To be absolutely furious/heartbroken about SILs baby name choice?

[CarinaBee]

I set up a new account for this, lots of identifying points here but here goes. I am fully prepared to be told that I have no right to influence the name someone chooses for their baby. but to preface, I feel sick to my stomach over this.

my DH is a twin. His sister is known to be somewhat difficult in the family. Bit of a diva, tends to get her own way. She’s 38. We get on ok but she’s quite possessive of DH and likes to see him alone every now and then. Fine by me but does get a little tiring to hear how being a twin eclipses everything and you couldn’t possibly understand if you don’t have one. I can let a lot slide - the fairly frequent requests for money from DH for one thing. They have 2 other brothers. I get on very well with MIL but we’ve had previous incidents where SIL has been jealous because I’ve seen MIL without her for example. They’re close and good luck to them, I’m not trying to ‘steal’ your Mum from you.

DH’s family are a very close supportive unit and I admire that. By comparison, I had one sister and our mother was an unpleasant alcoholic. Mercifully I had my sister who was 7 years older than me and filled every gap left where Mum didn’t.

long story short, she died after a short but awful illness in 2006 leaving behind 2 very small children. I lived with her during her illness and was finally able to repay the devotion, love and care she always showed me. until my daughter came along 2 years ago, I don’t think I have ever matched the love I feel for her and I will long for her until the day I die.

my SIL has had a baby girl and she’s chosen the same name as my sister. I won’t share it here because it is identifying but know that it is not a common name by any stretch of the imagination. She has 2 sons and now “finally has her girl” and has apparently always wanted to use this name. first I’ve heard of it.

DH told me after he got off the phone and it made me sick to my stomach. He wasn’t prepared to say anything but I didn’t ask him to. Disappointed he didn’t though. I said to MIL that I am devastated but didn’t make a fuss and said I wouldn’t mention to SIL. She told her and all he’ll broke loose. It was 20 years ago, I need to let go and I don’t own the name.

dH and I have been having problems lately and frankly this feels like the final straw. I am the least demanding person - actually probably lean towards being more of a people pleaser, prefer an easy life. But this is too much. I have never shaken the feeling of how cheated my beautiful sister was in life and it’s just so hurtful. There are endless girls names to choose from.

It's all well and good saying OP should work to save her marriage because her DH doesn't want a separation - but of course he doesn't, why would he? Everything is about him, his family and his life.

My question to the DH would be - would you move to London for your wife in order to save your marriage? I think he'd be quite likely to say no.....I'm sure he does want the marriage to work.....on his terms, with the OP honouring the status quo.

He couldn't even give his sister a little bit of a kick when she started raging at the OP. He couldn't even say - 'you're out of line'. For goodness sake, he couldn't even stay home for one Sunday.....! He couldn't say to his mother "Dsis really has gone too far this time, we'll be skipping lunch today", or even 'my wife is very upset with Dsis kicking off at her - we're going to have a family day together'.

Even if he doesn't agree that the OP was right to be upset about the name, surely he could still see his wife was upset?!

It's outrageous. Even if he's too spineless to say it to his sister, he didn't even allow a message to filter back via his mother.

No he just skipped out the door and left OP behind. Poor sis mustn't upset her, but my wife oh she can deal with it.

What exactly does the OP have to stay for?

Thanks for the perspectives, really helpful.

To be honest, the last post captures it perfectly for me. There’s definitely an impression people have of me that I’m as hard as nails. SIL has a bit of a tik tok addiction and always talks about what she’s learned on there. She’s fascinated by the ‘masculine energy/feminine energy’ theory that is apparently doing the rounds at the moment. She remarked a while back that I’m ‘heavily in my masculine energy’. It was framed as a criticism along with similar comments where she is adamant that I get Botox/fillers (I don’t yet but why would you care?) and H never seems to pick up on the nasty undertones to what she’s saying. “CarinaBee, you should read into masculine/feminine theory, you definintely lean masculine’. All a load of chauvinistic nonsense aimed at impressionable young girls encouraging them to fall at the man’s feet and make them feel like a masculine god from what I can gather but I’m not interested.

bottom line is that I bounce back quickly and I’m thick skinned. I don’t have the bandwidth for nonsense. My husband is the kind of person who’d never back away from trouble, he’s as far removed from being a wimp as possible in real life. But his family come first whether he likes to admit to it or not.

