Page 39 | Taking step kids on holiday - AIBU?

B0711 · 2023-04-04T20:18:51+00:00

My partner has a 8 year old girl from a previous relationship and we’ve just had a baby (currently 3 months), he’s my one and only (vasectomy pending). Now, I really want to go on holiday just me, my partner and my baby. His ex has already had an issue with us when she THOUGHT we were going on holiday without her daughter and telling us that the daughter was extremely upset etc. We have no idea where the idea came from as we hadn’t even spoken or contemplated holidays at this point. Anyways, since that conversation I have said to my partner that sometimes that may happen. I grew up with stepdads who had kids and they didn’t come on holiday with us so to me it’s normal. Plus what if we can’t afford to take both on holiday in the future? Does that mean my child then can’t have a holiday in case of upsetting the other child? Even though the other child has a well off mother so will be holidaying plenty. She will come on some holidays with us for definite but my thoughts on this are; I’m only going to have one maternity year, my baby is only going to be free (in terms of cost) to take on holiday for so long. We can’t afford to take the daughter away as well, it’s around an additional £500/£700 pound especially as we’ll have to do school holidays. My partner agreed when I told him my thoughts but im sure he thinks I’ve forgotten about the conversation as he’s now constantly mentioning his daughter in our holiday discussions, has told his daughter that we’re trying to plan a summer holiday all together so now she is excited. Like WTF? I’m not working with being on maternity so I’m on statutory pay, but the holiday would be coming out of MY savings. I feel like such a bitch trying to push this conversation my way but I feel like I’m being reasonable. I only get this one chance, it’s my money, I want a stress free holiday and entertaining an 8 year old who is bored all the time is not my idea of stress free. I might just go on holiday on my own with our son at this point.

Bamboux · 04/05/2023 13:18

aSofaNearYou · 04/05/2023 10:10

I don't know why it was deleted - I didn't report it. Presumably someone else found it disturbing, and presumably Mumsnet agreed.

It said the poster withdrew it at their own request. And I think it's high time we stop using "Mumsnet agreed it was disturbing" as a stick to beat people with. Mumsnet will pretty much delete anything anyone reports, it doesn't have to actually be an attack these days.

And yes there was nothing positive in that comment. But yes that can be normalised and defended - because we have no idea what the circumstances are. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that that poster should be feeling warmer than she does, her step children could have been absolutely horrendous to her. Whether it was a step mum or a mum posting, I would first try and establish what the actual behaviour and situation was like before berating them for not seeming warm enough.

I didn't berate her at any point.

I didn't say she should feel any different to how she does. I said that the child should not be placed in that situation. She's an adult. She can leave. If it's an abusive relationship, as she presents it, then she absolutely should leave.

I said the father was a shit father for placing his child in that situation. Or if you prefer, a shit husband for placing his wife/partner in that situation. Probably both. Whichever way you look at it, it is not OK. But kids don't have the option of removing themselves from horrible situations, while adults do.

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:20

aSofaNearYou · 04/05/2023 10:10

I don't know why it was deleted - I didn't report it. Presumably someone else found it disturbing, and presumably Mumsnet agreed.

It said the poster withdrew it at their own request. And I think it's high time we stop using "Mumsnet agreed it was disturbing" as a stick to beat people with. Mumsnet will pretty much delete anything anyone reports, it doesn't have to actually be an attack these days.

And yes there was nothing positive in that comment. But yes that can be normalised and defended - because we have no idea what the circumstances are. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that that poster should be feeling warmer than she does, her step children could have been absolutely horrendous to her. Whether it was a step mum or a mum posting, I would first try and establish what the actual behaviour and situation was like before berating them for not seeming warm enough.

her step children could have been absolutely horrendous to her

So bloody what. One is a child and the other is an adult.

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 08:22

So bloody what. One is a child and the other is an adult.

I don't agree with you, but you know that. If someone is horrendous to you, it's natural to dislike them.

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:30

Bamboux · 04/05/2023 09:42

I don't know why it was deleted - I didn't report it. Presumably someone else found it disturbing, and presumably Mumsnet agreed.

