Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Why is it ok to be violent and insulting to a woman who makes a mistake.

339 replies

whatisgoingonintheworld · 10/05/2023 14:26

A female calls a person 'lady' in error because she thought the person was female. The person identifies as non binary. The trans manager then verbally insults and finally physically assaults the woman and the man outside.

Is this really what we have come to. A simple word and the non binary is upset and so the trans person can kick a customer from the shop, purposefully insult and then assault.

So is misgendering (even by accident) so serious it merits verbal abuse and physical violence? I mean it isn't even obvious whether the person she called 'lady' behind the counter is non binary, looks female. The trans woman manager looks male and certainly acts it!

Why are so many trans women displaying what was formally seen as masculine traits (violence) now that they identify as female.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
Boudicasbeard · 10/05/2023 21:39

This whole thing is the epitome of that Greer quote:

Men are afraid women will laugh at them
Women are afraid men will
kill them.

Women are always on the look out for male
violence and certain types of men are on the look out for women who challenge their sense of entitlement and superiority.

Emotionalsupportviper · 10/05/2023 21:41

@Boudicasbeard
To those I would add "Women have no idea how much men hate them."

She was spot on.

EveryWitchWaybutLoose · 10/05/2023 21:47

And another thing that the wonderful Professor Greer said, about 20 years ago:

Women are not just men without penises.

Badgeringabout · 10/05/2023 22:14

No indeed - according to idiots like Starmer, women can be men WITH penises.

CosimoPiovasco · 10/05/2023 22:15

Badgeringabout · 10/05/2023 22:14

No indeed - according to idiots like Starmer, women can be men WITH penises.

Or men can be Women WITH penises…even…

GailBlancheViola · 10/05/2023 22:22

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 10/05/2023 19:21

@SunnyEgg - trans rights activists would say that a trans woman who has been ‘misgendered’ has a perfect right to shout at, abuse, threaten and even assault the person who misgendered them.

According to TRAs, anyone who does not bow down to their fantasies and validate their identities should die in a grease fire, or be raped or beheaded. Wearing a t-shirt that advocates violence against TERFs, and has a blood spatter pattern all over it, is absolutely fine - and sweetly feminine to boot. Doxxing people who disagree with them, hounding them out of jobs, censoring anyone who does not toe the trans women are women party line - all current tactics of the TRAs.

For once the job loss hit them which makes a refreshing change.

Shelefttheweb · 10/05/2023 22:32

CosimoPiovasco · 10/05/2023 22:15

Or men can be Women WITH penises…even…

No they can’t.

maddening · 10/05/2023 22:49

FisherthemsFriend · 10/05/2023 14:52

I might be wrong but I think both staff members are non-binary.

But how a person perceives themselves is largely something a customer cannot.disern from the retail transaction and tbh is irrelevant to the transaction.

Sickoffamilydrama · 10/05/2023 23:17

PollyPeptide · 10/05/2023 18:22

But you were defending your friend from serious injury. You weren't arguing over a coffee. If that massive man was attacking you with a bin over a coffee, would you have stayed and argued?

Your right I wouldn't argue over coffee as I hate it but I might argue over tea.

My point is that none of us really knows how we will react.

I might have just walked away, probably the younger me would have.

But....

I can also easily see that if someone was calling me a bigot/ phobic whatever in public over a simple coffee order that it would press my buttons enough that I would argue back doesn't matter how frightened I was.

Also for some women especially ones like me that have a bit of life experience and seen the devastation that male violence can cause we are angry and I personally find it much harder to walk away from an aggressive male than I used to, I've had enough of them and I won't take anymore.

CosimoPiovasco · 11/05/2023 00:25

Shelefttheweb · 10/05/2023 22:32

No they can’t.

You need to read the post I was commenting on.
The post I was commenting on was quoting Starmer saying this. But the pp got the man and women the wrong way round
Read my previous comments, do u really think I agree with this!

Mummyoflittledragon · 11/05/2023 05:27

Ilovetea42 · 10/05/2023 14:35

I mean I've watched the video - the manager was not violent towards the woman and they attempted to remove the phone from the other customer who was recording them. If someone was trying to record me out of context without my consent likely to put on social media with their own spin I 100% would be angry and want them to stop recording. I also think it's impossible to know the context from a 50 second video. I think it's fair for customers to be asked to leave for abusing staff whether due to race/ gender/disability etc and I think it's fair for a manager to defend their staff team. We have only one side of the story here which is the person who was being asked to leave and their husband who was filming so it's hardly an impartial article is it? We've no way to know if they repeatedly do this, if they did it on purpose, if they come in regularly and are difficult towards staff etc.

The vast majority of trans and non binary people understand that misunderstandings will happen and usually all that's expected is an apology and correct gendering going forwards. Its highly unlikely that's what happened here.

Those are a lot expectations and none of them required by British law.

Why exactly is an apology expected?

Helleofabore · 11/05/2023 07:09

I find it disconcerting that some posters can watch that video and think that a male standing over a female person by a foot or so, abusing her is not considered intimidating and an act of violence because of that intimidation.

And that this male person merely attempted to ‘physically remove the phone’ is again not considered a violent act (assault). And yet, some posters view saying ‘this lady’ in reference to a female staff member as ‘abuse’.

And that is just from the video alone. If the male staff member did indeed upend her handbag, and physically touch her to ‘remove’ her from the store and shove her, then I do expect that the police will be laying charges.

The lack of symmetry here is very clear and it lacks being based in reality. I wonder if the posters who believe that this male staff member was ‘non violent’ in the video under the prejudicial view they have and why they have that prejudicial view?

Shelefttheweb · 11/05/2023 07:30

Sickoffamilydrama · 10/05/2023 23:17

Your right I wouldn't argue over coffee as I hate it but I might argue over tea.

