to think its morally poor not to provide ANY childcare whatsoever as a grandparent, if you are retired and in good health?

[uniformotxa]

I have young dc and no childcare issues aside from the horrendous cost. My parents, like many others I know, enjoy being with dc but it’s pretty much always on their terms. They would take them for a day but it wouldn’t be consistent or reliable so couldn’t make it a regular thing.

Im not sure how I feel about this and on balance I think it’s pretty morally dire. Luckily I can afford childcare and nursery but I perhaps would feel more strongly if I couldn’t. However, whilst it’s easy for me to say this now, I do think I would step up and do some childcare for my dc if they had children. I can’t imagine just letting the days roll by leisurely and not setting aside even one day a week to be a reliable help.

I know in other cultures this is standard and families pull together much more. AIBU to think there is actually a moral obligation here, to make some form of childcare contribution, however small?

My parents were still working when I had children, so couldn't help. I'm mid 40s, likely to be working for another 20 years +. If my son has children at the same age as me they'll be grown up before I finish work, so no, I won't be able to help with childcare.

Sorry, I should add I don't feel grandparents have a moral responsibility to provide childcare.

My in-laws do regular childcare for my sister in law and her husband. While they enjoy the time spent with the grandchildren, they do find (and express to me, I suspect they don't to my sister in law) that having to do it all the time is difficult and stops them being able to do things like go on a short holiday when they want to.

We've never expected it from either side (the in-laws live too far away anyway) though my mum helped out when I was pregnant with DD2 and needed a lot of scans. I'm happy for either set of grandparents to spend time with my children and if they can help out occasionally with childcare that's lovely, but because of what my in-laws say I'm careful not to create a situation where I need them to do it on the regular.

If you are not used to living with / having close contact with your son/ daughter / mim / dad, suddenly being beholden to them or dependent on them can also make for a tricky relationship.

I had to convalescence after an operation for several weeks in my 30s and my mum came to stay to help me out. She was a strong minded, opinionated character (though lovely and meant well) and I found it stressful when she imposed her own standards / rules in my house and made critical comments about it. I used my fatigue as an excuse to retire to my bed to get away from it!

My mil did help us with our first child, and she was not at all critical, very easy going, but she had to stay overnight with us for 3 nights and I found it very wearing.

Maybe it's just me, but I found it much easier when we had a nanny we could give instructions to or when we outsourced to a childminder.

😆 the fact that you genuinely think this shows how entitled and selfish you are.
Summer holidays you see so many stressed ( I assume) grandparents with small children. Obviously having to look after them a lot . And trying to entertain them .
I think especially once they get to a certain age ,they should have no regular responsibility for children . They should be able too relax and do as they please . Enjoy retirement.

Probably not as wearing as your mother in law found it.

Maybe so! But in her later years she lived with us for two extended periods. By then we had a bigger house and she had her own large room with her own furniture and did her own thing, which worked fine.

I think especially once they get to a certain age ,they should have no regular responsibility for children . They should be able too relax and do as they please . Enjoy retirement

Fair enough. So when they need help due to age and frailty the same should apply then? Their grown children should have no responsibility for them either - they should be able to relax and do as they please.

Again, grandparents apparently have to raise/look after TWO generations, to deserve any support in their old age? Why is that? Is raising their own children not enough? I don't get the logic.

The exact same applies to their kids! Their grown children are looking after their own kids too so therefore why should they look after two generations? why is that ok for them?

Why should they? They have lives still to live.Fight for decent childcare.Its not their job to provide child care so you ll wipe their...a....e in 20 years time.

No I don't think there's any moral obligation for anyone to provide childcare.

And going by the thousands of threads on MN over the years, it can be an absolute minefield for family members to provide childcare unless it meets the absolute specifications and preferences of the parents.

So many people would rather opt out than risk causing friction in the relationship because they did something the parent objected to.

I dont think this is about you should do x so someone else does y.

However, if families cant or wont help each other out (not all the time obv but on occasion) then surely it does go both ways?