It wasn't directly abusive but to me, yes, it was extremely worrying to read that level of venom and disgust expressed towards a child that lives with her. She described the child as 'entitled' and 'dripping with new clothes/gadgets'.

'Dripping' is a horrible word which clearly communicates a sense of disgust and contempt. It is never used positively. There are many, many alternative ways to express the same belief that a child has too many new clothes/toys without using a word like that.

There was also the implication that the entire family life is a battle of power/will- 'do this or your partner and their child will walk all over you'. Adults should not be engaging in power struggles and trying to 'win' in this way. It's not a healthy dynamic at all.

And there was not one word or hint of any feeling of kindness, warmth, closeness, or any kind of positive feeling whatsoever. Not one tiny sense that the negativity, disgust and hostility was in any way tempered by ever enjoying each other's company for a moment.

That is, I hope, not typical of relationships between step parents and step children, and it shouldn't be defended or normalised. It wouldn't be defended or normalised if it were a mother speaking about her own child, and nor should it be.

As I said above, no child should have to live with an adult - whether parent, step parent, grandparent, nanny, whatever - who feels that way about them. I was pointing out to the 'eyerolling' poster that we were not discussing the OP at that point.

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it shouldn't be defended or normalised. It wouldn't be defended or normalised if it were a mother speaking about her own child, and nor should it be

100% this. Disgusted with the posters trying to excuse, defend, normalise this behaviour. Toxic.
It doesn’t matter if the child is difficult or spoilt. One is an adult, the other is a child. The power differential, the relationship of dependency, the differences in maturity / capacity / life experience , puts the responsibility squarely on the adult to exercise restraint, goodwill and patience. If you don’t know/ aren’t prepared to accept this responsibility , you shouldn’t be around children. Full stop.

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:35

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 08:22

So bloody what. One is a child and the other is an adult.

I don't agree with you, but you know that. If someone is horrendous to you, it's natural to dislike them.

They are not two equals with equal power to be horrendous to one another. that’s the difference . The more significant need is one one side, the greatest capacity for harm on the other. If that poster dislikes her step child so much she is simply unable to exercise restraint and express goodwill she needs to remove herself from the situation.
Agree with @Bamboux that that child’s dad is a shitty shitty parent for partnering with a woman who would take that attitude to his child.

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 08:40

@Tandora I'm not going to argue with you, it's always a waste of time.

I don't even remember from that post if she definitely hadn't left or not. My point is simply that it's normal to dislike anyone that treats you awfully, including children.

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:45

Yousee · 04/05/2023 09:04

Do you know what else parents can do that Step parents apparently can't?
Go on an adult holiday for an actual rest without the child and without anyone stating that obviously they must hate the child. 🙄

Lmao at the idea that parents can go on an adult holiday without their children: what planet do you live on 🥴🥴

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:48

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 08:40

@Tandora I'm not going to argue with you, it's always a waste of time.

I don't even remember from that post if she definitely hadn't left or not. My point is simply that it's normal to dislike anyone that treats you awfully, including children.

I guess I should realllly hate my 1 year old then. She treats me like utter crap on a daily basis.

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 09:03

@Tandora Don't be obtuse, you know there is a difference between a baby and an older child with a grasp of right and wrong.

And Yousee lives on this planet - where many parents do go on adult trips without their children occasionally.

Brendabigbaps · 05/05/2023 09:09

Densol57 · 04/04/2023 21:29

Go on a caravan / holiday home holiday in the UK where it will cost NO more than food and a negligible amount for entertainment
I think its evil excluding his daughter

Where are these free holiday homes you talk about???

last time I looked I couldn’t find any free holidays in caravans or holiday let’s, they charge!

Tandora · 05/05/2023 09:14

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 09:03

@Tandora Don't be obtuse, you know there is a difference between a baby and an older child with a grasp of right and wrong.

And Yousee lives on this planet - where many parents do go on adult trips without their children occasionally.

