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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Do these fathers actually want children?

358 replies

Daftasyoulike · 10/04/2023 17:01

I see a lot of posts on MN about absent Fathers who don't pay maintenance, don't make any effort to see their children, etc. Is it unreasonable to ask whether these men ever actually wanted kids in the first place, or was it a case of accidental pregnancies, which were allowed to continue in the hope that 'he will come around to the idea once the baby arrives', and then when the relationship breaks up, you find that he never really cared about having the kids in the first place, so doesn't feel he should contribute emotionally or financially to the raising of his children?

OP posts:
magneticmoon · 10/04/2023 20:12

Hoven are you going to foot the bill for all these children going into care? I think that's going to cost a bit, hope you have deep pockets

blackbeardsballsack · 10/04/2023 20:13

Supernothing22 · 10/04/2023 20:12

What tax cuts do single parents get?

Could you tell me so I can apply for them?

We don't get any, because @hoven said no

blackbeardsballsack · 10/04/2023 20:15

magneticmoon · 10/04/2023 20:12

Hoven are you going to foot the bill for all these children going into care? I think that's going to cost a bit, hope you have deep pockets

It's about £6000 a week for a child to be looked after in a residential home. I'm sure @hoven already knows this and has lots of experience in family law and children in care, and is well versed in the children act 1989 and 2004 and the government budget, of course!

Supernothing22 · 10/04/2023 20:16

blackbeardsballsack · 10/04/2023 20:13

We don't get any, because @hoven said no

Show quote history

@blackbeardsballsack it would be amazing to know what we could potentially apply for, @hoven must know something we don't!

I'm mean I pay get reduced council tax but that's single adult household not because I trapped my husband into having two children then making him leave.

I pay all my tax and National insurance and my mortgage and all my bills

Redebs · 10/04/2023 20:23

Raising children properly is a lot of hard work, requiring a certain amount of selflessness.

Traditionally most men stayed in the family, but the mothers did most of that work.

More recently, women are less prepared to tolerate unreasonable behaviour from men and are raising the children alone. Or men don't feel the need to 'stick by' the mothers of their children by marrying them in the first place.

Redebs · 10/04/2023 20:26

TheMatriarchy · 10/04/2023 18:10

There is a smorgasbord of reasons why feckless men abandon their children - laziness, immaturity, selfishness etc. Really the question should be, how and why do they get away with it?

True
But sadly in many cases the children are better off without them

hoven · 10/04/2023 20:26

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Redebs · 10/04/2023 20:27

Swift had a Modest Proposal for dealing with the issue...

Danni73 · 10/04/2023 20:27

Such a shame to see so many misogynistic enabling comments.

In my case my ex very much wanted marriage and children and also for me to be a SAHM. He proposed within 9 months and was talking about ttc prior to marriage. I pushed things back as I wanted to wait until we were married and I’d completed my professional qualifications. I now realise that his reason for wanting to move quickly was so that he could reveal his true colours. Once I was pregnant he changed very quickly.

Ironically the whole “trapped into marriage / kids” is one of the many stories he told about me to his most recent ex. It was only after they split up that she reached out to me, so that her dd could get to know my 2dc (half siblings). He is of course now absent from her dd’s life as well (through his choice).

Starlightstarbright1 · 10/04/2023 20:30

hoven · 10/04/2023 19:06

No I don't have much knowledge of these processes admittedly as I haven't been through them.

I do not believe a person can simply refuse to pay CMS. I have posted what I have found to be true attached.

Also if the main parent is not happy with bearing the main responsibility of looking after the children they can definitely contact social services to explain this. It won't necessarily mean the other parent will take on more responsibility but other arrangements could be made.

Show quote history

This is up there is the ignorant comments i have read on here...

The cms do have these powers but don't use them - there are many ways men avoid paying cms.. I won't list them but it doesn't take much searching to find groups that actively help nrp do exactly that.

As for asking Ss picking up the slack you are incredibly nieve. It is not people don't want there children - but there isn't support i have raised by Ds for the last 15 years alone . He has additional needs . I couldn't begin to tell you how many services have said i need support but nothing is forecoming.

Enjoy the view from the ivory tower

BibbleandSqwauk · 10/04/2023 20:32

Ok @hoven I can only assume you are actually on the wind up now. Would it shock you to know that many of us not in receipt of any benefits? Other than the child benefit that most parents get? I work full-time in a graduate professional job and like a pp said, pay my own bills, mortgage etc. It's just relentless and harder than it should be because we allow fathers to get away with not paying even the minimum and those who do pay CMS are rarely contributing anything like a comparable amount to the mum.

