AIBU to be upset by these complaints against me?

[Govangirl]

Hi all. This has only happened within the past 5-6 hours, so still very fresh and a bit emotional about it.

I work with students and we hold a debating event every month or so. As it’s designed as a deliberative space, the icebreaker has to set the tone for the evening, and so for the past 6 events we’ve played a kind of “devils advocate” game wherein they pull clearly controversial opinions out of hats, and the “goal” is to debate this from both sides (equally if possible, though not always). This allows them to see things from different perspectives, and also encourages them to get into the deliberative, debating mindset.

Anyway (sorry for the waffle!) today we were joined by 2 new students, who had issues from the start. They said the lights were too bright (we dimmed them) and that the microphones were too loud (we lowered the volume and offered them ear protectors). I’m neurotypical myself so completely understand that these can negatively impact people. When the icebreaker was played, they called me over as the facilitator and explained that they would not be participating as they had fundamentally disagreed with the first prompt. They both trauma dumped excessively while not letting me get a word in edgeways, and then accused me of being racist, homophobic, and ableist because I had written out the prompts. I explained (or tried to) that it was MEANT to be controversial, and the aim was to get them to understand diff perspectives etc. but they were having none of it. They said they’d be making complaints about me, and I showed them how to access the feedback form for the event and gave my name when required.

They seemed to really enjoy the rest of the debate and got quite animated and engaged, which is why I suppose I guessed they wouldn’t make the complaint. They also both thanked me for hosting at the end.

I got home and got a message from my manager, letting me know that there have been 2 complaints filed on the feedback form. I have access to this and have read both, and they are utter b*llocks. Accusations of the above, of course, but also allegations that I mocked them for being abused, I forced them to actively discriminate against other students, they weren’t given an option not to participate, really vile, UNTRUE things.

I’ve only been at this job for 8 months, and it’s my first job out of uni. I love this job, and I’ve only ever received positive feedback and praise so this has really knocked my confidence. The allegations are plainly untrue, and I’m hoping that my manager will see through that, as they’re both known to be “difficult students”, though of course that doesn’t mean they’re inherently liars (but in this case their recanting of the event is inaccurate). My speciality at work is Equality, Diversity, and Inclusions, so I know that I wasn’t doing any of the things they’ve accused me of, I guess I’m just worried that maybe I’m being unreasonable for being so upset.

I will say, what amused me somewhat (for lack of better word) was that these were white British students who have accused me, a WOC, of racism and discriminatory behaviour.

Huge wall of text, so apologies for that. But AIBU for being concerned about these complaints? Do you think it will negatively affect my appraisals etc to have 2 “strikes” as it were against me for this specific alleged behaviour when I’m the designated expert in ED&I in the workplace?

TIA x

This is so ridiculous! Of course some of the statements could be debated from a religious perspective (almost anything can!) but that doesn't make them inherently racist.

Looking at the (very innocuous) list the OP posted then you could say the statement that 'the school week should be 4 days' could have implications for Jewish people and that 'school uniform should not be mandatory' could have implications for those with strict religious or cultural rules for dressing. Surely part of the exercise is being able to debate using different perspectives that may well include religion alongside other factors such as the economic and social etc?

OP, I know it's easier said than done but try not to worry about the complaints. As you will have seen on this thread, some people are absolutely desperate to find offence in everything and your instinct about these students being trouble makers and trauma loading is almost certainly correct.

I agree with a lot of this apart from the criticism of this generation. There are an awful lot of people in older generations that want to see people cancelled. They are generally the people that have the power to do the cancelling.

You only have to see the anti-vaxxing debate or Brexit to see people of all ages failing to see nuance or refusing to see others' point of view. Politics is absolutely designed, particularly with our first past the post system, to avoid compromise and to have winners and losers. Even our legal system, apart from in Scotland, has guilty or not guilty, and I quite like the Scottish unproven option because in practice that's often the case.