How old does the child need to be before your statement comes true then? I’m genuinely curious.
My point was your statements that it’s “normal” and “natural” to dislike someone who treats you poorly are not self-evidently “true” at all. It entirely depends on the relationship, the circumstances, the capacity of said person in question and a whole range of other matters.

given the power differential and relationship of dependency It is absolutely not ok to normalise that pp’s behaviour.

I do not know a single parent with an 8 year old child who’s gone on an adult holiday for “some rest” without that child. And if I did know one, I can’t help thinking I’d probs judge them a little bit. Especially if they went on holiday with one kid and not the other.

Actually, I lie, I know men who’ve done that in precisely the situation of OP’s partner, and I’ve been quite frankly disgusted.

Yousee · 05/05/2023 09:16

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:45

Lmao at the idea that parents can go on an adult holiday without their children: what planet do you live on 🥴🥴

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One with child care options, sorry you apparently don't have any 💐

Tandora · 05/05/2023 09:17

Yousee · 05/05/2023 09:16

One with child care options, sorry you apparently don't have any 💐

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😂😂

Sartre · 05/05/2023 09:18

Why have a child with someone who already has children if you clearly don’t want to be a stepparent? I genuinely don’t understand people like you.

Yousee · 05/05/2023 09:20

We went on a long weekend without DSD when DS was about 3/4 months old, pub lunches, lovely long walks etc. It was fabulous.
Neither child really knows it even happened as one was with her mother as normal and the other was a sleepy unicorn baby.
It was fabulous.
Nobody was damaged and DH and I got a much needed little break.
Bwaaaaaaaaaa something wasn't all about DSD oh boo fucking hoo 😒

Tandora · 05/05/2023 09:24

Yousee · 05/05/2023 09:20

We went on a long weekend without DSD when DS was about 3/4 months old, pub lunches, lovely long walks etc. It was fabulous.
Neither child really knows it even happened as one was with her mother as normal and the other was a sleepy unicorn baby.
It was fabulous.
Nobody was damaged and DH and I got a much needed little break.
Bwaaaaaaaaaa something wasn't all about DSD oh boo fucking hoo 😒

Bwaaaaaaaaaa something wasn't all about DSD oh boo fucking hoo

yuk.

Yousee · 05/05/2023 09:26

Tandora · 05/05/2023 09:24

Bwaaaaaaaaaa something wasn't all about DSD oh boo fucking hoo

yuk.

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I should clarify, that comment was about my attitude to people like you, not about DSD, who obviously is with us on all proper family holidays which are actually about the children.

Bamboux · 05/05/2023 09:27

Tandora · 05/05/2023 08:30

it shouldn't be defended or normalised. It wouldn't be defended or normalised if it were a mother speaking about her own child, and nor should it be

100% this. Disgusted with the posters trying to excuse, defend, normalise this behaviour. Toxic.
It doesn’t matter if the child is difficult or spoilt. One is an adult, the other is a child. The power differential, the relationship of dependency, the differences in maturity / capacity / life experience , puts the responsibility squarely on the adult to exercise restraint, goodwill and patience. If you don’t know/ aren’t prepared to accept this responsibility , you shouldn’t be around children. Full stop.

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I think that is the most unforgivable aspect. A parent who has no protective instinct for their own child.

As a mum, my overriding instinct is to protect my children from people who are horrible to them. What an awful dad that must be to not care about putting his kids in that situation deliberately.

Bamboux · 05/05/2023 09:30

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 08:40

@Tandora I'm not going to argue with you, it's always a waste of time.

I don't even remember from that post if she definitely hadn't left or not. My point is simply that it's normal to dislike anyone that treats you awfully, including children.

Yes, and it's also normal to remove yourself from that relationship if you are an adult and can make that decision.

It's also decent parenting to prevent your child from being forced to spend time with someone who dislikes them, because it suits you.

That's what all of this is about really. Adults, parents, who think it's OK to damage their children because they prioritise themselves.