Starlightstarbright1 · 10/04/2023 20:33

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Now i know you are on a wind up have you any idea how much it costs to keep a child in care?

I am also not sure where an earth you have read that anyone has said they don't want their children just it is bloody hard

hoven · 10/04/2023 20:38

BibbleandSqwauk · 10/04/2023 20:32

Ok @hoven I can only assume you are actually on the wind up now. Would it shock you to know that many of us not in receipt of any benefits? Other than the child benefit that most parents get? I work full-time in a graduate professional job and like a pp said, pay my own bills, mortgage etc. It's just relentless and harder than it should be because we allow fathers to get away with not paying even the minimum and those who do pay CMS are rarely contributing anything like a comparable amount to the mum.

Maybe not in your case but 1 in 6 UC claimants are single parents

Starlightstarbright1 · 10/04/2023 20:40

hoven · 10/04/2023 20:38

Maybe not in your case but 1 in 6 UC claimants are single parents

Show quote history

So 5 in 6 aren't single parents 🙄

hoven · 10/04/2023 20:42

@Starlightstarbright1 considering they only make up around 3% of the population it is a lot

BibbleandSqwauk · 10/04/2023 20:45

What's your point exactly? We've already explained that many people are SP due to the father's decision not to stick around. The mum has a choice of working and paying for childcare, which is hugely expensive and only subsidised to a point, or not working and claiming UC.. what would you actually think should happen?

Singapore4 · 10/04/2023 20:45

Redebs · 10/04/2023 20:23

Raising children properly is a lot of hard work, requiring a certain amount of selflessness.

Traditionally most men stayed in the family, but the mothers did most of that work.

More recently, women are less prepared to tolerate unreasonable behaviour from men and are raising the children alone. Or men don't feel the need to 'stick by' the mothers of their children by marrying them in the first place.

Yes yes to the last part. I think the trouble is women (me also) didn't resonate with the last part you are saying until I am now a single mother myself. I read time and time again on here too and it's like the women are oblivious to the importance of marriage.

For me it's a matter of principle my mother swore by "if your good enough to have his child your good enough to marry"

TheVanguardSix · 10/04/2023 20:46

Ingrowncrotchhair · 10/04/2023 19:35

Did someone send a link to this thread around a Fathers for Justice support group ?

Swear to God, Hoven is ChatGPT’s and F4J’s love child.

gazpachosoupday · 10/04/2023 20:50

@hoven

Nearly a quarter of all families are headed by a single parent with dependant children.

I am not sure if you are trolling or just naïve on this subject.

I am fairly sure though, you are of the opinion that marriages split up far to easily and the people, probably the females, dont work hard enough on the marriage and you probably agree if men are not getting their needs met inside a marriage, they are ok to look outside the household

QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat · 10/04/2023 20:51

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I'm a single parent household and I receive no benefits so I'm no use.

cupofteaandabiccyplease · 10/04/2023 20:54

I think some men just like to prove they're men by fathering a child. Once the aim has been full filled they disappear.

QueenoftheNimbleFlyingCat · 10/04/2023 20:55

Singapore4 · 10/04/2023 20:45

Yes yes to the last part. I think the trouble is women (me also) didn't resonate with the last part you are saying until I am now a single mother myself. I read time and time again on here too and it's like the women are oblivious to the importance of marriage.

For me it's a matter of principle my mother swore by "if your good enough to have his child your good enough to marry"

Show quote history

It didn't serve me financially to marry my ex though and to be honest, it's not even about that, I don't care if I'm good enough to marry but that shouldn't mean that their father shouldn't care about his children and provide for them.

ThisThreadCouldOutMe · 10/04/2023 20:55

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Assuming the £6k per week for a child in care is correct it would cost £624,000 per year for my DC to be in care.

Now maybe I'm really bad at maths, but I'm pretty sure that's a lot more than the £17k per year I get in benefits.

magneticmoon · 10/04/2023 20:59

Hoven is really bad at maths lol

Mylittlesandwich · 10/04/2023 21:00

My dad wanted kids. That's been confirmed by my mum and my dad. Didn't stop him being a shit dad. Chased down by the CSA for every penny he parted with and flakey at best with actually spending any time with us.