Why don't people want to use paid childcare

[cadburyegg]

I've noticed irl some people have a bit of an aversion of using paid childcare like wraparound care, holiday clubs etc because they don't want strangers looking after their children. Their children are in school though so they are being looked after by "strangers" all day.

So they rely fully on their kids grandparents who are often not available so if their shifts clash with their OH then they are stuck but they still won't consider using childcare. They talk about how hard it is to juggle everything too.

These are fairly well off families with mc lifestyles and holidays 3x a year so it's not like they can't afford it. I guess they don't want to spend the money on childcare.

AIBU to not understand this? I'm a single parent and rely on after school clubs and holiday clubs etc. I'd find not knowing what childcare arrangements are happening from one week to the next really stressful!

I work shifts and thankfully have gotten away without paying for childcare by working it around each other but until youngest was in nursery it definitely was a juggling game made easier by my ability to self roster. A lot of the problem with shift workers is the inflexibility of childcare settings, my shifts change every week so I can't commit to the same days so unless I'm willing to pay for fulltime nursery place it wouldn't actually benefit us and who would pay for full time nursery when they only actually require 2 days? I don't blame the nurseries, I know it's a nightmare to plan and staff but even the nurseries run on hospitals are full of kids with parents who work 9-5 because that's a more attractive arrangement to fit the nursery.

For the babysitters it's a priority thing, like we actually don't really like getting dressed out and going out that much, we would take it turn about for nights out. Have used babysitters a couple times but don't really have need on a regular basis.

The cost of wrap around care for more than one child isn't much cheaper than full time nursery for one TBH. So people just don't wanna pay the money. It's only because I WFH and my kids are older that I don't need wrap around care and I actually have some disposable income now.

I mean, there's a big difference between introducing someone once (or twice? I'm not sure what's the standard for a babysitter) and someone that DS sees on a daily basis?

Interesting comments on here. To me it's not about the money at all, I'd like my DC to spend as much time as possible with family (as I also spent my childhood). Weekends and holidays were always with family and I look back on my childhood fondly, and would love for my DC to have the same (as much as possible). I do find though on MN it seems like many people don't actually seem to like their family, in which case it would make sense to do holiday clubs etc

We were very lucky and had family support

My mum and dad and my inlaws used to have my children while I worked during their pre school years so a 7 year arrangement. There are 3 years between my boys so it was only both kids during the holidays and we used after school club once he started school. We used to take them out for dinner followed by a planning session once a year with diaries and it would be 1 week with one set and then 1 week with the other so the commitment wasn't every week and holidays were planned in. They did Tuesday and Thursday and I paid for childcare on the Friday. By having both sets involved it meant illness could be navigated easier as I could ask the other set before having to take time off myself.

The result is the grandparents have a very close relationship with the kids as they have looked after them without me or dad since they were 6 months old. We live near a leisure centre and I paid £30 a month for the kids to have a membership so there were classes they could take them to like trampolining, swimming, soft play and kids stay and play without paying which helped I think as it gave them some options to break up the day without it costing them any money. Covid meant they didn't have my youngest the year before he started school and my father inlaw feels robbed of that time and gets quite emotional about it. When we were little my dad used to work a lot and didn't spend much time with us so I think he feels he has rectified that a bit by reliving that time with my kids.

Saving two days a week nursery for 7 years saved us a fortune and I am so grateful we got that support. Now the grandparents are in their mid to late 70's we use holiday clubs during Christmas, Easter and summer holidays as it would be too much for them but they still have them for half term week (1 day each side) and for occasional overnights if needed.

My kids are the only children as neither my sister nor my sister in law have children which probably made this arrangement easier.

Mamaneedsadrink
Same here, we use childcare and have family involvement. It's quite common round here and even people who do use childcare seem to get on with their family. The idea that family members have an obligation to provide childcare otherwise it's taken as a sign of not liking family is a very Mumsnet idea.

The people in the OP's situation haven't got reliable childcare arrangements though. They complain about how hard it is to juggle everything, find themselves stuck for childcare because they don't want to pay for childcare and their relatives aren't always available, but it's a situation of their own creation. If family aren't available to provide regular childcare then the couple need to use a childcare provider.

We don’t live near any family so wrap around care, nursery and holiday clubs all used here! When younger we never really went out alone as a couple as one of us stayed with the children - definitely easier now they older!

My 20 year old hasn’t been damaged by going to nursery etc we have a very close relationship. I slightly changed my working pattern with youngest and she only needed ASC once a week she was gutted she couldn’t go more often! Youngest didn’t really like the local holiday clubs at sports centre so we did pay a lot more for drama ones - frustrating but it was important she was ok with going.

Personally I think babysitters are totally different as it’s one person in an uncontrolled environment. There’s a lot that could go wrong. I’ve paid for summer clubs, they’re usually fun although turning up at a strange place with unknown people wouldn’t be possible for some children. Being looked after by family who love them for free is a pretty good option though!

