Kids running around in church

[ThatFraggle]

I'm not religious but sometimes go with someone who is. This week there were three toddlers screaming/crying/babbling through the service.

Their parents let them run up and down the aisle. At one point one mum picked the kid up, but instead of going to the back, just sort of hung around in the middle of the aisle with the kid. As if she wanted us to be like 'awww what an adorable little scamp.' During the service.

I can imagine that for someone spiritual it's especially annoying when trying to pay attention to the sermon or the prayers, reading etc.

Honestly, if you know you've got a screamer, you are not going to be able to bring the kid to church for a couple of years, or alternate with a partner if you have one.

Yes, Jesus loved children, but it doesn't mean little Tarquin should get to scream through the service.

AIBU to be really annoyed about disruptive children in church?

I don’t know about this one. I was raised Catholic and went to Mass every week. We have chosen a Catholic school for our son, primarily because we liked the family atmosphere of the school as well as its values. When I went to the open day, another parent played Duplo with my little boy so I could listen to the head teacher’s introduction: there was no way our son would have sat down for the whole of that 20 min talk.

We live in London and have no parents or other family near us - so outside professional childcare, it’s all on us and it can be tough at times. That kindness was hugely appreciated. Jesus practised tolerance and I felt that kindness was that lady living her faith.

Because they’re never guide dogs?

Oh no that’s absolutely not my main driver. My primary goal is for the children to be taught in an age-appropriate (and not boring) way, for their faith to be nurtured and for them to feel welcome as you say. However I had the joy of being able to attend an actual service(!) without my children (Granny to the rescue!) and I just appreciated having the space to listen without distractions. You’re right though, we usually bring them back for communion too so OP’s concerns probably wouldn’t be addressed.

Why is that relevant? If you're letting your kids run riot and be distracting so people can't listen to the sermon that makes you a pretty selfish person 🤷‍♀️ being in Church shouldn't give you a free pass to act like an asshole

I’m guessing the poster doesn’t know. But the needs of one DC do not trump a room full of ill people.

The DP of that child knew they were in a doctors surgery. Therefore a lot of ill people, probably in pain and feeling very poorly. People who really did not need to be dealing with a 3 year old driving at them.

Unlike Jack Russells and Poodles 🙄
I'm still not clearer.

It's relevant because those that hold these view are usually neither Christians nor regular church goers.
I can't imagine thinking this about any of the families who attend our church. Firstly I genuinely care about this children and their parents in our church. Secondly I am aware that if they are behaving in a disruptive way it is usually because they have some additional needs or the parents are just struggling. So I would feel compassion. I would try and support them rather than judging them. Surely this is what church is all about?!

As I said previously, most churches have two services, an earlier traditional one and a later family service. If you don't want yo be distracted by children then it would make sense to attend the earlier one.

Well I'm not a regular Church goer, but my cousin is. And I know that would really annoy her, she goes every week with her children who are well behaved, like all the other children there, so why should she then have to go to another service later because other children aren't? I'd say the reason no one says anything is because they feel that can't because it's not very "Christian" and they feel they have to be polite. I'm sure if you asked them if they'd rather the children were sitting quietly or running riot, they'd tell you your preference. I also suspect by your user name, it's your children who run "wild" and that's why you don't think it's a bother 🤔

Children are the future congregation, churches will die out without them.

I’m actually anti-religion as I think it’s nonsense, BUT I have friends who are religious and respect their beliefs. We’ve had many conversations that the church and religion and dying out (my view) and in many ways it’s because it’s old, stuffy, strict, overly formal and unwelcoming. If parents can’t take their kids then the congregation both reduces and loses future members. If the vicar, priest or whatever has no issue then who are you to judge it.

My children are actually pretty good at sitting through the service and my eldest two go off to Sunday school now anyway. We do have a few children with additional needs in our congregation who find it harder to sit still quietly. Also when parents are feeling stressed they are less likely to be so on top of their childrens behaviour. Our vicar makes it clear that children are welcome in the service despite occasionally running around or talking too loudly. I'm pretty sure our congregation would rather children present and occasionally running around or being too noisy than kept at home. We all try to look out for each other! If a child had behavioural issues I really believe none of us would want them or their parents excluded from the service.

It great that your cousins children and all the other children are well behaved at her church.

This.

This is exactly what my priest said when I asked if it was ok that my 18 month old comes to the services.

Suffer the little children…

I don't have a problem with children in church dir lost things. But I really struggled with a noisy toddler late at night. On Maundy Thursday. The entire cathedral was silent and watching at the altar of repose. And a toddler was at the back. It really spoiled it. I did wonder why you'd bring children out for a very formal service that late. But the bulging is enormous and I don't think they realised the sound carried like it did.

Building* fat fingers!

