AIBU to be upset by these complaints against me?

[Govangirl]

Hi all. This has only happened within the past 5-6 hours, so still very fresh and a bit emotional about it.

I work with students and we hold a debating event every month or so. As it’s designed as a deliberative space, the icebreaker has to set the tone for the evening, and so for the past 6 events we’ve played a kind of “devils advocate” game wherein they pull clearly controversial opinions out of hats, and the “goal” is to debate this from both sides (equally if possible, though not always). This allows them to see things from different perspectives, and also encourages them to get into the deliberative, debating mindset.

Anyway (sorry for the waffle!) today we were joined by 2 new students, who had issues from the start. They said the lights were too bright (we dimmed them) and that the microphones were too loud (we lowered the volume and offered them ear protectors). I’m neurotypical myself so completely understand that these can negatively impact people. When the icebreaker was played, they called me over as the facilitator and explained that they would not be participating as they had fundamentally disagreed with the first prompt. They both trauma dumped excessively while not letting me get a word in edgeways, and then accused me of being racist, homophobic, and ableist because I had written out the prompts. I explained (or tried to) that it was MEANT to be controversial, and the aim was to get them to understand diff perspectives etc. but they were having none of it. They said they’d be making complaints about me, and I showed them how to access the feedback form for the event and gave my name when required.

They seemed to really enjoy the rest of the debate and got quite animated and engaged, which is why I suppose I guessed they wouldn’t make the complaint. They also both thanked me for hosting at the end.

I got home and got a message from my manager, letting me know that there have been 2 complaints filed on the feedback form. I have access to this and have read both, and they are utter b*llocks. Accusations of the above, of course, but also allegations that I mocked them for being abused, I forced them to actively discriminate against other students, they weren’t given an option not to participate, really vile, UNTRUE things.

I’ve only been at this job for 8 months, and it’s my first job out of uni. I love this job, and I’ve only ever received positive feedback and praise so this has really knocked my confidence. The allegations are plainly untrue, and I’m hoping that my manager will see through that, as they’re both known to be “difficult students”, though of course that doesn’t mean they’re inherently liars (but in this case their recanting of the event is inaccurate). My speciality at work is Equality, Diversity, and Inclusions, so I know that I wasn’t doing any of the things they’ve accused me of, I guess I’m just worried that maybe I’m being unreasonable for being so upset.

I will say, what amused me somewhat (for lack of better word) was that these were white British students who have accused me, a WOC, of racism and discriminatory behaviour.

Huge wall of text, so apologies for that. But AIBU for being concerned about these complaints? Do you think it will negatively affect my appraisals etc to have 2 “strikes” as it were against me for this specific alleged behaviour when I’m the designated expert in ED&I in the workplace?

TIA x

People can lodge complaints but you also have the right to give evidence that the complaints were nonsensical and possibly malicious.

I would put down everything you did in writing and stick to your guns.

You had other staff member in the room and you can ask for them to be interviewed to to confirm your version of the events.

I think it really has got to a point where everything is looking for reasons to be offended....And I say that as a neurodivergent person from an EU background who also experienced trauma.

I did not even blink when you wrote ''trauma dump'' by the way.

People need to realise that debate is healthy and that in life you need to accept you will come across people with different opinions and you can learn to make a powerful case for your views. Trying to ''cancel'' and bully others into being quiet because you don't like what they say is not democracy.

I do hope the complaints are dismissed.

No advice but just want to add you seem articulate, conscientious and caring-what a shame that 2 little shits have decided to give you some misery and bleating about being offended and discrimination. Sometimes bad behaviour is just that and nothing to do with SN or ND. Those people are doing people who genuinely have those conditions a disservice.

It doesn’t sound like she’s implying the two are connected. She literally writes that the accommodations they requested were “unrelated to the issues we had with them (which were behavioural)”. OP isn’t coming across negatively to anyone, other than a small but vocal minority who seem hell bent on finding something to be offended by or some moral crime that she has committed. Absolutely pathetic.

Unfortunately, OP, this is the way things are now. I despair really. People like the students who have complained and some posters on here can sense when there’s an opportunity for them to become professionally offended over nothing at all and they capitalise every time. It’s ridiculous and every facet of life (our schools, universities, workplaces, arts and culture etc) is poorer for it. It is an insult to those who are genuinely in need of protection and it diverts focus from genuine learning and advancement.

Not impressed with the pile on that the OP is getting. It sounds like an excellent exercise and I'd love it if my DS's school would do similar.
We need more open discussion and critical thinking taught to students. It sounds to me that those two students are entitled and self-absorbed, and testing the boundaries of a new staff member the way that some teenagers do. You were more than accommodating. They'll just keep pushing.
I'd assume that the head would have enough sense to see it for what it is.