But OP hasn't asked him to do those things. It would be great if he could just see that she needed these things, and pre-empted them. But not everyone is very good at that.

If she figures out what she needs and clearly communicates them as 'needs', and he isn't willing to make those changes, then absolutely - that is the time to end the marriage.

But not before even telling him what he can do to make it work.

OP - This evening, try something like this:

tell your DH what this feels like to you. note - use 'I felt'...'this is how it feels to me'. 'Don't accuse eg 'you always' . But do let him say how it feels to him to

Eg
When you didn't say anything to your sister about the name yesterday, I felt that you were prioritising her over me. I felt really let down.

then say what you need

Eg
I need to know that we're a team, that you're on my side and DDs - even if that's against your twin. I can't be in a marriage where I'm not your priority.

As a first step, I need you to acknowledge to me that what your DSis has done is hurtful to me, and that hurting me is not OK.

I need you to tell DSis that as well. I need to know that you're on my side and that you will stick up for me.

If he tries to minimise, or say 'that's just how she is' you stick to telling him how that affects you and how that makes you feel, and what you need.

BTW, telling DSis doesn't let him off the hook for further changes. But it's probably a necessary first step for him to regain your trust.

I'd certainly consider making a move to London a serious point of discussion. But I think OP needs to think about the need she has there, rather than focus in London as a solution. Is it to reduce enmeshment with his family? is it because her friends are there? does she simply think it's her turn for them to live where she wants? These are all reasonable needs - and only OP knows what's important to her so that they can find a solution (which may be London or may be something else).

For goodness sake. You shouldn’t need to walk your partner through being a decent person. It’s not that he doesn’t know, it’s that he chooses to prioritise his sister and avoids any confrontation with her to the detriment of his wife. Who would put up with that again and again?

@CarinaBee when you say that your husband’s family comes first, does this mean you and DD or his DS, DM, etc? I kind of feel like they’re two things here.

@CarinaBee 👏👏👏

Your SIL is a total bitch. Your husband is a spineless wanker - he should have told her it was an unacceptable name choice, and would be like a knife to the gut for you, without you having to tell him.

It doesn’t matter whether the name is Olivia or Persephone, popularity matters not one bit. Your lovely sister’s name should not have been used by your SIL, under any circumstances.

Even if SIL had known a Camilla that she had always planned on naming a baby after, she should have gently explained to you that this was the case, and although it will hurt you, it’s something she always planned to do etc etc.

But a random choice of your sister’s name, that will upset you so much, is unacceptable. I agree with the poster who said show her that this act is unforgivable, and distance yourself as much as you can from her.

There’s no way I’d do what she’s doing. The fact she’s listened to you talk about your sister and why you couldn’t name your daughter after her etc. Even if it was a name I really liked I would be concerned about how you would feel.

@nordicwannabe That’s really my perspective as well. Of course not all marriages are worth saving and no one should live in misery, but this doesn’t sound like the situation here. Everything else being even and abusive situations obviously aside, most of us (adults and children) are better off emotionally, physically and financially sticking together. OP has already said she has no support network aside from her in-laws. And she’s rightly devastated right now. It’s not a time to get a tattoo.

I think it’s time to stop being stoic and raise absolute hell with DH. He has to change his relationship with his sister. She’d happily see him divorced and his family life in ruins. It sounds like MIL is a strong ally here and that he’s been walking along the path of least resistance.

Of course maybe he won’t change, but it’s worth trying.

You shouldn’t need to walk your partner through being a decent person

No, but you sometimes do need to tell them out loud what you need.

OP has said several times that she hasn't asked him to say anything, and she also minimised her own feelings when she spoke to MIL: saying that 'it threw her' and that she wasn't coming 'because she wasn't 100%'

Out loud, she's telling them all that it doesn't matter and she'll get over it (you're being far too stoic OP!). If you say that to people, they will believe you. You need to actually tell them when something is a problem.

And she’s rightly devastated right now. It’s not a time to get a tattoo

That made me laugh @AliceOlive

You shouldn’t need to spell it out on this occasion. It’s huge. Raise your bar.

A friend says this in a stern voice whenever one of us is going through something bad. She also says "You need a NAP!"

My heart goes out to you. I don't understand people like your SIL. And they often land on their feet.

