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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

It's a nasty neighbour one with diagram!

489 replies

bathroomwindowargh · 25/04/2023 11:53

So much of this is tedious backstory, but better to contextualise and not drip feed, so here we go. Also I’d prob be wise to change details but on the other hand I can barely get my head round it myself so this is all straight facts. Name changed though!
We live in a weird house, and when I moved in with now DH 15 years ago, as part of a revamp we built a new bathroom in part of the existing garage, bathroom had no window. The back wall of our house and garage and therefore the outer wall of the bathroom is a wall in someone else’s garden. I know I’m gonna have to add a diagram and I will!
The someone else was an elderly neighbour who I really loved and visited a lot, but she died a couple of years ago, and the house was empty for a bit.
This just happened to coincide with us re-doing the bathroom and DH thought it was a chance to put a window in. He didn’t put one in first time round because we asked elderly neighbour’s late DH and he said no, so fair enough we didn’t push it. But this time DH thought the timing meant he could get away with it. I was a bit unsure but he basically just went ahead.
In the process he a) informed the son of late elderly woman that window was happening and could he please tell any buyers.
b) informed the estate agents to please tell any buyers.
c) got planning permission.

Basically he kept in touch with son and EA so we thought all good. Window finished. New neighbours moved in. A couple in their 30s, new to the village (yes we live in a village, so it's rural). The bloke hit the roof at the window, and claims no one told him, but we have our suspicions that he might be telling porkies.
Now the window cannot be seen at all from their house (I know this for a fact because I spent plenty time in their house visiting elderly friend, and I’m well aware what parts of the garden are visible from the house and what are not). This wall is not. It’s not a large window it’s a wide but shallow window from top to bottom window and the glass is not remotely see through, proper obscured glass. But the bloke hates it and is obviously very pissed off.
I have some sympathy for this to be honest, I did think DH was chancing it building the window while the house was empty, even though he played it all by the book.

Now to the meat. Since they moved in bloke and DH are at loggerheads but managing to be sort of surface polite, bloke came round and discussed it with DH and DH agreed to a window limiter so window would only open a couple of inches. Not happy but agreed. I was away so I haven’t met them.
However – DH says bloke was subtly threatening and bullying, and since we agreed to window limiter bloke has put both a shed overlapping one end of the window, a trellis right up almost touching and – worst and most aggressive – a piece of wood against the outside of the window so that effectively we can’t open it all all, not even a centimetre. DH very upset. It does feel like a bullying act of aggression, especially given we agreed to limit the window from our side, and it means we can’t clean the outside of the window by opening it and with the trellis etc DH thinks it’s going to get quickly fouled up with trapped leaves.
Meanwhile the pretence at being civilised carries on apace and DH, who bumps into the bloke fairly regularly (I never seem to see them but I’m away a lot) has invited them both round for coffee and to see the bathroom, to which they’ve just replied they’ll get back to us with times.
DH wants civility to prevail and wants me to re-open the question of a window limiter and could he please kindly remove his fucking aggressive stick from our window (my words, I’m getting angry writing this).

My problem is I’m a post-menopausal harpy and I feel only capable of two modes with this. 1. Play dumb and nice but not get involved. 2. Give it to bloke with all barrels, tell him what I think of his piece of wood and call him out for bullying DH. DH is a totally non-macho pussycat by the way and probably mildly autistic, hence walking into this by blithely building his bloody window.
I could do without ANY of it! By the way there are no other windows on the back of our house except three roof skylights in the upstairs living room.

Help – what should I do? I’ve been putting off even thinking about it but it’s now upon us – the civilised visit – and I’m going to have to meet these people and say something. But what? AIBU to want to fight the bully?
Sorry so long. Really didn’t want to drip feed.

It's a nasty neighbour one with diagram!
OP posts:
ExhaustedPigwidgeon · 25/04/2023 14:50

skyfalldown · 25/04/2023 14:49

Not really, no.

It only opens a couple of inches so no one can see in/out.

If he's that bothered he can hang out at the other end of his fuck off massive garden.

Why should he have to?

ReadersD1gest · 25/04/2023 14:51

Was your house built on a plot taken from the end of your neighbours garden, op? The one on the right of the diagram?
The original building planning permission will have come with restrictions on overlooking, never mind a bathroom you decided to stick in your garage as soon as the occupier left the scene.