OP I completely understand why you're upset and a bit worried about your job. Unfortunately in education these days you have to tread on eggshells because there is this idea that in society there's only the one true viewpoint and you have to hold the faith. So even a person of colour isn't allowed to question a white person who accuses them of racism. Or a ND person can be accused of ableism. It's daft and I don't believe you were either of those things.

It's like religious extremism for people who aren't religious, and it's a way of gaining power and control. I hope your manager backs you because you sound like an extremely dedicated teacher and your pupils are lucky to have you.

I think it's a bit shitty that your manager informed you about the complaints in the evening. I think that would have been better left for the next day.
Sorry these people have upset you op. They sound ridiculous.

I’m Muslim, love both cats and dogs but don’t have either as pets currently due to work, used to have cats as a child.

I wouldn’t have an issue with playing devil’s advocate on which are better. Most Muslims don’t think dogs are impure but many pray 5 times a day and have to perform ablution beforehand. A dog’s saliva on a person would nullify ablution and it would need to be re-performed, so many prefer not to have dogs as pets.

There’s certainly no issue with taking care of dogs. I fuss a lot of dogs at the park.

You haven’t botched your posts at all OP and come across as considerate to others and enthusiastic about your job. There’s just some people on here who seem to enjoy picking others apart.
You’ve also received some good advice, write it all down and speak to your manager about it. I’m sure you aren’t the first person these students have complained about.
It sounds like a really good activity!

@Stratusinium @FurAndFeathers

FYI

If you had read the thread in its entirety you would have clearly seen I took my initial comment back after the additional (and extremely important) information was shared.

I’ve really made a pigs ear of my original post I’m afraid! By “having issues” I absolutely did not mean to imply that their accommodations were the issues at hand, we were more than happy to accommodate them and encourage them to be in the space if they felt comfortable to do so.

No you didn't. Some people on here are just like your students. Looking for offence and trying to find something to complain about. Your prompts weren't an issue and neither are your posts.

We used to debate abortion, the death penalty, all sorts. And now you can't ask if pineapple belongs on pizza. But they can talk about abuse in an open place where people haven't given consent. Nope.

In answer, I have spent years facilitating. Just make sure the rest of the feedback, which I assume is positive, gets an airing. Two complaints from people who consulted each other about it, and in front of many people who didn't experience the same issues, will be fine.

Frankly, I'd refuse to facilitate with them in the room again.

I'd fight it, if it were me - there's no way I'd accept someone calling me racist if I'd not done anything to warrant it! Really not a term that should be banded around lightly imo, although it sounds like the student's in question are very young if they're not yet in sixth form. Maybe a bit overzealous?

I've heard of teachers putting "content warnings" or "trigger warnings" on lessons / lectures, where there are even small controversies. Research shows these are actually unhelpful to people suffering trauma, but it does cover the teacher (or lecturer or whatever), to maybe stop the situation you've found yourself in. Maybe look into adding some in future?

Categorising the students' objections as 'trauma dumping' does not sound good, especially within a context of open debate of 'controversial' topics.

The prompts are pretty bland. It sounds like they might be complaining for fun. Some people are really odd. Teachers and lecturers are a bit vulnerable to this kind of thing.

A colleague of mine got a complaint made against her by someone she didn’t even know. The person claimed that my colleague had been systematically bullying her. We had to look them up on the registers as my colleague didn’t recognise the name. It’s turned out they had attended 3 lectures given by my colleague and was one of hundreds of students. As far as she could remember, they had never interacted. It must have been all in this woman’s imagination. It was a complete nightmare for my colleague and she had to go through all sorts of procedures.

Another lecturer had death threats and an attempt on his life made by one of his students, because they weren’t happy that they failed an exam.

I absolutely agree with this. Your topics are very innocuous. My year 10 dd dd is doing RS at GCSE. Fifty percent is learning about world religions and the remaining half about ethics. When dd was considering options, the teacher described some of the issues they would be dealing within class such as abortion and the death penalty.

Before dd started secondary school a teacher told me he thought everyone should do RS at GCSE. I didn’t understand at the time as I didn’t appreciate how society had changed at the time as I was in a MC primary school bubble but I now see exactly where he was coming from.