I’m so sorry you experienced this - that priest was entirely wrong to behave that way. Especially when you had made an effort to be respectful of him - awful that he didn’t extend the same courtesy.

funerals are public services by the way. Unless the notice states ‘close family only’, you can assume you can go in.

I agree some services aren’t appropriate for little kids and people should bear that in mind. Good Friday meditation or Maundy Thursday are good examples of where a child making noise is going to interrupt the purpose and spirit of the worship

Some church schools require regular attendance from preschoolers and their families to get a reference for the school. Some preschoolers really aren’t ready for sitting still through an hour long service but their parents don’t have much choice if they want them to go to the faith school.

A child, baby or teen has as much right to be at church as I do.

They are baptised members of the church, as I am.

They act their age, so do I.

We talk a lot about children being the future of the church, but actually they are they present of the church, and the future leaders of the church.

Today a three year old took up the bread at the offertory procession. She was beautifully behaved.
Last week she had a tantrum. That's just life.

We have 3 adults who are regular congregation members, with severe SEN. Who attend church with carers.
One is very vocal, making far more random sounds than any child. She is welcome.
One watches his (silent)tablet throughout to calm himself. He is welcome.
The other helps out with many things and loves to sing, but out of time and which the wrong tune and words. She is welcome.

The kids learn, they grow up. I thought my eldest son would never learn to behave and stay still and quiet in church. He is now 18 behaves. You won't hear a peep out of him...except when he does the bible reading.

Kids are welcome in church.

Wow. I think anyone who feels that young children shouldn’t be allowed in a church have rather misunderstand the purpose of going to church! I’d never want a mother to feel she can’t come to church because she has a young child, or that she needs to struggle to find childcare. Nobody I go to church with has ever expressed anything other than welcoming and understanding towards young families.

I go to church and we accept that children are… children! Church is supposed to be a community where people love and support one another. In my church ( not in the UK at the moment ), if the child is restless everyone cares for them together! People barely raise an eyebrow when a child is loud. Some people pack extra little toys that a child can play with quietly just in case another child wants one / gets bored and needs distracting with a quiet activity. Some people bring treats for the kids so if they are tempted to run around they can have a treat if they sit quietly! Just trying to help out other mums. It’s really appreciated.

I’d never want a young child or their parent to feel excluded from a church. Everyone is welcome here.

My children go to church with my ex and they are very welcoming to children. If you don't encourage children the church will die off as most attendees are 65+ They sit nicely etc as are no longer toddlers who roam. Generally people who are not so keen on children go to the services on Saturday evening or early on a Sunday. The late morning service is the long family friendly one followed by cake and socialising.

Some priests are awful. When I was with my ex I used to accompany him to catholic church, We went to live in Canada for a bit and went to church there and I was quite frankly appalled. A story of a young christian girl with special needs who had defaced a koran in Pakistan was in the news and whilst she had my sympathy I'd expect a sermon on tolerance and understanding. Instead it just felt really like he was borrowing rhetoric from the crusades. May Jesus protect this christian child and may the worshippers of Islam feel his wrath type stuff. We never went back.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19315210

Could have written this myself! We had a dreadful experience last Christmas with a kid screaming crying behind us all through a service. It was honestly quite distressing and the priest had made it clear at the start of the service that if any parents and kids wished to be excused there was an area at the back of the church where they could have some chill out time with books and toys etc. I don't understand why parents let their kids be so disruptive - it seems really unfair on the kids more than anything. And FWIW my church has children's services after the normal service on a Sunday which is a bit more enjoyable and the lessons are much easier for them to understand.

It is a nearly impossible thing for churches to handle in a way that feels right to everyone. OP I’m not 100% sure if your issue is with the parents of children who are making a noise, or with the leadership of the churches that are accepting of it. And I’m not clear on what you feel the appropriate solution is.

I would ask you (nicely) to put yourself in the position of the church leader in this case who is on the hook for managing the problem you describe - who let’s assume is acting in good faith.
Do you choose to ban under 11s from your main services altogether and insist they go to all-age worship or Messy Church somewhere else?
Do you allow children but then have the church wardens police disruptive behaviour and march round asking people to be quiet or leave?
And is it just children you would get the wardens / sidespeople to ask to leave, or adults with learning difficulties who make unexpected loud noises or rustle sweet wrappers?

I’m sure if you play out the scenarios above, with all the likely consequences, you’ll start to see what an incredibly thorny matter it is for the leadership.
Against a backdrop of falling church attendance, and the real desire to embrace the messiness and disruption of real life in favour of a culture of welcome and including people (per the big JC himself), many leaders are very reluctant indeed to put any barriers at all in the way of people coming along to church.

If however, your beef is with the parents allowing excessively noisy behaviour in a formal service then I’m pretty much with you. I have three DC and have always, always either kept them reasonably quiet in church services where there was no provision for children or taken them out if that became impossible.