To think this is outrageous from the school?

[HarryViles]

DS is just 4. He is at pre-school attached to a private school. He had an awful first few months there - very unsettled and unable to concentate - to the point where he is now on waiting list for ASD diagonsis as the pre-school's recommendation.

However, the last few months he has been doing so well. They have always been a little cold but they are professional and followed the local authority's advice and he has responded very well. They tell me all the time how much progress he is making and friends/familiy comment on the incrase in confidence/verbal etc.

Long story short - I went to a meeting today to see about him going to reception to the school in Sep this year - I know they have places.

(He does have a space at a local state school which seems great - just big class sizes but lovely kids and teachers)

The private school told me they couldn't cater for him as well as the state system, and that 'kids like him are better suited in the state system because they have the resources'. They said 'those schools can do things like sensory rooms, breakout areas, and with additional funding can provide 121 support - we can't and won't do any of that as we simply don't have the resources' (the fees are £20k plus a year). The Senco then said "it's not our fault the government don't give us additional money for kids with challenges".

They also said "our governors want us to be more competitive academically, so they are going to invest in that, not support for kids who are strugglign. sorry to be blunt but that's the way it is"

Obviously I don't want him to go there now. We can't barely afford the fees by the way but he's really doing well there - he has friends, he runs in every day, he comes home and tells me what he's learnt - the change in his is enormous so would sell a leg to continue that if I could.

They keep telling me how bright and funny he is, and then when I say about him staying they say "no no, kids like yours aren't catered for here"

He's barely 4 years old.

Isnt' that discrimantory? I feel angry. I know he won't go there. But can private schools basically do what the F they like?

As distressing as it is it’s better they told you upfront rather than take your money but not provide the service. You can use the money you save for extra therapies while he’s at the local school. Local schools are better for socialising too as it’s better for him to make friends with kids who live near you.

Agree with this

Despite all the threads claiming that their child needs to go private to met SEN the reality is - private schools can do what they want, they're businesses NOT charities despite their tax break charity status.
Some private schools do accept kids with SEN needs, if you'r desperate to pay private, do some research.
Otherwise it sounds like you have the choice of a decent state school who will be less concerned about other parents being upset a SEN kid is in the class.

'Private schools can afford it more than state schools, sadly some just don’t want to. '

This, I'm afraid. Of course they can cater to your sons needs, they just don't want to.

It is the unpalatable truth regarding private schools, they filter. Any chance a child will not get great results or will be a distraction and they are out. They discriminate.

It's better to know now I guess. Personally I think they should take whoever pays but they are focused on results results so that people continue to pay. I guess that makes sense as a business model.

“They also said "our governors want us to be more competitive academically, so they are going to invest in that, not support for kids who are strugglign. sorry to be blunt but that's the way it is"

I knew this was going to be the reason why before I even read it. This is how many private schools operate to justify their ridiculous fees. Oh look at what a great school we are.

Private schools are scared that having a child with SEN will lead to complaints from other parents and consequent loss of pupils. Usually from the perception that the child with SEN is taking more than their fair share of resources even if, as often, there are no behaviour problems. .

My dd got kicked out of private preschool, my friends dc got kicked out of private school at 6. It's common

Agreed. They should be abolished. Tax the rich more and invest more in the state school system instead. I think (hope) Labour take action against private schools when they get in next year.

Unfortunately private schooling isn’t about fairness OP

You asked if you should get the ball rolling with an EHCP. Yes.

There is so much burying of heads in the sand on this thread. Claiming that school were honest! A school that says that state schools get resources to support children with SEND. That's not honesty - it's either a lie or a sign that they're completely misinformed. Get the EHCP process started. If they agree to assess, then the current school can give lots of info about his needs, given they've seen enough to decide he's not good enough for them.

Once he is in a state school, his needs will likely put him way down the SENCO's priority list, as there will almost certainly be other children who have far more significant needs than described.

