky you then, passing the "pretty enough to be a real woman" test 🙄 Biscuit
I've been told I look like a bloke before.
Think they needed a trip to Specsavers personally.

I’m not pretty in the slightest. But I’m still very evidently a female. I look like one, sound like one, have a name that I’ve only heard used for females.

Mumtobabyhavoc · 23/05/2023 23:05

RoseslnTheHospital · 23/05/2023 22:59

Women don't need to be "pretty enough" to be identified as female. No idea why you think attractiveness is a defining quality of being female. Women have a different body shape to men, regardless of variation within the class of women. Women walk differently to men because of the differences in skeletons and how the tendons and muscles connect, and because of the differences in fat distribution. Etc etc. In nearly all cases, sex can be correctly identified with ease.

I think you're overstating to say nearly all cases.

TooOldForThisNonsense · 23/05/2023 23:05

And even if I was to be mistaken on occasion for a male, I’d just assume whoever got it wrong had made a mistake or was a bit daft, certainly not that I somehow wasn’t visibly a woman or needed to start announcing my pronouns

IamSlave · 23/05/2023 23:06

@WhateverHappenedToMe
Perfect.

Also agree with poster which says going along with this shit helps it become ingrained.

I'm liberal if people want to whatever fine but don't impact me.

The onus is on them to announce it

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:07

Didimum · 23/05/2023 22:58

Ah the grammatical slight. Good one.

You’re being performative because you’re making a song and dance about a simple, quick question. Not every question is designed to for your specific worldview.

You probably won’t be welcome at the organisation you’re interviewing for anyway, so save yourself the trouble.

Not every question is designed to for your specific worldview.
That's how I see it - I'm.currently applying for jobs and one the other day for a well known banking organisation asked lots of what some people on here might take objection with
There was Do you identify as transgender? Answer- no.
Are you black British? No.
Do you identify as the sex you were born? Yes.
I'm perfectly aware that others aren't me though, and might answer differently.
Not everyone is the same, we're all individual.

RoseslnTheHospital · 23/05/2023 23:08

@BodgerLovesMashedPotato the problem with emojis to represent meaning is that they are left to the reader's interpretation, and you assume that all of us reading are adept at guessing your intentions from those emojis. I did not interpret your use of the eye roll to mean that you meant the exact opposite of what you wrote. Nor do I really know what the biscuit one means. Seems to be used to mean "shut up and go away" by lots of posters.

echt · 23/05/2023 23:09

You’re being performative because you’re making a song and dance about a simple, quick question. Not every question is designed to for your specific worldview

Nice one. Trivialise the legitimate objections of the OP.

The question is laden with worldview implications and the recruiter wanted a specific response which requires a world view/attitude on the part of the OP.

Mumtobabyhavoc · 23/05/2023 23:09

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:02

Women don't need to be "pretty enough" to be identified as female. No idea why you think attractiveness is a defining quality of being female.
I know that as well as you do you clearly missed the 🙄 and biscuit at the end of my comment, to note the tone and sarcasm

Isn't it?
I've heard countless comments towards women who don't look like "women" behind their backs and to their faces.

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:10

Nor do I really know what the biscuit one means
It means not even worthy of a proper response.
Stems from the Gordon Brown webchat on here of refusing to state his biscuit preference if I remember correctly!

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:11

Mumtobabyhavoc · 23/05/2023 23:09

Isn't it?
I've heard countless comments towards women who don't look like "women" behind their backs and to their faces.

Yes, same

TooOldForThisNonsense · 23/05/2023 23:13

ThinWomansBrain · 23/05/2023 22:01

A friend of mine is non-binary they/them.
From looks & voice, most people would assume female, as I did initially.
I personally find announcing pronouns or having them on an email footer a bit weird - but if it makes some people feel more comfortable & accepted, then why not?
Just state she/her and move on.

But they are still female, given there are only 2 sexes 😬

TooOldForThisNonsense · 23/05/2023 23:15

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:11

Yes, same

I’ve seen that come primarily from TRAs, ie MtF transwomen, trying to make out they are more womanly than actual women.

Mumtobabyhavoc · 23/05/2023 23:15

BodgerLovesMashedPotato · 23/05/2023 23:11

Yes, same

And in schools and workplaces to this day.
Which, to me, necessitates equating women's/womyn's/lgbtq+/etc rights. We're on the same side.