We have 9 grandchildren whose ages range from 1 to 26!!
We both worked full time until retirement at 65 and 67, helped where we could with the older grandchildren, and help if we can with the younger ones.
However, both of my children moved away for work, one 3 hours away and the other one 7 hours away.
Helping out is not a viable option on a daily basis anymore, so we see them when we can, and have the 4 remaining younger ones for a week in summer and also offer two long weekends a year, to enable their parents to have a child free break three times a year.
We are now in our seventies and late sixties, some health issues, but try our best to help out where we can.
We still visit for a weekend every couple of months to see everyone and enjoy seeing our families, but we certainly couldn’t manage to look after them on a daily basis.

@Greeneyedminx

You sound very kind and its perfectly reasonable to help out when you can but recognise that daily care would simply be too much for you.

My dad point blank refused to help me at all (not even for a few hours once a year and he lived nearby and was perfectly healthy at that point) and I asked for barely anything at all. I'm an only child and my mum died young, H's family lives in another country so we had zero help at all.

However, when my dad years later got ill with dementia, I took time off work to help him, whilst also still looking after my own kids. It was exhausting and in the end I did end up feeling quite resentful that the burden was all on me when he had refused to help us out even once. He had also relied on grandparent help when I was a child so he had that help himself! In the end I got carers in to help him because it was just too much for me to look after both him and my own kids, and hold down a job.

I dont agree that its tit for tat but I also dont think its unreasonable to expect mutual support from your family when you are struggling. It does go both ways in my opinion, otherwise its just selfish.

100% don't have to do anything. Not a moral issue either, it's totally up to them how they spend their time. Sounds very entitled tbh.

So did the grandparents. They looked after their own children and supported their parents too, in most cases. In fact I'm supporting three generations. My daughters, my granddaughters and my 90 year old mother. Fortunately my mother's day to day care is now taken care of, but not fully. And no, my mum didn't do a single day of childcare for mine (nor would I have allowed it, but that's another OP)

Where does one get to have a bit of time for one's self? I suggest maybe for a few years after retirement, if one's own parents' care isn't an issue. So caring for grandchildren is a choice, not a requirement. I chose to help where I can, but not with a weekly work related commitment.

they’ve raised their children, why on earth should they now have to help raise yours?

good for them enjoying their retirement and not allowing their daughter to use them as free childcare.

I suggest maybe for a few years after retirement, if one's own parents' care isn't an issue. So caring for grandchildren is a choice, not a requirement. I chose to help where I can, but not with a weekly work related commitment

Again, the same applies to adult children. They are often juggling full time jobs, childcare etc caring for a parent is also not a requirement, its a choice. My parents didnt help their parents so not the case in my situation at all!

Morally obligated is probably a bit strong, but honestly don't see why you wouldn't want to help out and spend time with your GC unless you don't like your family very much. If they don't help out then at least you won't feel any guilt putting them into a home / getting in carers when they get older. but if they do help out and put you and GC first then you are probably morally obligated to care for them in older age or at least to move them in to your home so they aren't left alone and reliant on strangers to care for them?

Grandparents didn't help with childcare. DH worked days I worked nights to make ends meet.

If your post content matched the title I’d probably agree. It’s pretty poor to never help out. It’s a very different thing to not want to commit 1/more days a week all the time. I’d be upset if my parents would never babysit/never take kids out to do something fun for the day/wouldn’t help /if childcare fell through when they had no particular plans otherwise. I didn’t expect them to come and do a day every week and was surprised when they wanted to.
Generally 5-6 weeks a year they are away and they will come a different day or skip a week but otherwise they are here come rain or shine on a Friday for school pick ups and to spend a few hours with the kids

Noone is morally obliged to look after grandchildren, no.

Noone is morally obliged to look after their parents either.

Both are a choice and both might cause the carer to suffer financially, emotionally and/or physically. I couldnt look after my parents as they moved away (their choice), they didnt help me with childcare due to distance and I couldnt care for them due to distance and the fact I was working full time and looking after 4 young kids. All were choices we made and neither of us were "wrong".

YABU

It depends what you mean by 'moral obligation' and 'looking after' means.

When it comes to elderly parents and their DC taking on caring responsibilities it's because they are no longer able to look after themselves. No-ones going round to clean their elderly parents flat because the elderly parent expects them to help out while they go to work or go out

Which is very different to a Grandparent providing childcare to save the working parent money on childcare costs or because they want a night out.

What you're saying is a false equivalence.