I’m looking at this from another angle. At least they have told you now that they lack the resources rather than your son starting reception and you slowly realising that they do not have adequate provision and then have to go through the upheaval of moving after settling. My dc’s school is non selective but they do sometimes take parents aside before they move up a stage in schooling to say “sorry, this is not the best place - we are unable to provide what your child needs”. At private we have to pay for every extra bit of coaching our child receives (£65/hour). I’ve had kids through state primary too - I really think they do cater better for those with additional needs…and you could use the money you save to potentially fund further help for your dc. I know it feels horrible to be ‘pushed out’ but in the long run it’s far better your child goes somewhere that caters to his needs best!

Ugh, this is one of my many problems with private schools.

They get great results because they weed out anyone that they even suspect might have academic challenges, at the age of 4, which is absurd.

So people look at the published results and think the teaching is better when in fact it's that they have kicked kids out along the way....

Keep your 20K a year and use it for other things. If you have a good state school it's money down the drain anyway, do you really want your child in a school that is so discriminatory and heartless?

(And once you remove the doctored 'results' the benefits of an expensive education aren't even proven, it depends on the individual and their entire environment, not just the school.)

I’m very surprised someone in education told you not to mention their possible additional needs. You need to know that the school is suitable for him & that they have great facilities for a child with ASD. By not discussing it with them you’ll have no idea about what support they can provide etc etc. I wouldn’t be taking that advice. My son has autism & goes to a special school. Fist off he went to one for profound needs then moved to one for moderate needs once he became verbal (at almost 7) & started showing improvements in how he copes etc.

Even looking around specialist provision we talked in depth about how they could meet his needs as not all SEN schools can cope with all types of SEN, let alone mainstream schools.

You could apply for an EHCP yourself but likely won’t get anywhere just yet without the evidence needed. My boy was at nursery in a SEN school after two private nurseries couldn’t cope with him & he still needed a huge amount of assessments to get his ECHP. The waiting list for ASD diagnosis was so long that we had the EHCP before his formal diagnosis.

He was assessed by the school, by the paediatrician, by an educational physiologist, by a physiotherapist who all provided the information needed for the EHCP. It was his school who co-ordinated & arranged all that with the local LA.

I couldn’t imagine not discussing needs with a school prior to applying as you’ll need their support massively in order to facilitate the EHCP & diagnosis process. Of course you can apply yourself but from experience LA’s don’t do much without the evidence to support

Good luck!

They are institutionally ableist. It's appalling but your child is better off out of there.

If you have resources such as this level of fees you will be able to compensate for the deficits of the state system in supporting SEND kids.

I put you are unreasonable because horrible as it is they are being honest about not being able to meet his needs, and well, what do you expect, its the system you were buying into.

Some private schools are very academic and competitive. This is clearly one of them.
Others are fantastic for additional needs and are much more inclusive.

Try not to take it personally. This school is not a good fit for your child. That's all, and they've been honest enough to tell you, rather than taking your money and failing to give him the education he deserves.

I'm a teacher at a junior school and we get that a lot unfortunately. Most of the time children's special needs are linked to speech and language difficulties or dyslexia - hardly difficult to make adjustments for and requiring simple, easily available interventions.

The most 'challenging' child we had was deaf, they had hearing aids so their teachers needed to wear a transmitter & they needed some extra sp & lang input. They flourished with us however I found it really sad that their parents chose to keep their younger sibling at the private school.

I understand that private schools are essentially businesses and are completely within their rights to refuse pupils but it's sad that they write children off due to disabilities that can be supported with simple adaptations.

And as for things like sensory rooms, it's another lame excuse - we don't have the money/space for things like that at school however they go to weekly sessions with their LSAs as part of their curriculum. If they need to hide away as they're overwhelmed we have a special pop-up tent they can use with lights etc. Not cheap but we're not talking mega-bucks!

I'll stop ranting now op!