Hi OP. Just a different angle here although I think it's that a debate has started about debate class itself. I had a similar situation where an untrue complaint was made about me and I had to go through the investigation process, I am assuming your school will have a similar process in place. I am sorry this happened to you I know it feels awful. Looking back I took it very hard considering how well my manager knew me and that they also knew it was unlikely to be true! Take some time to prepare, write your own statement ( in one sense you do need to "defend yourself" because it will be part of the process) mention all the adjustments you made and have other staff members write witness statements as well.

Sounds to me like you have done nothing wrong and it will all blow over soon enough.

While I'm on OP's side, I think all the "kids today" post are very disingenuous and are just using this thread as an excuse to generation bash.

Especially considering quite a few adult posters are jumping over backwards to find some fault with OP and her behaviour. Plus, it was 2 kids out of many that OP has interacted with in the past 8 months.

If this is what it's like teaching these days, then no wonder there is a teaching shortage.

People treading on eggshells in case they say something offensive like 'my foot's bigger than yours' and you're having to check yourself to make sure that doesn't come across to someone as racist/sexist/homophobic/ableist/transphobic over something so incredibly innocuous.

This happened to my young teen. She said something jokey to her friend as a dare from another friend. It was starting the conversation with "Hi honey!" and said friend accused her of homophobia!!! My ND child was totally confused (but also very apologetic) and despite me explaining multiple times that it was in no way homophobic and the friend is being totally ridiculous. I just feel like kids are being allowed/encouraged to be offended by every little thing which undermines genuine homophobia/racism/sexism/transphobic. It's getting utterly ridiculous!

Anyway, OP if you are working in a school, I would vigorously defend yourself here. Take this seriously. Get your union involved and get some supporting statements from other staff members and students. This kids sound like they could end careers. I wouldn't want to be around kids that make up these kind of lies. Don't ever be in a room alone with them as they could make up any kind of stuff like you touched them or something. It totally undermines genuine complaints and one day, if they ever do have a genuine complaint, who will believe them?

The students sound like complete pains, and you sound as if you have done nothing wrong and have tried hard to accommodate them.

I'd get support from other teachers who were there.

I hope your college has a good complaints process in place and will support you and ask the students to explain what they mean by racism, etc in their complaints.

If they disclosed trauma ect, if make referral to safeguarding or whatever process there is. They sound like they need more support if they can't take part in a normal debate style workshop without feeling the need to complain.

accused me of being racist, homophobic, and ableist because I had written out the prompts
*
allegations that I mocked them for being abused, I forced them to actively discriminate against other students, they weren’t given an option not to participate*

You need to ask for specific examples of what you allegedly said or did, which presumably the other people there will then dispute. What was ableist / racist / homophobic about the prompts, for example?

I don't know what your manager is like but do not accept any lily livered response from them, anything along the lines of "it's easier just to apologise and it will go away". (Speaking from experience.) Defend yourself vigorously - this is about your professionalism and you shouldn't tolerate it for the sake of keeping the peace. Try to keep emotions out of it, just be calm and factual about who said and did what. I agree with a PP, you may have annoyed them if you tried to safeguard other students by suggesting their trauma dumping should take place elsewhere.

Keep your chin up, OP. It sounds like you are doing really great work, don't let a couple of troublemakers get you down. They think you are an easy target for their bullying - don't be!

I reckon they have watched a few debates on you tube - possibly debates on transexuals/abortion which usually has some peope chucking their toys out of their pram and they've copied how some of those people behave?

Just never ever have a debate on transexuals or you will not get out of there alive!!

Will they be made to explain their complaints further? If not, insist on it.

They will have wanted to swan in and upset everything with accusations of racist, ablism, homophobia etc and swan out again leaving chaos in their wake.

Make them sit down and explain exactly what was racist, abolish, homophobic, and in what way. I bet they won't be prepared for that. And I bet they won't be able to.

All you'll get is 'I feel' so basically a load of baseless bollocks.

Try and find out from the other teachers if they are ever challenged on their behaviour or held to account, too.

Sorry, ablist not abolish

One of the things I hate about MN is when someone asks a question and everyone jumps on and says that it was worded badly, no wonder you had a complaint etc. It always totally misses the whole point.
I would speak to your manager today and explain that you did everything to accommodate them when asked (eg lighting). You do not understand their complaint and you think that no matter what your subjects were, they were just out to complain.
Do not let them win! Do not stop asking those questions at the beginning - they are fab and if I was attending one of your events, I think it’s a great way to break the ice. You cannot let 2 people change the way you do your job. This is what is wrong with society at the moment. These 2 will never learn important life skills if they think they just complain and someone will change how they do their own job to accommodate them. Turning the lights down etc is fine, but to accuse you of being racist etc is just ridiculous. They obviously have massive chips on their shoulders.
Apologies for the mini rant, but enough is enough!

