to think its morally poor not to provide ANY childcare whatsoever as a grandparent, if you are retired and in good health?

[uniformotxa]

I have young dc and no childcare issues aside from the horrendous cost. My parents, like many others I know, enjoy being with dc but it’s pretty much always on their terms. They would take them for a day but it wouldn’t be consistent or reliable so couldn’t make it a regular thing.

Im not sure how I feel about this and on balance I think it’s pretty morally dire. Luckily I can afford childcare and nursery but I perhaps would feel more strongly if I couldn’t. However, whilst it’s easy for me to say this now, I do think I would step up and do some childcare for my dc if they had children. I can’t imagine just letting the days roll by leisurely and not setting aside even one day a week to be a reliable help.

I know in other cultures this is standard and families pull together much more. AIBU to think there is actually a moral obligation here, to make some form of childcare contribution, however small?

It depends. I think if your grandparents were heavily involved in child care your parent should do the same. My mum looked after my DD my grandparents looked after me. I will look after any DGC I am blessed with as much as I can. My exes mum has never been alone with my DC but always said she wouldn't be hands on from the start and although I don't understand it I respect her honesty. We never expected help but it deffo saved money!

I think there's a middle ground between providing full time childcare and doing absolutely nothing.

So if grandparents are healthy and local I think help in emergencies is good. The odd night so parents can go out and enjoy themselves. Helping out on an inset day. That sort of thing.

My own parents are dead but my mil is a very disinterested grandparent. Loads of money but wouldn't even stick a tenner in a birthday card let alone look after one of her grandchildren. She doesn't even have family over...it blows my mind that our DC have never eaten a meal cooked by granny. Dh says nothing. I find it perplexing. If my parents were alive and had zero interest in my kids, I'd have told them to fuck off quite honestly.

i did get quite a bit of help with childcare from my parents but a) my mum retired at 60 and even before that only worked mornings and b) they lived a 6 mins walk from us. i work full time and am likely to do so until age 68. no grandchildren yet but eldest daughter currently lives 220 miles away. the chances of me being able to offer anything substantial in terms of child care is very very low.

@saraclara this is the kind of grandparent I’d want to be.

I want to be involved and help but I can’t imagine wanting to be the childminder.

My parents and ILs would probably provide similar levels to this if we all lived nearer.. but we don’t, so it’ll be once in a blue moon. It’s fine.

The selfish entitlement Nimbus!

Like absolutely everything in life, wait till you've walked in their shoes before casting judgement.

I'm nearly 50 now and so so much tireder than I ever remember being in my 30s.

I've no idea if I'll get even tireder as I get older.

@Ponoka7

Op said 'my parents' not 'my mother'. The inference that childcare is women's work has come from everyone else.

My parents worked full time when mine were small (Dad didn't make retirement age sadly). My inlaws were too old and infirm. So I paid for every minute of childcare.
I now have a pre school granddaughter but am still 12 years off state retirement. I help out with the cost of nursery, it's the best i can do.
But, to be fair if I do make it to retirement age I intend to enjoy every lazy moment of it. I will have worked 49 years by then!

I agree with this. Nice if they offer, fine if they don’t. Their retirement is there’s to do with as they please.

But, to be fair if I do make it to retirement age I intend to enjoy every lazy moment of it. I will have worked 49 years by then

Me too!

It's a big responsibility and commitment to expect grandparents to have set days a week for childcare. Ad hock babysitting/collecting from school or nursery/helping in some (but not every) school holiday and helping in emergencies is not an unrealistic expectation if you have a good relationship with parents.
My mum offered to have my first child 2 days a week when I went back to work on Jobshare. One week she would have dd Mon / Tue and the following week it would be Thur / Fri. The arrangement lasted about a year and I was extremely grateful but I did not expect her to do that much.

helping out from time to time is very different from regular childcare.

When I was pregnant with my first we told our parents that we would not be asking them to help with childcare. It hadn’t even been a consideration, but various threads on here made me want to make it clear to them we had no expectations. Their time was their own and we didn’t want to be trying them down to make our lives easier. My MiL, relatively young, fit, and extremely excited to become a grandmother for the first time, was slightly disappointed I think. My parents, older and having already had 5 grandchildren, would not have offered anyway.

