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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to think it will always be hard to take disabled daughter anywhere ( bus spaces )

161 replies

Itsamission25 · 09/04/2023 20:36

I think I just need to vent tbh ! Today we took a 9 year old and a toddler on a day out to a well known theme park. 9 year old is sick/ disabled and had her wheelchair. The way from our house is a bus / coach service. We paid for our tickets etc
they are “ disabled friendly and adapted ) with the logo proudly on the front of the bus.
we went to the bus and there was a load of us including pushchairs waiting. I folded toddlers stroller down ready whilst I was doing this the 2 other pushchairs got on but didn’t fold down. They went to the wheelchair space, this was very clearly marked and had s sign saying wheelchairs take priority if needed please fold pushchair.
we then got in and asked for them to fold the pushchair and asked the bus driver for the space, one was a sleeping toddler so parent refused because he was sleeping, the second refused because she has no one to help fold her stroller and bus driver said he agreed with them. We ended up being left on the side watching the bus go with the next one not for another 2 hours.
we ended up paying over 100.00 for a taxi so a day trip cost us way more than it should. Should I just accept that this will always be the case and realise that the system doesn’t work for her :(

OP posts:
fitzwilliamdarcy · 10/04/2023 02:05

onepieceoflollipop · 09/04/2023 20:42

I almost think now that all parents should be made to fold the buggies and the wheelchair space should be ring fenced just for wheelchair users. It would mean that at times it is empty but at least it would be slightly fairer.
that way, the only reason a wheelchair user couldn’t access it would be if there was already a wheelchair on board…

I agree.

AnorLondo · 10/04/2023 02:13

rwalker · 10/04/2023 00:29

No they cannot physically remove them if they refuse
tbh working with the general public knowing how unpredictable and aggressive they can be I personally would not put myself in that position open to all sorts of abuse and allegations
granted they could refuse to move the bus and ring police but who helps them in the time it takes the police to turn up
every year hundreds if not thousands of public service workers are attacked by the general public
I worked in retail I’ve been threatened ,and spat at

Show quote history

It sounds like he didn't even ask them though.

abmac95 · 10/04/2023 02:14

Next time get your phone out and film the whole thing. People refusing to move, driver refusing to help. Its a public space you are entitled to record it. People will change their tune when they wonder what you intend to do with the recording.

Forgooodnesssakenow · 10/04/2023 02:27

I disagree with those saying buggies should all be folded etc, it would make it very difficult for parents of multiple children to transport them and for those with older kids in mobility buggies or with kids with hidden disabilities alongside a sibling etc.

I take my youngest on buses in a buggy, she's almost 2, her brother is a bit of a flight risk and has a seizure disorder but walks and 90% of the time is fine but getting caught out that other 10% is a genuine unsafe disaster.

However, because I'm aware the space is really for wheelchairs I leave early enough that I could let a couple of buses go without being late for where we're going or that if we're on a bus and a wheelchair user needs our space I could get off and wait for the next bus. If everyone who wanted/needed to keep a child in a stroller did that we wouldn't have an issue.

In ops case, I wonder if they felt (wrongly, definitely wrongly and I'd be livid if I were you to be clear) that because the wheelchair user is a child then you could lift your child out and fold the chair just like a buggy user could? I wonder if they'd have been more helpful or respectful with an adult wheelchair user 🤔 shit regardless to be honest and I'm surry you'd this experience.

PuttingDownRoots · 10/04/2023 02:44

What sort of parent looks at a disabled child, waiting for a 2hrly bus service, and thinks .. can't be bothered?

nettie434 · 10/04/2023 04:53

BakedTattie · 09/04/2023 21:02

It doesn’t matter if the op’s daughter is or isn’t entitled to high rate DLA (pip etc) motability cars aren’t free! The op may not have the means to afford a motability car.

what the ops daughter IS entitled to, is the space on the bus. That she should have been given.

I completely agree with BakedTattie that it should be standard for someone in a wheelchair to travel on the bus.

The supreme court judgement in favour of Doug Paulley ruled that bus companies have to do more to encourage non disabled passengers to move from the wheelchair area - eg to refuse to move until a pushchair or buggy is folded.

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/legal-casework/paulley-v-firstgroup-plc

I have noticed that drivers on Transport for London services are good about ensuring wheelchair users take priority. I hope you will write to the bus company complaining about your experience, itsamission25 and asking for a refund. It really reflects badly on the parent involved that they were so unreasonable when there was such a gap between services.

Paulley v FirstGroup PLC | Equality and Human Rights Commission

https://www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/legal-casework/paulley-v-firstgroup-plc

Sirzy · 10/04/2023 05:05

thankfully I rarely need to use a bus with ds but when I do there often seems to be a selfish parent using the space And not wanting to move.

the best driver was the one who turned off his engine and said “well we won’t be going anywhere until the wheelchair is safely in the wheelchair space” strangely the parent was soon able to collapse their buggy then!

Danikm151 · 10/04/2023 05:30

You need to complain to the provider of the bus service.
show them a receipt for your taxi and ask for reimbursement as their driver went against their own policies.

Oneiros · 10/04/2023 05:46

BakedTattie · 09/04/2023 21:02

It doesn’t matter if the op’s daughter is or isn’t entitled to high rate DLA (pip etc) motability cars aren’t free! The op may not have the means to afford a motability car.

what the ops daughter IS entitled to, is the space on the bus. That she should have been given.

Obviously legally the people should have moved and OP's child bad the right to that space on the bus. It's shocking people behaved like that and that the bus driver didn't sort it out.