A devils advocate game is a good one for life skills. In interviews we will ask how they would handle differing viewpoints. Many people cannot do this.

I suspect they were pushing the buttons, seeing how far they could take this as you are new. to be honest I would also speak to ACAS or an employment solicitor to cover your back. But do not apologise (and do not tell the two students to grow up as tempting as that might be).

This type of behaviour is why I know many employers won't touch that generation, they feel far too entitled.

I’ve had a few people, as in customers, complain about me at work. I didn’t do anything wrong, I just said no assertively to their requests. Nothing came of it, but it just spoils it for other genuinely nice people to deal with, because you end up detaching yourself and just doing your job, no more, and covering your own arse.

Make them sit down and explain exactly what was racist, abolish, homophobic, and in what way

And separate them. Do it individually.

So sorry you have been through this OP. Yes, get a nice sensible teacher to record what actually happened. This sounds like a really fun, useful exercise that will really benefit your students. It would be such a shame if it were spoiled by people lying about what happened.

They would hate the libraries where I live, where schools can ’borrow a prejudice’. A real person who will answer all your weird questions. Homosexuals, muslims, people with eating disorders, blind, wheelchair users, a racist, refugees, a drag queen..you name it. It’s to combat prejudice through making representatives of groups often subjected to this. They’d be filling out many complaint forms..😂

In my opinion the topics chosen for debate are in no way controversial or offensive. Unfortunately I think it’s very clearly a sign of the times in that, what offends, barring the very obvious, is subjective.
Is this a generational thing.. yes.
I very much doubt debating will continue in schools/ universities for this reason.

Such are the times that everyone is against everyone and the more people will try to have a conversation on difficult topics, there always will be someone who will come and accuse others of lack of inclusivity and whatever. Not sure how can you go forward.

The other day there was a market events somewhere and there were all kinds of stalls and there is always a Pride stall with rainbow flags. Then a worship music started blasting across the whole market and sermons given.

So I am sure the organisers and the council received many complaints from all kinds of parties about the whole thing.

What is the outcome of this event depends in what kind of moral environment your HR and Manager lives in. They can be saying all the right things but be totally immoral or confused what is what and what inclusivity is, yet inclusivity given it does not impinge on traditional British family values.

If your job requires doing such discussions on controversial topics - is this actually their aim???? - then they surely know that the people who are employed will always tread on egg shells and be persecuted for facilitating these debates. Truth is persecuted, my dear. You got to become the martyr you applied to be or leave the job. The way you described it, it is not just a job, it much more than that. Apparently organisation trying to shape the political and social values of this generation? What is umbrella of your organisation?

Gosh I am sorry you are going through this op. I just want to add to the voices of you sound lovely and I don’t believe you have done anything wrong at all. I would be happy for my 2 teen children to debate these things, also more controversial points too, it’s good for them to see things from both sides and I think sets them up for life after education.

as previously said I would list exactly what happened and get statements from other staff on their tables/who heard what was going on. If you are in a union maybe get advice from them in case your manager makes you apologise to keep the peace, hopefully you have a good manager and they will back you up. I would also see if you could gently encourage them not to attend again as it’s not the group for them. Flag up the trauma they explained to the safeguard person so they can take that over and continue to deliver these groups as you do at the moment.

I hope this all blows over for you, please remember it’s not always you that’s wrong sometimes the complainers are the ones in the wrong.

This does sound like a malicious complaint to me. Agree best tackled with ruthlessly sticking to facts and asking for evidence. The lesson sounds brilliant, I'd be extremely keen for my teen to take part in stuff like this. The topics are perfect; controversial in a broad, not personal, way.

Fwiw I'm neurodiverse and have trauma issues and think you handled sensory requests with sensitivity.

Much sympathy from me. The first complaint, even when vexatious is horrible. Be sure as others have said that you have your defenses primed and that you can rely on support of your peers and superiors.
Does your organisation have a Vexations Complaints Policy?

The idea of Debates is a great one and although I am out of education gor many years, was one of the advantages that Independent schools had over comprehensive, to develop critical thinking, especially if the most pro cat person was required to debate the superiority of dogs!

While I agree with you I think there may be a bit of a typo at the end. Gen X were born 1965-81, making them 43-58 years old. Although that said there's relatives of mine who are in their sixties who have a similar mindset to the two students here. They cannot accept alternative viewpoints, try to shut others up and go NC or lc with family members that dare to hold different opinions. Intolerance for different views and cancelling those holding those views is becoming a trend across generations.