Is she English or Portuguese? Please help me settle a debate

[Takeawaypizzatonightcbacooking]

I live in Portugal, I’m English, as is Dh, but Dd was born here.
My dad says Dd is Portuguese as she was born here, I say English because we’re both English…who is right? How does it work if you’re born in a different country to your parents etc?

@Mooshamoo do you understand what nationality is?? The child has dual nationality in that case. Nationality is a passport.
he can say I’m a British Irish who lives in (insert anywhere in the world) born in England. Understand ?

If a child is born in France with two white dudes from English he is still English.
if he is born in France with one white English dude and a fancy French mama, he is dual nationality of French and English heritage.
its also valid to remember; where you are born won’t give you nationality unless the mother or father are a national of that place, but even if they are a national it will not automatically mean that you are ie:. English for being born in England. Children of Chinese are Chinese, you don’t change your child’s heritage by moving country… seems obvious. But maybe not.

Practically none of this is either correct or intelligible.

Yes of course I understand. Ive dealt with two governments and different birt certs and passports as I am a "dual national"

I was the child in that instance. I was born in UK to Irish mother and English father. And we moved to Ireland when I was five.

I have always been told by UK government and Irish government in my various dealinga with them, that where you are born, has precedence in importance over where your parents are from.

They told me that if I was born in England that I am primarily British. With Irish nationality.

So I have always seem myself as British , with Irish citizenship.

I do think where you are born is important. I have a British birth certificate. Right now I have an Irish passport, only because it was much quicker to get the Irish passport. On the Irish passport it says that my place of birth is UK.

On any online pplication when it asks for nationality, if it only gives space for one nationality, I tick UK, as that is where I was born. And where my birth cert is from

I also think, taking the government and legal side out of it,

I also think that it is very psychologically important to the child where they are born, even if they are only there for a short time.

I moved to Ireland when I was 5, I still identify and feel English.

My friend was born in Portugal and she moved to Ireland from Portugal when she was aged 6. She had One Irish parent. And One portuguse parent.
She has lived in Ireland all her life. She says she is portuguese.

You have a very strong tie to where you are born. I think a lot of people feel that they are from where they are born.

@Outgrabe jus solis vs Jus sanguínis. I’m América a child could achei he citizenship by jus solis but uk and most Europe not. So I didn’t know what you don’t know but that’s what I know. It would be wonderful if children could just be born and respected instead of made a subject of law but that’s not the case.

I actually think where you grow up and make your home is more important than where you're born. You were not aware at the time of your birth and period of infancy so it really isn't part of you in any significant way unless adults make it so. If where you're born and where you grew up is the same place, then it's the same.

Was going to add 'because anyone can be born anywhere'.

@Mooshamoo thats totally valid but on a identity level. I wasn’t born in uk I grew up here from 18 onwards. I identify myself, I have ties with the country and if am drunk for ex I can’t speak a word in Portuguese. BUT…. None of that matters to the HO. Where I was born and where all the paperwork falls into place it’s where my nationality lays.
people can feel they belong to where they were born or in my case not belong, but laws aren’t written based on that.
a person can for ex: apply for right of private life based on the years that individual spent in a country before he became an adult…. That’s lawfully acceptable. But he still will need to apply for version things based on the law of a specific country.

That’s not what you said, which was some unintelligible ravings about ‘white dudes from English’ and a ‘fancy French mama’ and something about Chinese people. You seem very confused about race/ethnicity and its relationship to nationality.

She is Portuguese and British. You are not entitled to Portuguese citizenship just by birth if born before 2020 but after 2020 if you both lived legally in Portugal for a year before ser was born she is Portuguese too .

@Outgrabe that’s exactly what I said.

and the white dude meaning “a white English

The English being a race and British being a nationality.

The mama as for being a French national from French parents……

it’s very hard debating here…… ppl are odd. you keep replying to my comments yet provide no replies to the thread.

English isn't a race, and race has nothing to do with nationality or citizenship.

@BadNomad English is an ethnic group. Please stop…. The ethnic group of a person determines their heritage.
the place where the person is born determines their nationality with other factors involved already covered.

Wowwweeeeee I need to go back as referring to people as white dude from England and fancy French mama lol

no wonder brexit happened.

English people
Ethnic group

The English people are an ethnic group and nation native to England, who speak the English language, a West Germanic language, and share a common history and culture. The English identity began with the Anglo-Saxons, when they were known as the Angelcynn, meaning race or tribe of the Angles.

jusy some quick wiki stuff here for those who still think there are black English or that you can become Chinese just by being born in china and that you are of whichever nationality you feel you are. You are not btw.

i will go to bed now so don’t expect replies

You said race. English is not a race. Race and ethnicity are not the same thing. If you're going to talk to people like they are stupid, make sure what you're saying is correct first.

@BadNomad if you weren’t stupid you’d know I meant white English being a race. Now you pick up the book and study I won’t clarify anything else for free anymore.

I bet this is some white bored dude shit…. smh. Go to sleep fool

English doesn't mean white. English isn't a race. If the kid born in France to two black English parents, the child is still British. Race has nothing to do with it.

Ok you're trolling. Gotcha. You go to sleep. Nite nite.

English is a regional identity and not a national one. British is the nationality as stated in your passport.

Entitlement to passports of particular countries is one thing and another is cultural background. If your child is brought up within a cultural British home wherever you live, it's more likely their cultural identity will be British. Cultural identity more often than not influences national identity.

Nationality is not merely dependent upon place of birth as too many seem to believe.

English along with Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish are not nationalities. They are regional UK identities which is why none of them actually appear in a passport under nationality.

They are ethnicities which, according to Cambridge Dictionary, means:

"A large* group of people with a shared culture, language, history, set of traditions, etc., or the fact of belonging to one of these groups."*

And:

"The idea that English is an ethnic identity is widely repeated in the media and politics. That Englishness has become even more inclusive at a time in which our society has become more divided is to be welcomed.

Ethnicity is clearly much less important outside a small hardcore of residents. The further development of an inclusive Englishness would benefit from positive engagement by leaders across the political spectrum. This should aim to encourage BAME citizens to see English identity as open to them and that the strongest English identifiers continue to support the opening up of English identity.”

- John Denham, director of the Centre for English Identity and Politics

The same holds for Scottish, Welsh and Northern Irish.

The nationality of any UK citizen is British. Considering most English wish to keep the UK Union together, the fact British is the nationality of the United Kingdom shouldn't be forgotten.

https://iasservices.org.uk/pt/portuguese-citizenship-by-birth/#:~:text=Children%20born%20in%20Portugal%20to,for%20citizenship%20to%20be%20awarded.

Yes that's pretty clear, the OP's DC is not Portuguese or eligible for citizenship there (yet):

Portugal does not grant automatic citizenship to children of non-citizens born there. The parents must meet specific requirements for the children to become Portuguese citizens.
To be eligible for Portuguese citizenship as a child of a foreign national, you must meet the following criteria.
• One or both of your parents must have lived in Portugal for at least one year at the time of your birth.
• None of your parents must be an employee of your home country or the Portuguese State when you were born.
• You are 18 and above, are born in Portugal to foreign parents, and have lived in Portugal for over five years.
• You are below 18, have a serious disability, your parents became Portuguese citizens after you were born, and you have been living in Portugal for a minimum of five years.

I definitely would consider her English, I can't imagine her describing herself as Portuguese even if she stays there, that would be odd to me.

I have cousins in Spain, Canada and Austrailia. None have ever lived in Ireland but all consider themselves very much Irish because their parents are. I'm pretty sure none hold Irish passports either.