But of course motability cars are free. You can choose a more expensive one and pay a top up but some cars on the scheme are completely free, paid for entirely from the mobility part of the benefit (and that covers the lease of the car itself, no road tax, insurance and maintenance and repairs covered, no need for MOTs) so that there is no cost to the user at all other than putting the petrol for their journeys in it. That's the whole point of them. Hope OP wins her tribunal and can get one because she absolutely should have one in this situation,

Simonjt · 10/04/2023 06:10

Oneiros · 10/04/2023 05:46

Obviously legally the people should have moved and OP's child bad the right to that space on the bus. It's shocking people behaved like that and that the bus driver didn't sort it out.

But of course motability cars are free. You can choose a more expensive one and pay a top up but some cars on the scheme are completely free, paid for entirely from the mobility part of the benefit (and that covers the lease of the car itself, no road tax, insurance and maintenance and repairs covered, no need for MOTs) so that there is no cost to the user at all other than putting the petrol for their journeys in it. That's the whole point of them. Hope OP wins her tribunal and can get one because she absolutely should have one in this situation,

Show quote history

Do you think anything paid for with DLA/PIPis free, or just motability cars, £369.60 isn’t my definition of free. Also, good luck finding a motability car that can take a ramp and chair that doesn’t have a substantial deposit.

itsgettingweird · 10/04/2023 06:21

Itsamission25 · 09/04/2023 21:15

@itsgettingweird its really not that simple.

It shouldn't be that hard.

I know it can be but the system is shocking.

My sons been on disability benefits for 10 years now.

Zanatdy · 10/04/2023 06:26

The driver should have insisted they fold down the pushchairs. I’m sure other passengers could have assisted if they needed to hold baby too, or they could have been told to get off the bus if they couldn’t do that. Very unfair and discriminatory. Put in a formal complaint to the bus company

WhatNoRaisins · 10/04/2023 06:39

The more I read about the reality for people trying to access the wheelchair space the less convinced I am that unfolded pushchairs should be allowed there at all. The law as it is seems completely toothless and the bus companies don't seem to give a toss. This current set up clearly isn't working.

TrashyPanda · 10/04/2023 06:45

Disgusting behaviour. These people are completely vile. And they will most likely bring up their kids to be equally selfish.

agree that recording them on a phone might be a way forward.

definitely complain to the bus company

mybeautifuloak · 10/04/2023 06:46

Cameras on phones are your best friend here

Sirzy · 10/04/2023 06:57

WhatNoRaisins · 10/04/2023 06:39

The more I read about the reality for people trying to access the wheelchair space the less convinced I am that unfolded pushchairs should be allowed there at all. The law as it is seems completely toothless and the bus companies don't seem to give a toss. This current set up clearly isn't working.

I agree. That space should be reserved solely for those using wheelchairs (or special needs buggies)

if parents want a dedicated space for their prams they can campaign for spaces.

nomoremerlot · 10/04/2023 07:00

nocoolnamesleft · 09/04/2023 20:44

Those parents were disgusting and the bus driver not acting in accordance with the law. Your wheelchair using daughter had priority.

This 100%

HelterSkelter224 · 10/04/2023 07:05

I'm so shocked at those saying "just get a motability car". Completely missing the point. Disabled people have the right to the same access to public spaces as everyone else, not to be excluded and left to find their own solutions because it mildly inconveniences some rude and inconsiderate people!

WhatNoRaisins · 10/04/2023 07:09

I wonder what's going on with the bus drivers. I know they are under pressure to keep to time but do mums with prams remind them of their own wives or daughters so they instinctively have more empathy for them than a person in a wheelchair?

In any case they the companies need to be made to comply with the law or it's a pointless law.

doadeer · 10/04/2023 07:31

Absolutely please complain that is terrible and I'm really angry for you

StopitSarah · 10/04/2023 07:43

OP, I’m so sorry. If I had been on the bus I’d have advocated for you and offered to help the parent fold her bloody buggy.

I don’t have children with disabilities but I know plenty who do. It’s so tough.

I would absolutely email the bus company and given them the exact time/location. I would also send them your receipt for the taxi and ask for that to be reimbursed.

Did you manage to get the bus home?

Felixss · 10/04/2023 07:52

It is common thing, when I was a HCA I would get on the bus with patients in wheelchairs. Often the spaces would be taken up by prams and they would refuse to move. They could fold and put baby in arms you can't get someone out of a wheelchair. I think some people become very entitled when they have a baby. I would always fold DDs pushchair if someone disabled came on and carry her.

DorisParchment · 10/04/2023 07:52

TFL are good at enforcing the rule. I’ve had a bus driver announce before the stop that people need to move to accommodate a wheelchair, and buggies need to be folded. I’ve also been on buses where someone has refused to fold their buggy and the bus driver has announced that the bus won’t move until they do. And has turned off the engine.

When mine were small you had to fold the buggy - there was no room on a bus for an unfolded buggy, but most buggies then were the lightweight umbrella fold ones, so it was easier to fold them than the huge ones you get now.

pumpkintits · 10/04/2023 08:16

I can't believe those selfish people on the bus using the space when they could fold and let you on, and the driver for not insisting that one of them does before the bus goes anywhere!

Do you have a receipt for the taxi bill? I'd be sending it to them with my complaint and request to be reimbursed for the cost of the taxi and the tickets.

I remember being on a bus with DD in her pram, not paying attention to much. There was someone trying to get on, speaking to the driver and then getting off. When they started walking off I saw that person was with a person in a wheelchair and realised they had been told they couldn't get on the bus because 2 prams were using the space! I jumped up and told the driver we would get off and walk the rest of the way so they could get on the bus. To be honest I was shocked the driver didn't ask one of us to fold and instead told the people there was no room, I would always fold or get off the bus (we were lucky that day we only had 1 more stop to go anyway!)

Toomanysquishmallows · 10/04/2023 08:20

Slight detail , but when dd2 was smaller people would use the buggy space , for buggies filled with shopping , not children !