People who won't pay for babysitters because they don't like strangers looking after their kids are ridiculous

Quite a privilege to have a job that paid childcare can cover easily in terms of hours and day , to be able to afford paid childcare and to have access to adequate quality paid childcare.

This is what has not been seriously considered with the planned roll out of more ‘free hours’ of childcare for younger children.

Many jobs especially but not only working class jobs are not Monday-Friday 9-5. If you pick up a role in hospitality, where is the evening childcare? You work in retail, who has your kids at weekends? You leave for work at 3am, where is the early start nursery? Where is the night time childcare? Where is the bank holiday and Christmas Day childcare? Childcare is designed around the needs of very particular demographic. Even the better paid unusual hours jobs are rarely well enough paid for families to employ a nanny.

And even for those who work standard hours, cost and access remain barriers. Lots of families can’t afford to pay and many families have limited access, if you don’t drive, you need a nursery within walking distance or easily on your commute. If your kid is allocated a school where the breakfast club is full and no childminders collect from, then you’re stuck.

Access and hours is why ‘free childcare won’t get more people into employment and why many families won’t and don’t use paid childcare. There’s also the privilege of course of having a child who can manage paid childcare, childcare for children with significant additional needs is a whole different issue.

People who won't pay for babysitters because they don't like strangers looking after their kids are ridiculous
Or we have different priorities and have decided that's a compromise that works for us.

I'll happily use childcare and wraparound care. I'd happily have a friend's child babysit if they're old enough. I'm not willing to look up a babysitter online and have them in my house. It doesn't bother me because that was my opinion before having DC and it has stayed the same.

Other people will choose differently.

I use wraparound care for my kids but it’s really expensive and my kids absolutely hate it so I have to listen to them crying and begging not to go every work day. I can understand why my kids hate it, they just want to come home and have a rest after school, not get chucked straight into another stressful social situation with a different set of kids/adults. If I had family I could ask instead I would 100% use them and my kids would be happier for it!

I think it’s a mixture of things. My kids were always happier with a family member than a holiday club/ after school, it’s expensive and it’s also less flexible in terms of timings/ locations. I think if I was a kid I’d prefer a day at grannie’s watching the telly and eating nice food than being forced to play dodgeball with others in the same position! Mine do a mixture but have never really enjoyed clubs etc

I would with wraparound care if I worked, but not a nursery again. Having been a nursery worker (only after my children were old enough to go into school), I would be very, very hesitant to put any future child of mine into a nursery. They are underpaid and overworked and a lot of the young women (teens) very quickly realised it was a pretty crappy job and many had awful attitudes towards the kids (I was a bank worker so it wasn't just one nursery I went to). Not abusive, just a meh attitude when a child was upset etc.

We've never had a babysitter as too expensive for three kids coupled with the night out or whatever necessitated the sitter. Wraparound care for three kids is also too expensive, so I do the care.

No, it's not. It's a normal feeling and perfectly valid.

No, it's not. It's a normal feeling and perfectly valid.

But unless you homeschool and never send your child to activities or playgroups, they're being looked after by "strangers" every day when they go to school etc, surely?

@Bk1000 I feel this 😞

Some holiday clubs are run by mostly disinterested teens, there’s a few near us that I avoid because I don’t think they do a good job of looking after the kids. Fortunately we have loads of better options but if those were the only ones then I wouldn’t use them either, and would probably say something vague like ‘strangers’ because I wouldn’t want to sound like I was critiquing friends who did use the club.

My sibling and partner are like this. They seem to think we are negligent parents because we pay for childcare whereas they get grandparents to do almost all of it. They would rather drag the kids around to totally unsuitable events than leave them tucked up in bed with a paid babysitter. I find it really odd but it's their life.

Our kids all absolutely love their babysitters/childminder etc but my sibling refuses to believe this.

So people shouldn't be cautious about who they leave their children with and shouldn't want them to be left with someone they know and are comfortable with? Sounds sensible to me!

Current situation here. Paying for childcare for one year old who's barely been there as he seems to pick up something every time he goes. Soul destroying. Changing my hours soon so I'll only have to send him two days. Very lucky to have the option.

I’m not totally averse to all paid childcare/wraparound care - we paid for a private nursery two days a week until DD reached school age, mainly for socialisation purposes as she’s an only child. Neither set of grandparents are really capable of or interested in doing childcare so that wasn’t an option for us anyway.

But having spent a lot of time in schools and observed lots of different breakfast/after school club set ups I was keen to limit DD’s time in them, especially while she’s little. Lots of the settings imo weren’t optimal for young children and I’ve seen too many exhausted Reception/Year 1 children slumped in corners or being intimidated by much older kids for it to be an appealing option. Mostly unhealthy food, often very unstructured wjtb
with little stimulation (just a ball and a few board games) and too many disengaged adults. Same with holiday clubs - some are great but they vary dramatically and we’re very careful to choose the calmer. more structured ones as DD hates noise and chaos.

