Older men expecting you to move

[Miloticc]

…And getting furious when you don’t??
Is it just me? Men keep getting really angry at me when I won’t move out the way or let them into traffic, etc. A few examples:

This morning I didn’t let an older gentleman in a Range Rover filter into traffic from a junction, because the car behind me was already yielding for him. He was beeping, swearing and flashing his lights like crazy at me 😳

The other day an older man in a van tried to force his way in front of me in a lane merge (when there was no gap in front of me and no cars behind me) and was absolutely seething that I didn’t just stop and let him do it.

I had a man in about his 60’s (not old by any means, so capable of waiting with the rest of us) try and step in front of me in a bus queue and was livid when I wouldn’t make space for him and he had to go to the back. He actually shoved me.

When I walk down the street everyone kind of weaves around each other but I’ve noticed men that are older than me (I’m in my 30’s) will try and walk right through me, expecting me to jump out their way.

Obviously not all men, but enough that I’m really noticing it. More so now than when I was in my early 20’s! They stay calm if they get their own way, but if I dare to stand my ground they go from 0-100

YABU - Just move and let them get on with it
YANBU - It shouldn’t make them so angry

I think you’ve hit the nail on the head of what I was trying to say, because it’s not that I feel annoyed that generally I’ve found older men to expect more space. But that i can’t understand why they don’t cope when you refuse to give them it and they get furiously angry.

Its the rudeness and swearing and shouting and barging 😳

I genuinely feel like I don’t have any experiences with men of my own age where they’ve been horrible to me. Maybe flashed their lights or something, but not gone absolutely ballistic.

Pram Vs person! Especially when they go in large groups. I used to just barge through 😁. And have banged cars etc. Interesting when I bigger I got more aggression now I have lost a lot of weight I'm more tolerated!

In my experience it seems to be mainly middle aged women that are incredibly impatient, don’t hold open doors, don’t let you out (when driving) and don’t move out the way when walking (either walking straight at you or taking up the entire pavement with their friend).

Whenever you make a post identifying a particular demographic it is problematic but I really appreciate you considering that.

You can see from your thread that a lot of people had similar experiences and a lot didn't. A lot of people had negative experiences with teenagers, women, parents of both sexes and mums on the school run.

And it also had posters saying 'it's all men' and degenerating into jokes about pathetic men and their small penises making them angry.

And posters like me being attacked, accused of bullying and being a man etc.

'Isms' matter whether we're part of that group or not. If it's acceptable to say older men or all men do x, y or z and lol about them being little men with little penises? then it's acceptable to talk about older women being Karen's who have dried up fannies and are bitter because no-one wants to have sex with them?

Which is what a lot of men and some women will say. And none of it is okay. There is a huge amount of women on MN who engage in misogyny because they think its justified because they don't like that celebrity woman or what that celeb or non-celeb woman is doing so appearance shaming or Mum shaming is acceptable.

So my advice would be. If it was any other -ism would you post? Would you start a thread saying 'black/disabled/ gay/trans people do this?

Goddd I would have just stopped and stared at
him blankly until he moved out the way

what a strange post. We’d all be up in arms if a similar one was made about women.

What nonsense. Men are vastly more violent and aggressive on the whole and commit the vast, vast majority of crime, particularly violent and sexual and they are responsible for most verbal and physical harassment of women. It's perfectly valid to single out men as being a problem for women. It's not all men but a significant number are arseholes and a problem to a greater or lesser degree.

@Zippedydoo123 oooohhh you're pwetty! Good for you, getting that male attention! You must be better than all us old redundant hags

you might want to check what "internalised misogyny" and "the male gaze" means.

Both men and women. Yesterday the 50-something woman in my lane wanted to stop and do dance exercises at the end of each length. Made it incredibly difficult to touch the ends.

I drive quite a lot and in my experience, lots of women around my age (early to mid 30s) in giant SUVs behave horrendously on the roads. I've seen easily as much rage as a stereotypical "white van man" from these women in their huge BMWs, tailgating and screeching past people without indicating.

However, I see it far more often from men. Just last week I was driving home from work and had been tailgated by a man for about two miles. I was driving completely appropriately but he was fuming. Then I heard a short burst of siren and saw blue lights in my mirror, so I obviously indicated and pulled over.