What you are teaching is very valuable and countering this rigid no debate society, where teens and young adults have been indoctrinated into believing there is only one way of thinking. This is very unhealthy and damaging to society.

You don’t need to justify yourself here or apologise. Most people understand the absolute entitlement of two white students making up shit against a POC. ‘Are you saying they can’t be discriminated against because they are white’ is just such rubbish - OF COURSE NOT but it’s more than a little ironic that two people who are not from a marginalised community are making these complaints against a woman who is a minority.
they sound like absolute arses OP

They sound like shit stirrers, OP. Don't sweat it.

Inappropriate to start sharing long, detailed stories about difficult and triggering subjects such as abuse with a group of unconsenting strangers on your first day at debate club. It's obvious op used the phrase as short hand for that fact imo.

Does the complaint list specifically what you said or did which was considered racist/homophobic/ablist?

The most likely scenario here is that they’ve heard the instructions (pull out a piece of paper and debate a controversial opinion) and that they’ve made the assumption that those opinions are to do with race or sexuality and got cross about you doing that.

The second most likely scenario is that someone has tampered with your pieces of paper and they’ve pulled something racist or homophobic out of the box.

Hopefully the teacher on that table will know what they drew out and be able to clarify.

Other posters have suggested writing a clear timeline which is sensible. I think I would also specifically refute anything untrue “I did not say anything racist. I offered the option to sit out of the session.” Etc

Which one of the topics might have invited such comments I wonder, maybe the one about dogs as pets, or the one about pineapple on pizza?

OP, stop second guessing yourself and come out fighting if your manager proves spineless. Hopefully it won't be necessary if they have form for such behaviour. We need to give such people a firm rebuttal imo, and stop pandering.

Only issue in your post was you bringing up their race.

Like it's somehow outrageous that a person with European heritage is not allowed to have an opinion when it comes to diversity topics?

Honestly, I'm not 100% sure the role is right for you at this second.

Your second statement is horse shit! They accused her of being racist when none of the topics mentioned race.

If you're gonna jump on the woe-is-me bandwagon, make sure you understand where it's headed!

Let them investigate and it will all be fine I'm sure.
You have evidence of what prompts were used and I'm sure they will speak to the other students who will give a neutral view!

I've had complaints, I also work in education and safeguarding - yes it's frustrating. I've had some absolutely wild complaints.

There is such a thing as trauma dumping, it might not be the nicest term, however it was unfair of them to not consider the needs of the other students who may also have been traumatised by hearing about their experiences.

You sound like you were sensitive to their needs. You cannot cater to everyone if you didn't know in advance what they might need!

I'd be a terrible teacher as I'd struggle to bite my tongue but I think a lot of the precious flower types will get a real shock when they enter the real world.

You really are reaching.

No good deed goes unpunished.

So do you think they’re just pissed off you told them it wasn’t an appropriate place to talk about their trauma and they’re complaining you interrupting them was offensive, homophobic, racist, ableist etc?

Thank God someone said it before me. Can't roll my eyes far enough back.

It sounds like you have done nothing wrong. But if you need to make a response to the complaint be careful not to appear to attack the students at all. Just say that you are surprised and disappointed as you have had positive feedback for your activity and you did not realise any of the prompts could be offensive. Then list the prompts and say you would appreciate any feedback on how they could upset a student and possible changes.

This suggests you are taking the complaint seriously, while also making it clear that there is nothing wrong with your prompts.

OP, you sound amazing and so passionate. This wasn't the best place for advice as MN is full of people wanting to pick the OP apart and also people who take offense to anything! The fact that you are a WOC talking about two white kids has probably ruffled a few feathers too. Don't let a couple of arrogant kids ruin it for the rest of your students. Be firm with them if they try to attend again, i would ensure they didn't. Make sure you have witnesses. Ps, those debate scenarios are tame! I understand though, God forbid you try start a debate on something slightly more controversial, there would be triggered kids all over the place.

Oh give over

🙄😂