Those of you who voted for Brexit when is it going to get better and how?

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I didn’t and didn’t see any benefits. Tried to refocus anger about the lies during the campaign to resignation and acceptance. Was ready to try and embrace/ focus on positives and move forward but still really can’t see any. Now just getting increasingly worried and also fearful.

Hit me with all the benefits and when we’re going to see them impacting our lives.

Northern Rock crashing would have spread panic around the retail banking sector, leading to an even worse crisis, this is real peoples money, nurses teachers, mortgages.. it would have been a disaster.

Had the Americans bailed out Lehmann's, the GFC would have been less severe, where we have all gone wrong is not making the banks pay back their bailouts, instead we allow them un capped bonuses!

Which party allowed that?

There are some enjoyable attempts to side track this onto totally different issues, but I note we are still waiting for someone to articulate a genuine benefit of brexit

<Tumbleweed>

I’m presenting things as I believe Keir Starmer sees them, not how I see them. If I’d had my way Labour would have spelled out clearly to people what the consequences of Brexit would be. Sadly Corbyn hated the EU and Starmer has shown less mettle than I would like.

There was a good post earlier but sadly they got put off by insults etc and said they were out

You'd think people would be queuing up to list all of them proudly wouldn't you.

To bask in the glory of having given our country the wonderful gift that is Brexit.

Quite.

What you say above about the Americans and Lehmann's is completely true.

We diverge on the point of Northern Rock. It's like a deep, sharp cut as opposed to death by a thousand cuts. Only the latter lasts a lot longer.

I despise Blair. That doesn't mean I'm making any excuses for the Tories (whom I despise even more), either. But with the onset of 'New' Labour (AKA Old Tory) and the convergence of the two in the middle, the distinctions between the two became extremely blurred.

There wasn't a pin to choose between Thatcher and Blair, IMO.

I really object to the idea that British people are too lazy to do nursing etc and would prefer to sit at home on benefits. Firstly, I think it suits the state to hire qualified workers from other countries because they don't have to pay the costs of training our own workers. Paying benefits to an unemployed Brit is cheaper than training costs. In the short term anyway and that seems to be all govt is concerned with.Taking trained workers from poorer countries is morally questionable imo. Years ago, all hospitals had nurse training units attached and there wasn't a major shortage. Gaps should be plugged with immigration but that shouldn't replace investment in training our own population.
It's also the case that foreign workers can come here cheaply to work temporarily and send money home, living in cheap accommodation supplied by the employer (as happens with farm workers etc) but British workers have to survive here long term, paying mortgages and bills - they can't afford to work for the wages being offered.
And of course, when you rely on cheap imported labour, you lose skills domestically.
The EU disguised a lot of employment and social issues, but they still existed under the surface.

At the end of the day, voting for Brexit was not a logical decision for a lot of people. The Remain campaign focused heavily on logical reasons for remaining in the EU, particularly economic reasons. They totally failed to understand that for many voters this was an emotional decision. Payback for the French “stealing” our fish when we joined the EU. Taking back what’s ours. Prejudice against immigration. Fears about being controlled and told what to do. Concerns about whether they’ll be able to access NHS care and other public services when they need them. Etc.

Remain also didn’t consider that a lot of the stuff they were warning against actually sounded good for a lot of voters and only bad for the rich. They warned that if Brexit went ahead then people from other countries would leave. Voters heard “jobs and houses made available, public services under less pressure”. Remain warned that labour costs would rise, and voters heard “a pay rise - good for me, bad for the rich company owners”. The fact that a lot of the public faces of the Remain campaign were rich didn’t help. Why is it a bad thing if this rich person can no longer hire cheap Polish workers and has to pay more to employ British workers on decent wages?

If Labour said they'd rejoin and or SM/CU, the media would go over board with "undemocratic/betrayal/flipflopping etc etc etc"

The Tories would make very sure it became a re run of the 2019 GE.

Which of course some posters would love.

As i said earlier, Labour (or any party) needs 2 terms to make good the mess the Tories have put us in.

@Prahdeepx Some v good points you ve made.

@ImAvingOops I agree with you in part - certainly about training etc- but have actually experienced several workers making it clear they are better off financially if they don't work full time - so until we get to the root causes of this- expensive private rents, not enough housing at social rents, high childcare costs, high council tax bills etc , uni fee repayments etc, it will remain a problem.