Talk to your local schools to ask what they can offer SEND wise, look round them & get a feel for them. It's always instinct to go with an outstanding school however you might get better vibes from one that's 'only' good (I say this as both a teacher & parent of a child with ASD).

@ThisMama1 @ElfDragon

Would you suggest getting a diagnosis privately? He's on the waiting list and it's 18 months. He was put on 2 months ago.

The private consultant who I saw for an initial assessment said yes definitely he needs a formal diagnosis and said for £1500 he could get that process finished in 3 months.

Happy to spend the money but is it legitimate/it's recommendatiosn actually valued by the LA? I have done some research that says yes of course it's legitimate as of course qualified practitioner but the LA also commented to me that private doctor make ridiculous recommendations so I wonder if they take it seriously when considering an EHCP application

So sorry op really tough to hear that but as others have said they showed their colours early, your son would not be happy or supported there.

I do despair though for all the kids educated at these kind of private schools where they only mix with their own kind. What an artificial existence they have, seems a lot end up in the Tory party. No idea how they can grown to be well rounded functioning adults with this type of education. Education is far more than what you read in a book and these kids are missing out a whole chunk of learning as a result.

@HarryViles I can’t answer fully now, but will come back to this later on today to give my experiences. Have you posted on the SN boards here? I’m not a regular there any more, but they were a godsend and an absolute goldmine of information and support when mine were younger.

I do agree with people that an education that only allows for one type of child is hugely problematic. To be honest, I felt like an outsider with the other mums (only person with a normal car!) and going to playdates has been eye opening!

I'm not desperate for private school. I'm desperate for my kid to be happy and confident and he is there, despite the management. The staff who support him are so brilliant. And the classes are half the size of the state he will not go to.

I felt sad that in theory my kid is going to struggle academically and that the answer is to send him to a more stretched bigger school and he probably won't qualify for extra support there anyway. And also how are they judging these 4 year old? When I pick my boy up half of them are crying, screaming, being hilarious and silly - I mean they are pre schoolers. How sad the judgment starts so young.

I would speak to child services within your LA to see if they will accept a private ASD diagnosis when it comes to an EHCP. They should accept it, however I do know that some areas won’t or make excuses about a private diagnosis & still insist on assessing them. Have you joined any autism groups on FB? You can get lots of great advice there too.

one thing I will say is that most of the knowledge & support about resources has come from other parents, not from the ‘professionals’. We have an amazing charity locally that support parents with school issues, EHCPs etc etc. See if you have anything local to you.

I feel awful saying this but you will have a battle on your hands for so much, especially if it appears he’s managing ok/scraping by. You will have to become the parent that ‘shouts the loudest’ unfortunately otherwise you just don’t get what you need. Our local LA initially told me they were going to take a ‘sink or swim’ approach with my son. Even though it was clear he was autistic before he was even 12 months old.

I would definitely advise starting a journal/diary where you can write down issues that arise, daily struggles, signs of autism etc. As when it comes to being asked questions for assessment you tend to forgot things as it just becomes the norm so you don’t realise the differences between your child & other children. Having things written out helps so much when it comes to the huge amount of paperwork you’re likely going to have to do

Do you want your child in an unsupportive school?
honestly in views of your child's needs state may well Be the better option
have you spoke to the school.where had had a place and discussed his needs ?
will he needs an EHCP?
as 'the parent of a severely autistic child myself I realise that state provision can be very hit and miss for children with autism especially if here are no additional learning disabilities etc,but hhave you.looked what provision there is in your LEA, Asd,hubs ect and wether your son would meet the criteria?

Hi there ,sorry you are feeling upset.Please dont take it personally though! Private Schools are more like businesses ,they are all about results so they can hardsell to the parents of children most likely to "succeed" Advertising that their School had "outstanding Sats results" or whatever. I would have a look round some other Schools ,If you have a good State School thats great ,but other private schools may be able to help if you have the means.Otherwise as PP have said ,pay for a Tutor on top of lessons if you can .