My point is that none of us really knows how we will react.

I might have just walked away, probably the younger me would have.

But....

I can also easily see that if someone was calling me a bigot/ phobic whatever in public over a simple coffee order that it would press my buttons enough that I would argue back doesn't matter how frightened I was.

Also for some women especially ones like me that have a bit of life experience and seen the devastation that male violence can cause we are angry and I personally find it much harder to walk away from an aggressive male than I used to, I've had enough of them and I won't take anymore.

Also remember this woman had paid for her coffee/cake and was being told to leave without either her coffee/cake or a refund. They had stolen £10 from her.

Swrigh1234 · 11/05/2023 07:35

Why are so many trans and non binary folk so entitled, abusive and misogynistic? Why them specifically, more so than regular men. Why do they seem to have a chip on their shoulder? Every time you see them on any platform, they are shouting hysterically, accusing others of stuff, using ridiculous analogies like misgendering people is like genocide. What mid actually going on here?

StarbucksKaren · 11/05/2023 07:39

Shelefttheweb · 11/05/2023 07:30

Also remember this woman had paid for her coffee/cake and was being told to leave without either her coffee/cake or a refund. They had stolen £10 from her.

@Shelefttheweb yes no one seemed to be making any attempt to progress the order she’d paid for.

As if the verdict on her alleged transphobia was going to determine whether she should be granted the food and drink she’d just paid for.

Disturbing on so many levels

cushioncovers · 11/05/2023 07:47

The manager thought he was untouchable and could behave like a petulant child. Glad he's fired.

LakieLady · 11/05/2023 07:54

TheFluffiestHobo · 10/05/2023 14:42

If you require a special pronoun then you need to get a badge to inform people of it.

I was thinking along those lines, but I was thinking of armbands: pink if you want to be treated as female, blue for male, and beige for the gender neutrals.

I'm also at a loss as to how someone can be transphobic towards someone they don't know is trans.

SunnyEgg · 11/05/2023 07:56

LakieLady · 11/05/2023 07:54

I was thinking along those lines, but I was thinking of armbands: pink if you want to be treated as female, blue for male, and beige for the gender neutrals.

I'm also at a loss as to how someone can be transphobic towards someone they don't know is trans.

Sounds lovely and Orwellian

LakieLady · 11/05/2023 07:57

Swrigh1234 · 11/05/2023 07:35

Why are so many trans and non binary folk so entitled, abusive and misogynistic? Why them specifically, more so than regular men. Why do they seem to have a chip on their shoulder? Every time you see them on any platform, they are shouting hysterically, accusing others of stuff, using ridiculous analogies like misgendering people is like genocide. What mid actually going on here?

Transmen can be just as bad. A friend had a dreadful (and utterly ridiculous) saga with a transman colleague, which ended in friend getting a written warning.

The transman transitioned back to being female again a couple of months later, too.

StarbucksKaren · 11/05/2023 08:13

cushioncovers · 11/05/2023 07:47

The manager thought he was untouchable and could behave like a petulant child. Glad he's fired.

@cushioncovers I’m glad he lost his job too. For actual abuse and violence.

Enough people have been cancelled or lost their jobs or been forced out for alleged ‘violence’ or hate crimes like misgendering or gc views - that as you say - the manager thought he was untouchable when he took this stance with the customer

doubleoseven · 11/05/2023 08:16

Oh well he's now unemployed and likely unemployable since his violent and aggressive behaviour is all over the Internet.
Actions have consequences, enjoy your beans on toast on mate, you'll be eating them for a while, no Starbucks for you 😂.

StarbucksKaren · 11/05/2023 08:24

😂😂😂

AlisonDonut · 11/05/2023 08:28

Swrigh1234 · 11/05/2023 07:35

Why are so many trans and non binary folk so entitled, abusive and misogynistic? Why them specifically, more so than regular men. Why do they seem to have a chip on their shoulder? Every time you see them on any platform, they are shouting hysterically, accusing others of stuff, using ridiculous analogies like misgendering people is like genocide. What mid actually going on here?

Cross sex [AKA not real] hormones affect your brain and add a sense of entitlement and it is a perfect storm.

lifeturnsonadime · 11/05/2023 09:03

Swrigh1234 · 11/05/2023 07:35

Why are so many trans and non binary folk so entitled, abusive and misogynistic? Why them specifically, more so than regular men. Why do they seem to have a chip on their shoulder? Every time you see them on any platform, they are shouting hysterically, accusing others of stuff, using ridiculous analogies like misgendering people is like genocide. What mid actually going on here?

Because they've been led to believe that they MUST be validated or the non validator is committing an act of literal violence.

So they have a special status.

Anyone who denies their identity is a bigot.

They are entitled to go into spaces which match their identity and any one who questions it is a bigot.

If they go to university they may have seen signs like this one - https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/university-plymouth-criticised-over-trans-6988584

If they have come though the UK school system they will have been told that they whole class has to comply with their pronouns and if they don't lie about their sex they will get in trouble.

They have seen universities cancel and deplatform middle age women for 'wrong think'.

Basically this ideology has become a licence for entitled young people to believe that their identity is more important than everyone else's reality and that any person (especially women) who doesn't go along with it is far right, aligned with Nazis, committing an act of literal violence, deserves to be cancelled etc etc.

University of Plymouth criticised over trans poster in toilets

Angry debate erupts over University of Plymouth's toilet signs which say "trans, non-binary and gender-questioning students" have "every right" to be in any bathroom

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/university-plymouth-criticised-over-trans-6988584

Emotionalsupportviper · 11/05/2023 09:07

SunnyEgg · 11/05/2023 07:56

Sounds lovely and Orwellian

With a hint of Aldous Huxley.