@Prahdeepx some important points there too- because like the fisherman many were looking at it just from a one sided viewpoint- the fishermen looked on it as taking back territories, not the angle of losing their markets. Some workers looked on it as 'ooh less competition- pay rise! Not that other stuff would get far more expensive or the general economy would be in trouble, some jobs would be at risk etc, international companies might relocate

Howpo
You don't know what rate of change means do you? its not the annual inflation rate

Hungary (for example) reported today - 25.2% year-on-year inflation;

https://think.ing.com/snaps/hungarian-inflation-proves-stickier-than-expected/

your energy price chart puts the UK 3rd from top

You are only looking at the chart for residential electricity prices (Feb 2023) - we are 13th from top in the residential gas chart.

So they’re too scared of the media to do it?

I’m just going by all the polls / charts that have been posted on thread. Posters showing that people regret it or are dissatisfied with Brexit.

If it is to such a high extent there would be votes in it.

I agree. I wish Labour could see it.

I take that as admission that the global financial crisis was not the fault of the Labour government.

If you look at full figures - manufacturing fell more as a % of economic output between 1977-1997 than 1997-2007.

Labour inherited decimated manufacturing industries which, in the context of globalisation, proved impossible to revive. It’s a lesson the Tory party still has not learnt: if you destroy sectors through negligence, it may not be possible to bring them back to life.

Though it’s true that the media owners, who benefit from Brexit by not having to pay full tax, would do their best to destroy them.

This could happen at any time. So does that mean we’re out for good?

Some seem to think not but I’d say this GE was the time to go rather than later. The lead was high enough to give it a go.

There's no benefit in Labour rehashing Brexit. The loons will howl, the slogans will all come out. Certain papers and certain Tories will call Remainers names again. It gives the Conservatives something to campaign on besides the culture war. They can tell the gullible all over again how they "got Brexit done" every time they're asked a hard question about their 14 year record.

The next election needs to be fought on the economy, the NHS sewage in our waters, and everything else the Tories have failed us on.

Not single issues with slogans.

Thebestwaytoscareatory
my favourite example is the bendy banana campaign from bojo, the sun, the mail, etc e.g., EU bans bendy bananas.

Article here in the New York Times from 2008 -

EU relents and lets a banana be a banana
Brussels - In the European Union, carrots must be firm but not woody, cucumbers must not be too curved and celery has to be free of any type of cavity. This was the law, one that banned overly curved, extra-knobbly or oddly shaped produce from supermarket shelves.
But in a victory for opponents of European regulation, 100 pages of legislation determining the size, shape and texture of fruit and vegetables have been torn up. On Wednesday, EU officials agreed to axe rules laying down standards for 26 products, from peas to plums.
In doing so, the authorities hope they have killed off regulations routinely used by critics - most notably in the British media - to ridicule the meddling tendencies of the EU...

https://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/12/world/europe/12iht-food.4.17771299.html

Funny that Labour tried to use the Take Back Control line. Although it didn’t land as it was just too pointless.

How much clearer could they be that they like rehashed three word slogans, from their opponent no less.

Madness.

However if posters want things to change it will need to be rehashed at some point. The media will have to be faced somehow.

Although I don’t think Labour will find a time to do it. For the same reasons they’re not now with a good lead and high dissatisfaction with Brexit.

Starmer has steered Labour from "unelectable" at the last election to "expected landslide" at the next.

I trust his judgement on this more than yours or anyone else's @MarshaBradyo

I would want to see the T&C and read them closely, multiple times, before I voted again on the EU. The basic EEC loose trade group that I chose in 1975 or something similar would get my vote. I still don't want a group of supranational bureaucrats, or a federated European state, regulating the micro detail. I am happy to live in a country that is a net contributor, but not an entity that needs constantly to add new members.

Why are so many refugee boats coming to the UK instead of heading to the UAE and other rich Middle Eastern states, which are culturally and religiously more sympathetic? They have the means to accommodate, a need for labour, and even KSA (where my nephew lives, before I am accused of knowing nothing about the human rights regime there) is vastly more relaxed on women's rights than five years ago.

Mirabai
I take that as admission that the global financial crisis was not the fault of the Labour government

I don't think I've seen this before (2011);

Former prime minister Gordon Brown has admitted to making a ‘big mistake’ over the regulation of banks, adding that the government ‘didn’t understand just how entangled things were’.
‘We didn't understand how risk was spread across the system, we didn't understand the entanglements of different institutions with the other and we didn't understand even though we talked about it just how global things were...
https://citywire.com/funds-insider/news/gordon-brown-admits-to-big-mistake-over-banks/a485717