My children have fantastic relationships with all their grandparents. MiL did lots of ad hoc babysitting and had the girls over for sleepovers; my parents, who lived further away, came up to help out in emergencies and had both children for weekends occasionally.

If I ever become a grandparent I will help if needed, but would be disappointed if I thought my daughters went into parenthood with the expectation I’d provide regular care.

I know in other cultures this is standard and families pull together much more
I'm thinking that these are cultures in which the generations are much more enmeshed, the grandparents will be doing this knowing that it gives them the leverage to control their children and make sure that their children feel a very strong duty to make sacrifices to care for the grandparents as they age.

Exactly I wouldn't to be an unpaid childminder and bossed about. These arrangements always have resentment built in. You can't expect to be the boss if you want free childcare. I would definitely contribute towards nursery and ad-hoc days maybe as I have a daughter it won't be so bad. But many on MN are hypercritical of their parents providing care even though it's free.

I think expecting regular comments is wrong but expecting to be involved and help is right.

I think a bit depends on how many kids you have.I will be very conscious that what I do for one, I want to do for all.My mum looked after my kids and both my siblings had moved abroad, however when they had chikdren they moved back to the area

I wonder if those who won't help with grandchildren will want help from their children in their old age? I hope not, what goes around comes around.

I know in other cultures this is standard and families pull together much more. AIBU to think there is actually a moral obligation here, to make some form of childcare contribution, however small?

If you want to take advantage of this kind of culture (which is almost always disadvantageous to women since the brunt of any caring responsibilities tends to fall on them), then you must also willingly embrace the other side of it. Which will be that you provide whatever care is needed for your elderly parents when it is required. I suspect your moral compass may start to falter at that point.

People are different - my mum quit her job immediately when my sister in law fell pregnant - all she wanted to do was to help - which she did - daily until now. They now have 3 kids and mum helps all the time, whether it be cooking, sending to school, pick up or just tidying up the house - sister in law doesn’t work and helps too and it’s pretty lovely how close my mum is to the kids - I don’t live there (different country) so it’s a bit sad for me - but I love the set up they have - this year and last, mum and dad have decided they will visit me for 3/4 months in the summer for as long as they can (they are getting on a bit) - which again - amazing. Getting to know the kids and helping out with whatever we need. Amazing.

In laws live In The same country - but have a totally hands off approach - prefer to travel and have holiday homes in different parts of the world. I don’t begrudge them it - it’s their life and their time. Even before mum visiting last year - I never wanted or needed their help - they visited twice a year and were nice to the kids then which was great. Different strokes for different folks. I don’t think morals comes into it at all. They are not morally obliged to look after your children.

What really comes across in some the posts in agreement with the OP, is that womens rights haven't progressed much at all. And that other women are complicit in that.

A woman brings up her own kids, has a full timejob of her own for decades, finally retires, and then, because she's female, she has to put away any other plans for her life, and commit to childcare for her GCs?

It's actually appalling that women with children will sacrifice their own mothers' futures.

From my perspective, if my DC have children, I would love to be involved in their lives - part of having children, for me, is having family, and so that extends to their partners and dc. Whether it needs to be a formal childcare situation or more casual visits will depend on circumstances, but I hope we will all help each other out and benefit from it too. The relationship between grandparents and grandchildren can be quite wonderful!

There's no basis to force it, but I'm with you OP. They see you struggling but won't offer just one day a week? That's mean.

I don't know about morally poor exactly, but I do find it odd unless the parents' relationship with the grandparents is problematic. Or unless there are major practical reasons not to, such as distance. Surely the majority of people don't actually live near enough to grandparents for regular childcare to work?

I think it’s dependant on how much childcare your own grandparents provided when you was little. I spent so so much time with mine, all through the summer holidays and half terms and every night after school after the age of about 11.. So I think it has set the expectation that my parents & partners parents will do the same.
Personally both sets of grandparents would have my baby whenever I asked, they beg to look after him so I’m very very lucky.
But my grandparents done the same.

No-one has a moral obligation to look after your children other than you.