Ignore and block childminder?

[Avatari]

Several months ago we started looking for childcare and nursery options were not looking great. We managed to find a woman who would come to the house and babysit from 9-5. 2 months before starting she said she would agree to £11.50 an hour to baby sit 1 yr old. The week before she was due she told us her husband said she couldn't work for less than £13 so we agreed. As we were pretty stuck at that point, I was back at work in 5 days with no alternative.

She hasn't been great. At one point she told us on the Sunday she wouldn't be available that week. Then would get annoyed when we told her there were school holidays so we wouldn't need her. We have been looking for alternative care and managed to get a nursery place starting next week. We told her as soon as we knew, end of April that wed only need her 3 more weeks. So this week should have been her last week. Except we have covid. So told her we wouldn't need her.
We were intending to send her a gift to thank her for her help and send her this week's money.

EXCEPT she has just sent a message to DH saying that we need to pay for June and July as we had a contract. There was no contract. We never specified when we would need her until. She also said she was a single mother and has three children. She has repeatedly told us about her husband.

We are now inclined to not offer to pay this week just ignore and block now. But just wanted thoughts that this is reasonable and reassurance that she hasn't got a leg to stand on.

Agree.

I’d also anonymously shop her for benefit fraud to the DWP.

Pay her. I think you messed up here - you don’t actually get to decide if she is a nanny or not. It is defined and in that case you needed to be paying tax etc. from the gov website.
You’re usually considered the employer of a nanny, housekeeper, gardener or anyone else who works in your home if both:

• you hire them
• they’re not self-employed or paid through an agency

This means you have certain responsibilities, like meeting the employee’s rights and deducting the right tax. You cannot ask your employee to become self-employed.

This sounds all very haphazard and there are faults on both sides. She isn't a childminder she is a nanny on an hourly employed rate. The contract should have been clear from the start about holiday arrangements. Pay her the extra week. Not her fault you have Covid.

Seriously? Because someone on Mumsnet said she is probably on benefits but you have absolutely zero evidence.

This. You trusted someone enough to look after your precious child but didn't want to pay her for school holidays or illness. She can't pop another child into your place when you aren't there. Nursery will charge you for absolutely everything . Brace yourself for a rude awakening.

Not RTFT but in the eyes of the law it is my understanding that where no written Contract exists, if payment can be traced, even by cash withdrawal or proven by text exchange, this can be considered as employment.

To clarify, in certain situations. Not all!

Sounds like she is cash in hand to avoid tax or to maximize benefits top ups/income. Does with another family too.

You liked cash in hand since cheaper and saved you doing it correctly. The black economy is thriving.

You should pay her the last week since she worked and then that's it. No idea about contracts but if she is 'working on the side' and not declaring then she won't take it further.

Your children are precious don't go cheap. The McCanns went cheap, in an apartment unsupervised and unlocked each night whilst they wined and dined and looked what happened to them. They will forever regret not paying someone to sit them properly.

Just pay her the last week when you had covid. Don't pay her June or July. Sounds like she doesn't declare any of the cash she receives from any of her work so most likely not paying any tax or NI. Also sounds like she is not really a single mum. The likelihood of her contacting HMRC to report you is approximately nil as she would be dropping herself in it and if she did that you can just report her back, to both HMRC and benefits and she would be in trouble with both. Also, if you have been paying her in cash then likely she has no concrete proof (such as receipts of invoice) and any text messages etc would land her in it with HMRC/benefits so don't worry. Sounds like it would be a much bigger risk for her than you to be honest as she has likely been not declaring for a lot longer than you may have failed to pay tax and would affect her ongoing work with other families.

I think the general consensus is that you found someone you could exploit to look after your baby and that you employed her illegally. You are now planning to further exploiting her in avoiding paying her for the notice period. It's extraordinary that you have so little self awareness that you have posted on a public thread expecting that your actions would be endorsed. She wasn't a baby sitter - no one baby sits for 8 hours a day. You wanted cheap childcare and you found someone vulnerable and open to exploitation to achieve it. Shame on you.

Pay her for the week. Definitely.

@Dedodee that's actually the appropriate thing for them to have done - usually a solicitor is considered as administering swears / witnessing signatures in their personal capacity and so they are paid, not the firm. It's the policy of every firm I know (even large city firms) that the individual is paid. Unlikely he'd be set up to take cards!

I'd pay her the week wage, block her and move on.
I can't see her reporting you as she is clearly claiming all sorts of benefits hense only wanting cash in hand.

It was a bit of a disaster but we basically put up with it

you’re paying the woman cash in hand. You made your bed, stop complaining your slave isn’t up to standards.

Absolutely. You’re illegal as hell and now claiming to be a victim.

There's no such thing as a "casual agreement" when it comes to regular daytime childcare. I am amazed you thought this would work.

If she isn’t then she’s got nothing to worry about 👍

She was not exploited. She told us what days she could work, what pay she wanted and was very clear that she was able to work when she could just as we were clear that she was only needed when I wasn't available.

It was not cheap, we were paying her more per day than any other person I know and we couldn't claim the tax free childcare. Our nursery costs will be cheaper for 3 days than she was for 2. She was an expensive short term option which suited her as it has done with multiple other families.

I didn't expect my actions to be endorsed, I felt the not paying her this week was unfair and an emotional response to a threatening text from her. I have accepted the consensus on here and we have offered to pay her this week. Seeing out the end of her notice period which was three times longer than one week as would be expected.

I have also said we are happy to report it to HMRC admit our fault/naivety and pay any NI due.

She doesn’t sound great but I think you don’t have experience of hiring people - you are just saying you don’t need her is during covid so you won’t pay her. Can you imagine if your boss did that to you - actually don’t come in next week and you won’t be paid for that week. People have set bills each month and need to rely on a set income.

Babysitters can work at any time of the day

She told us what days she could work, what pay she wanted and was very clear that she was able to work when she could just as we were clear that she was only needed when I wasn't available.

I really struggle to believe that you'd pay through the nose for something as unreliable and inconsistent as this. And if it is true, why do you then describe it in your OP as her "not being great", if it's what you agreed to in the first place?

She sounds a bit flakey and unreliable but you are worse. Best for everyone, not least your child, that you're knocking the nanny (not "babysitter") arrangement on the head and going the nursery route.

Btw, what arrangements do nurseries have in place vis-a-vis parents not wanting to use/pay for childcare during school holidays, the summer, etc?

Contact HMRC , say
"Dear HMRC I have decided on a person I would like to engage to care for our child during working hours. Please could you clarify my obligations re payment of tax and any other deductions.
As I have used this person already a few times on a casual basis, could you also clarify if any payments by me are outstanding for this period? I am happy to provide any details you require"

That covers you.

Then write to childminder/whatever she is job-title wise, say
"Dear Childminder
Thanks for your message. I have contacted HMRC to clarify both our obligations, and apologise if there is a delay. I am of course paying you for hours worked, but also need to wait to hear back from them so that I can organise correct pay records for what you have earned. "

You wont be in any trouble whatsoever if you do this, but she might.
Hey ho. That's how she chose to work.

We pay the nursery 50 weeks a year regardless of whether baby is in or not. I thought that was standard?

Presumably the whole thing is a result of there being a huge shortage of nursery places. And from the sound of it this woman is regularly employed by desperate parents. I guess the alternative is OP loses her job.
Yet another result of the inadequate Tory government.