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 09:32

@Tandora Yes obviously it depends on the circumstances, that's exactly what I said. PP did not wait and ask about the circumstances before assuming it was unfounded.

I'd say it would be natural to dislike a 3/4 year old who, for example, just came in and hit you repeatedly. So anything above baby age really. And before you defer, I'm not talking about whether you should stay in a relationship where you dislike the child. I'm saying it is not abnormal to dislike a child.

I'm not surprised that you would judge parents for going away without their children, you're a very judgmental person generally.

But as I've already pointed out, there is little point us arguing with one another. We are very different people and I disagree with pretty much everything you post, as I'm sure you do in return.

Naunet · 05/05/2023 09:33

This thread is mad. I only wish people cared this much about fathers who don’t bother with their own kids after a marriage break down, but then the general rule seems to be “you can’t make him be a parent”, no paragraphs on how much he’s destroying the children’s lives etc, yet apparently we can make unrelated women be a parent, even if they’re not the child’s step mother.

Tandora · 05/05/2023 09:33

Yousee · 05/05/2023 09:26

I should clarify, that comment was about my attitude to people like you, not about DSD, who obviously is with us on all proper family holidays which are actually about the children.

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It was very apparently about your projection that everything has to always be “all about DSD” (and your disgust at that) since I have never said such a thing, it can’t possibly be about “people like me” , Must come from somewhere else.. 🤔

Bamboux · 05/05/2023 09:36

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 09:32

@Tandora Yes obviously it depends on the circumstances, that's exactly what I said. PP did not wait and ask about the circumstances before assuming it was unfounded.

I'd say it would be natural to dislike a 3/4 year old who, for example, just came in and hit you repeatedly. So anything above baby age really. And before you defer, I'm not talking about whether you should stay in a relationship where you dislike the child. I'm saying it is not abnormal to dislike a child.

I'm not surprised that you would judge parents for going away without their children, you're a very judgmental person generally.

But as I've already pointed out, there is little point us arguing with one another. We are very different people and I disagree with pretty much everything you post, as I'm sure you do in return.

I dislike loads of children. The chances of me getting into or staying in a relationship with someone whose child i disliked would be zero.

Because it's a horrible thing to do to them.

Also, as a parent, the chance of me getting into or staying in a relationship with someone who disliked my child is also zero.

I had a friend who got together with a woman who had a daughter from a previous relationship. As soon as they had their own children, he started to push his stepdaughter out. Not very subtly
I stopped being friends with him. It was a horrendous thing to see.

Adults have choices. Children don't.

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 09:36

@Bamboux yes of course it's normal to remove yourself. I fundamentally disagree though that in a situation where the children have been genuinely abusive and awful to their step parent, the biggest problem is their parent putting THEM in a position where someone dislikes them - as if it isn't totally natural for that person to dislike them. I do hold children somewhat accountable for their behaviour. I feel your phrasing suggests the opposite.

Tandora · 05/05/2023 09:40

aSofaNearYou · 05/05/2023 09:32

@Tandora Yes obviously it depends on the circumstances, that's exactly what I said. PP did not wait and ask about the circumstances before assuming it was unfounded.

I'd say it would be natural to dislike a 3/4 year old who, for example, just came in and hit you repeatedly. So anything above baby age really. And before you defer, I'm not talking about whether you should stay in a relationship where you dislike the child. I'm saying it is not abnormal to dislike a child.

I'm not surprised that you would judge parents for going away without their children, you're a very judgmental person generally.

But as I've already pointed out, there is little point us arguing with one another. We are very different people and I disagree with pretty much everything you post, as I'm sure you do in return.

Yes, And My point was that the circumstances that we had knowledge of- - were enough to know that what that pp said was horrible and it’s inexcusable for people like you to immediately leap to her defence . You defended her by saying it’s “natural” and “normal” to dislike people who treat you like crap. But That isn’t self evidently true at all. We should not normalise step parents holding their step children in contempt for being “spoiled” . that is toxic.
(There are any number of parents who have children over the age of 3/4 who hit them daily and still manage to love them- but I think we are wondering off topic here).