I looked in my mirror to see where the ambulance was and I saw Fuming Guy about to explode, then he overtook me at speed. He immediately had to stop and pull in because the ambulance blasted the siren right behind him; it had had to brake so it didn't hit him. When we started moving again, I did a "wanker" gesture, which he saw in his mirror. Childish, yes, but clearly he overtook me in a rage without even checking his mirrors because he had no idea an ambulance was speeding up behind him!

yanbu - I noticed this a couple of years ago and decided to conduct a little experiment.
I was walking with my blind nephew down Brick Lane, it has a lot of street furniture so quite difficult to navigate with him as it easiest if we’re side by side.
At least 98% of people, make way for him, either by waiting, moving aside or even jumping over barriers to get out of the way, nearly everyone is very happy to make way for him or make his path easier. (It does actually restore your faith in humanity a little)
The only people who didn’t make way were older males. Not all older males of course, but only older males, every single woman and younger man made way, I was counting.

This was one afternoon on one street but quite interesting.

I'm 8 months pregnant and notice that nobody older than me (I'm 35) moves or helps in any way anymore. It's not that I expect the help because I'm pregnant, but if I saw anyone struggling to carry something heavy or could see a reason they need a set for example, I'd help them.

I think attitudes have changed. And I agree it does seem to be an older generation thing that I've noticed.

It does tend to be men that are more pushy when driving.
But I’ve noticed it’s definitely younger men.

Im older than you OP so to you they would be older🤣 but not people in their 60s. More 20 - 40 ish.

And more at the lower end of that age band.
Plus a lot of the younger ones don’t seem to have a clue about the rules of the road when they push you out of the way whilst making rude hand gestures, hands off the wheel, and swearing.

Im interested to know if MN know that you cannot overtake from the inside lane on a motorway…this rule seems to be forgotten / not explained to many drivers as they cause near accidents.

I hear you OP. I am a short woman in my 40s, and have often wondered about how different an experience my DH (a tall man) must have just on a daily basis walking around. I really notice it walking on crowded pavements and across busy stations, I feel like I do all the give in terms of weaving around and certain people do all the take. If I don't weave around enough I get shoulder barged (to be fair I've noticed this when I was much younger too). It was really stark for a period 10 years ago when I was on crutches I just thought no, fuck it, it's not easy currently for me to weave around I'm sticking to a straight line other people need to get out of my way. The amount of people (mainly men) who still expected me, on crutches, to move out of their way!

Yeah I agree. There are lots of men of a slightly older generation (I would say 50+) that still hold the view that they are somehow more worthy than women. It gives me the rage.

I dont think there is a specific law about undertaking. But it can be seen as careless/dangerous driving

I agree with @amusedbush parents dropping kids off, no matter what sex or indeed car type are a nightmare on the roads and don’t give a toss about anyone else or indeed the Highway Code.

It would be great to secretly take a pic of the angry face of the bloke who won't move aside in Patriarchy Chicken, and to post it on a special Angry Chicken website.

Nope, never had this. Unfortunately I find the most inconsiderate drivers to be female and have school aged kids.
But then again we need a daily all men are wank*rs thread I suppose.

There was a thread on here called something like 'Patriarchy chicken' a few years ago, that was eye opening to me.

Oh come off it. Men, especially of an older generation, are more sexist. It's a generalisation of course - because not all men are - but many many are. Let's not deny there there is a huge issue with sexism in our society by turning it around on the women and making out like they are the ones that are sexist. It's gaslighting, pure and simple.

Does this depend on where you live? I don't have this experience...

I was nearly in an accident some years back when this happened to the car in front of me that indicated to move into left lane and had to do an emergency manoeuvre to avoid an overtaking car.

Quite the pile up, no one hurt.
They caught up with offender and he was charged with dangerous driving.

On the motorway yesterday I also nearly moved left as a driver overtook, it happens all the time now. That was a woman on her phone.

One of the things that prompted me to post was that when I told my DH (tall and intimidating looking imo) about this morning’s road rage he noted that although he gets beeped at now and then, he doesn’t get them effing and blinding or shouting at him. They kind of beep once and let it drop 😳

I can’t imagine expecting someone on crutches to move out of my way that’s awful!

Female pedestrians: I used to notice that occasionally a woman with a pushchair/buggy coming towards me would seem to look around & then move across the pavement quite deliberately, to be in front of me & make me step out of her way - in the same way PPs have said men (without buggies) do. It seemed to me entirely pointless. Has anyone on MN done it? And why??

I’ve said YABU because you’ve generalised.

plenty of lovely older men out there too. Plenty of arsehole younger men/younger women/older women.

You’ve just encountered a few on the trot.