JudgeJ · 25/04/2023 14:52

Exasperatednow · 25/04/2023 12:17

If I was your neighbour I'd be annoyed. I wonder if you git planning permission because there wasn't anyone living there to object.

When we were looking at building an extension one stipulation from the start was that there could be no windows on the party line.

ReadersD1gest · 25/04/2023 14:54

skyfalldown · 25/04/2023 14:49

Not really, no.

It only opens a couple of inches so no one can see in/out.

If he's that bothered he can hang out at the other end of his fuck off massive garden.

Are you the neighbour, @skyfalldown ?! You're remarkably cavalier about making free with other people's land. His massive fuck off garden belongs to him, not you op.

Hairpinleg · 25/04/2023 14:55

What height is the window from the ground? If it's 2m or less, you might be lucky and the neighbour will only put a fence up against it to cover it.

steppemum · 25/04/2023 14:55

SofiaSoFar · 25/04/2023 14:32

Legally the permission was there.

For the 3rd time in this thread, planning permission does not redraw boundaries and cannot ever give OP permission to have a window opening over the boundary line.

The permission FOR THE WINDOW.

as has been said even in the very post that you quoted, he may need to make it an inward opening window, but that doesn't change the effect of toilet smells etc does it? It will still effect him to the same degree. I highly doubt that it is the 2 inches overhang of a window opening that is the issue here, much more likely the presence of the window itself, and the possibility that they can see out into his garden, and the window itself had planning permission. (albeit that is sounds as if it has been installe dincorrectly as an opeing window)

Rosula · 25/04/2023 14:58

I think you can reasonably say to the neighbour that you're sorry the window came as a surprise to him, but your understanding is that his solicitor would have been told about it as part of local searches and he needs to raise that with his solicitor. But otherwise I think you have to suck up the fact that either you have a window you can't open at all, or you have to pay for it to be inward opening.

AliceOlive · 25/04/2023 14:58

Have to say I am really surprised by all of these responses. If the window was installed after the house was under contract, that is one thing. If not, this couple bought a house with a window in a shared wall overlooking their garden and now are angry about it.

People have a right to a little air and light in their homes. If you don't like that, why buy a house with a shared wall attached to your garden?

This really is a first world problem for the neighbor. I hate that phrase, but seriously! Most people in the world don't have a garden or a garden wall, never mind one that is completely private and enclosed.

lunaloveroo · 25/04/2023 14:59

I would not be happy with this at all. I value my privacy, and I used the back half of my garden a lot as it gets the sun. I wouldn't want to see somebody in their bathroom and the noises associated. I too would be putting either a large fence there or a bit shrub/ tree.

purplecorkheart · 25/04/2023 15:00

OP are you 100% certain you have planning. The only reason I ask is a local lady discovered that she and her husband did not actually have planning for something on their property. Her husband who she trusted without question got her to sign all the planning documents for an application but never submitted them Claimed to post the planning notice on an area of their land she struggled to access etc. It was only when he passed away and she was trying to sell she learned the lack of planning.

Inertia · 25/04/2023 15:00

So does the law state that you’re allowed to have a window entirely within your boundaries (as you have planning permission) , but can’t open it (as that would be trespass?)

I don’t think the neighbour is unreasonable I’m not wanting your window opening into his garden. If he wants to site a shed in his own garden that’s up to him. I don’t think he can do anything which will actually damage your property though.

To be honest I’m not sure an inward opening window would be ideal anyway- if neighbour has backed a shed right up and is shoving random crap right up to your house, you’d probably end up with all sorts of spiders/ wood lice/ bugs plopping in through the window.

I think you need an extractor fan, keep that window closed, and look at a light tube of some kind out through the roof .

AliceOlive · 25/04/2023 15:02

ReadersD1gest · 25/04/2023 14:54

Are you the neighbour, @skyfalldown ?! You're remarkably cavalier about making free with other people's land. His massive fuck off garden belongs to him, not you op.

Are there not setbacks in UK?