Also I think there can often be a big difference between school-based nursery/preschool settings and private ones, in terms of the staff’s experience and qualification levels. The staff at DD’s private nursery were universally lovely, it was rated Outstanding and considered to be one of the best in the area, with a lengthy waiting list - but most of the practitioners had barely left school themselves, and not a single staff member there was over 30 or had a higher level qualification in child development. Quite a high staff turnover by the end too. DD was kept safe and was well fed and cared for, but as she got older she came home with some odd ideas and stereotypes, started imitating the language of the nursery staff (mild curse words), decided all boys were naughty because they were always being shouted at, and so on. In the end I was pleased that we’d only needed to use the setting for the two days, and that the rest of the time she was at home with me or DP.

I do think a good childminder, if you’re lucky enough to find one, can be amazing, and that this can be an excellent option.

Why do you care what other people
do? Do you have to cover these peoples shifts or something? If not, it’s just another parenting decision and people parent in different ways. You like to use paid childcare, they don’t. There’s a whole host of potential reasons: costs, nervousness around who looks after their child, read lots news reports about adults abusing children, know someone who had a bad experience, had a bad experience themselves, kids don’t like it, kids who don’t settle well in certain settings, shy kids or kids who don’t settle well in certain environments, the hours that childcare settings are open dont fit with their work hours, local childcare is oversubscribed so hard to get in and penalties if you need to change your hours, lack of flexibility etc etc. Childcare is quite variable across the country, if you’ve found things that work for you go for it but just respect that other peoples circumstances might be different. For what it’s worth we use a mixture of both paid and unpaid and find that works for us but we’re really lucky to have found a suitable childcare setting locally and we managed to get a place. If we hadn’t been able to get a place there there really isn’t anywhere else suitable and all the childminders are full.

@cadburyegg you need to focus on you and your family.
Everyone has their own reasons.
I didn't want my young child/baby to go to nursery when she is non verbal and have strangers looking after her.
I don't judge others,
I work shifts (they change every week) covering a 24 hour service and husband works Monday to Friday. So we juggle between us and 1-2 day's maximum per week our parents care for her. Some weeks we don't need childcare. Our child is nearly 4 so school nursery is beneficial for her but you can rely on that for childcare as when she is unwell she can't go and when they are young they pick up all sorts of bugs!

I very much doubt it's because they don't want 'strangers' looking after their children!
Much more likely due to the following 1)cost 2) no spare spaces 3) needing to book spaces in advance (difficult if you work shifts, and are only rostered on each week/ monthly) (our breakfast and after school clubs have to be booked a term in advanced if you want to be guaranteed a space, as it's run by an outside agency who need to know staffing levels etc)
3) our school is in an academy with several others, some breakfast and after school clubs only run from 8-4:30/5 (given their rural location if you're a single parent working 35 mins away from the school, the 'wrap around care' still doesn't cover it.
Many jobs whilst on paper say 40hrs in reality that's the minimum, any clinical role for example, means you can't just up and leave 'on time'. I don't know any of my colleagues who stop on the dot of their 8hour day...I think if they did even fewer patients would get seen. I imagine this is the same for many occupations, therefore having a family member picking the dc up from school takes the stress out of constantly watching the clock, or rushing from pillar to post.
Expense child care for one child will nobble a certain amount of earnings if you have more than 1, then unless you are a high earner, it doesn't make economic sense (remember it's not just the hours you are being paid it's also during your commute; most parents in these parts have a 30-40 min commute into the nearest city, as there is very little work in our village).
If a child is unwell and a grandparent already does the school pick up, then there is every chance they will look after an unwell child.
Many grandparents (despite what you might read on here) actually love looking after their grandchildren, and there have been numerous studies done to show it's more beneficial for children to be look after by a grandparent (it's beneficial to the grandparent too!).
There is absolutely nothing wrong with using wrap around care for children, but it's definitely not an easier option if you have a family member willing to do it. Of course the stress comes if a grandparent/ family member can't do a drop off/ pick up at short notice.
My mum was undergoing gruelling cancer treatment when mine needed wrap around care, but on the days she was well enough to have then, she loved it, my dc loved it, and I loved being able to finish all my tasks on those day, and not flying out the door aware I was running horrendously late. My dc were incredibly close to my dm, and even though she died two years ago, they still sing the little tune she used to sing them, and they both have one of her jumpers they wear to feel close to her, (we've nicknamed them the talking jumpers, because when they got warn it normally means one of my dc is feeling unhappy / upset about something, and so we find time to sit and talk things through, and they feel they are having a granny hug, which makes it easier for them to talk about their worries).