Definitely absolutely sh*t behaviour on the part of you SIL. You have every right to express your anger over this. I would feel sick if I was in your position. i avoided children’s names that linked to past partners or people that family members didn’t like even though several were on my faves list. I can’t imagine what she was thinking and even if it was a Sarah/Anna/Emma/ name it makes no difference. It’s disrespectful to you. Agree with PP who suggests every action has a reaction. You should mark your boundary line clearly. She already crossed it, so you must re establish where that line is now on your part.

Most importantly, I’m sorry to hear you lost your dear sister so early in life. She was lucky to have such a loyal and caring sister and friend in you. 💐

She’s an utter bastard for doing that. I’d be fuming

I think YABU. She likes the name and chose it for her daughter. End of story.

It sounds as though you feel she’s chosen the name not “despite knowing it was your sister’s name” but “because it was your sister’s name”. You’ll never be able to say for sure that is what she’s done but I can understand from your history with her while you do feel that way. As others have said you can only control your behaviour which may be to protect yourself by reducing/removing contact. If you do do that then I would also recommend never discussing her with anyone. Just move the conversation onto another one and if you do ever see her medium chill/grey rock all the way (this doesn’t mean ignore or be cold because that still gives them your energy albeit negative energy - you want light, friendly and never give them anything of the inside of you.)

I had counselling which helped to a certain extent for a traumatic childhood. I’ve recently had EMDR therapy for cPTSD, which has been amazingly helpful.

One thing I’ve recently learnt is that ruminating actually makes things worse, as processing something over and over again embeds the memory deeper increasing its impact. I now practice thinking about it to decide how I want to proceed and then I deliberately skip my mind on when it comes up every time in my mind again. Takes practice but it really works. Every time you think about it when she’s not there, it’s you poisoning yourself time and time again. I wish you all the very best - you’ve survived your childhood and your sister’s sad, untimely death and come out strong. You will survive this too.

My sister died recently. She had an uncommon name, but not so unusual it becomes a conversation point. I would love her name to be carried on in the family, she has an adult son. But it’s something my own children can keep in mind. There is one person in my family (SIL/estranged brother) who I’d hate to use it. She’s the kind who enjoys the attention of losing a loved one. Her older cousin died 35+ years ago and she’s still dining out on it. Her daughter bears her name and her photo is prominent in the living room.

@CarinaBee from your last post - she sounds insufferable.

Your husband seems married to his sister. He has put her wants before your needs and it sounds like this has been going on your entire marriage. His sister has upped the ante until she has reached the point of open cruelty towards you and your husband has chosen to support and appease her rather than call her out.

He could have easily told her that changing her DD’s name to your sister’s name would hurt his family (him, you and DD) and will necessitate you all taking a step back from the relationship with her. He should feel hurt on your behalf and should want to protect you from his sister’s cruelty. He should want to protect his daughter from witnessing his sister abusing her mother.

His behavior and choices have led to the separation. At this point, I don’t think SIL will accept him putting his relationship with you before her vision of their “twin relationship” without tantrums and drama. She’s already causing drama because you are refusing to accept her cruelty and are distancing yourself from her instead of presenting yourself for her abuse or throwing your own tantrums and allowing her to play the victim.

While I hate to see families broken, I don’t see where your husband has given you another option. He’s broken his vows to you by consistently making his relationship with his sister the priority. If you replace sister with neighbor, coworker or any other woman, people would be calling it an emotional affair or infidelity. I honestly couldn’t open myself up to the level of intimacy or vulnerability needed to maintain a marriage with someone who chose to put another woman before me.

Poor poor you. YANBU. It is a horrible act and that no one in her family can properly tell her this shows how far she’s been allowed to go.
I don’t think I could stay in a family like that, however balanced and even-tempered I were. All best wishes - I think many of us are hurting for you here.

I agree with this.
Perhaps OP has already tried and it's fallen on deaf ears.
But if not it's surely worth a try first.
I don't understand how you go from playing happy families to walking away without at least trying to articulate what you need/want to change.

Your sister in law is a cunt and I would never talk to her again. Truly awful, spiteful person

Yanbu op. If my sister was called Zara and died and my SIL called my niece Zara that would cut deep at every meeting. I suppose I'd get used to it, I'd hope I would, but it would be hurtful.