A window (of unknown dimensions) hanging possibly a few inches over a shared boundary is hardly making free with anyone's land.

skyfalldown · 25/04/2023 15:03

ReadersD1gest · 25/04/2023 14:54

Are you the neighbour, @skyfalldown ?! You're remarkably cavalier about making free with other people's land. His massive fuck off garden belongs to him, not you op.

lol

GoodChat · 25/04/2023 15:05

Unfortunately, DH didn't get away with it and now because he's a pussycat and he wants civility to prevail he wants you to step in to make the big macho bully next door go away and leave him alone?

Exactly this. He acted like a snake and he knows it, now he can't fight his own battles. It's embarrassing.

BoogieBoogieWoogie · 25/04/2023 15:06

and it means we can’t clean the outside of the window by opening it

Just how were you planning on cleaning it OP?? If its that shallow, you wouldnt be able to reach your arm out anyway would you?

Muu · 25/04/2023 15:07

Your DH isn’t being bullied he’s just being treated like the CF he is.

what you did was legal but unneighbourly and your new neighbour doesn’t owe it to you to be friendly about it. Lots of people feel strongly about privacy in their gardens so I’m not surprised he is putting stuff in front of it.

fairycakes1234 · 25/04/2023 15:10

Its not ideal but its done now. If you are within your rights then just leave it. So you have lost a neighbour but so what. Most people hear judging by all the threads wouldn't even know their neighbours....Just move on from it and put it out of your head, no point in getting stressed about it.

Jonei · 25/04/2023 15:10

I don't think I'd be happy if I was the neighbour either. And I'd probably do what he has done.

CardinalCopia · 25/04/2023 15:12

I wouldn't get too used to the light from that window because the neighbour is absolutely going to either fence to the boundary or grow some very large bamboo in front of it.
As would I if it were in my garden. Sorry OP.

ReadersD1gest · 25/04/2023 15:14

AliceOlive · 25/04/2023 15:02

Are there not setbacks in UK?

A window (of unknown dimensions) hanging possibly a few inches over a shared boundary is hardly making free with anyone's land.

It's not a shared boundary, it's the neighbour's garden? Or isn't it? I assumed the issue was that op had built right up to the boundary of her own land.
She wouldn't be allowed to allow drainpipes, guttering, etc to overhang either.

ifIwerenotanandroid · 25/04/2023 15:14

skyfalldown · 25/04/2023 14:49

Not really, no.

It only opens a couple of inches so no one can see in/out.

If he's that bothered he can hang out at the other end of his fuck off massive garden.

So you don't believe that someone who buys property is entitled to use of their entire property? He's bought a massive garden because he wants a massive garden, not half a garden.

And you don't know which way the window opens, or how wide; & you haven't addressed the problems of noise & smells, or basic human dignity & privacy. So I'm afraid I can't help you any further.

HanSB · 25/04/2023 15:17

Not read entirety of thread but it looks like you have a tiny garden in comparison to both your neighbours. Could you buy the bottom end of his garden so that the bathroom wall end would be yours? As his garden looks very long he might be open to it and it would increase the value of your property if you could add a door to your house that side to access it?

ttcat37 · 25/04/2023 15:17

Perhaps make a peace offering to the neighbours of a very large potted tree which obscures the window. Be the peace keeper in this, apologise that it spoils the view for them and here is a tree that hopefully conceals the window, and would they please consider removing the wood?

DrPrunesquallor · 25/04/2023 15:18

You put an opening window on a boundary looking into someone’s garden and are surprised they don’t want it….Really?!!!

You also did it when you thought you’d get away with it
So you know it’s rude then
You have your planning permission but Personally I’d erect a fence right up against and higher than your window. Or an instant high hedge.

The neighbour has every right to do this. You bathroom is not a habitable room so you have no right to light. If you need it for ventilation then again that is not the neighbours issue you may have to install mechanical ventilation.

Think you and dh are really unreasonable.

MrBit · 25/04/2023 15:20

HanSB · 25/04/2023 15:17

Not read entirety of thread but it looks like you have a tiny garden in comparison to both your neighbours. Could you buy the bottom end of his garden so that the bathroom wall end would be yours? As his garden looks very long he might be open to it and it would increase the value of your property if you could add a door to your house that side to access it?

I suggest you read the whole thread or at least @bathroomwindowargh Posts before answering