What the heck is a grammer school?

[BlackBarbies]

Posting here for traffic!

Born and raised in South West London and still live here now. I’ve never heard of a grammar school until joining MN a couple of years ago.

Is it a primary school, is it a secondary school? Is it private or public? If it’s public, then why is it called a grammer school? Is it only available for certain types of children or something? I literally have no clue what a grammer school is so I’m happy to be enlightened!

Also, are there any in SW London? I’m genuinely intrigued as to how I’ve never come across one before

No, it hasn’t “escaped my notice.” People’s awareness of the world isn’t restricted to their local area, surely? “GRAMMER” in the title is a bit of a giveaway but it could be a typo.

It depends really doesn't it ,if there is not a Grammar school in your locsl.area and hasn't been for forty years why would you know all.about them ?
I'm nearly 50 and i. went to.a comprehensive school as did everyone I know ,I am aware of Grammar schools because we studied the Tripartite,system of education for History GCSE ,and I also know that both my parents failed the 11+ although my mum ,s mum.paid for her to attend the local Catholic convent Grammar school,
I have vague awareness that some area ,s in the UK have or did have ( not sure if they still do ) middle schools but I couldn't really tell you much about them ,surely that not hard to.grasp?

I mean I didn’t even go to state school and I knew about grammar schools as a kid. In a globalised world only being aware of the schools in your local borough is quite odd.

“Escaped my notice”
”Hard to grasp”
Don’t be so bloody cheeky and rude.

And don’t bother replying.

But it's not in local.boroughs is it? most of the UK doesn't have Grammar schools 🙄

The irony ,and I can reply to who I want it's a forum.it's how it works .

First, London has grammars. Secondly who is not aware of the education system of the country they live in.

I never said London didn't have Grammar,and i.am.aware they exist as I studied the Tri partite system of education in history,however the vast majority of kids will not go.to.A Grammar school.simply because they don't exist for them and for miles around so.i.can understand why peop!e much younger them me are not aware of them and why they do.not have in depth knowledge about them
in fact i would say it was stranger that you expect people to.have knowledge about schools that only serve the very few that maybe many miles away from where they live

Posters like you annoy the hell out of me, and a few others by the look of it

in fact i would say it was stranger that you expect people to.have knowledge about schools that only serve the very few that maybe many miles away from where they live

As it’s not 1750 I I’d expect general knowledge that does not relate to a person’s immediate area. I don’t know how many private schools there are in Brixton but presumably OP is aware they exist nonetheless?

🤣

honestly the sniping. The OP has been very gracious. She’s a 23 year old living in an inner borough. we don’t know anything about her background.

as i commented up thread I went to a grammar school, but I only found out recently that the top 150 by marks can go to pupils from out of area.

as another poster has mentioned they know middle schools exist in the UK: same, but I don’t know the ins and outs of them.

OP, you might not want to chuck your children in the closest comp to you. You might have a bright child and a local comp which gets less than stellar results. You might have a neurodivergent child and a local comp with no SEN provision.

There's lots of reasons to look around at schools other than the one closest to you and choose the best one for your child.

Incidentally, and this is more relevant to you now/in the coming few years, I'd apply the same logic to your primary school search when the time comes and don't just assume the closest one is the best. Go along to a few open days, even now. Ask for a tour if they don't do open days. Speak to other mums for feedback etc.

If OP’s kids are anything like her they will have a very bright future ahead as diplomats or hostage negotiators, her ability to stay civil in the face of provocation is amazing!

Having been to a grammar school I am aware of them, but equally the concept of them and distribution of them around the country has changed so much (I'm 54) since I was a student, I can empathise with the OP asking the question.

My DS, now late 20s, ended up at the same primary that I went to, and it wasn't until his final parents evening that I was made aware that the admissions process had changed with regards to grammar selection.

In my day, everyone did the test. My primary was eclectic, a good mix of ethnicity and "class" considering we are South Coast and overall regarded as affluent. The catchment was slightly less affluent though because the well off kids went to private schools. But I digress.

None of us even knew we were taking the grammar exam. The subject of which secondary school we were going to was very much an abstract concept and we just waited to be told. I and four others from my school got in.

Fast forward to my son - at the final parents evening, his form teacher breezily said she didn't think there was any point in putting him forward for the exam. When I boggled - bearing in mind I had been an engaged parent in all areas otherwise - teacher went on to explain the new admission policy and that most of those taking the exam had been having extra tutoring for 3 or 4 years.....

After discussions with my son, he wanted to have a go as two of his closest friends were likely to go to grammar after years of tutoring apparently.... When I mentioned all of this to the parents of said friends they looked at me as though I had two heads and should have "just known". I felt like the shittest parent in the world.

Anyway, long story short, he didn't get in, didn't care, went to what became a local Academy and was unsuccessful academically despite being bright.

But actually now he's hard working in areas that suit him and doing alright - I don't think grammar would have helped and over the years, I have come to judge success by many criteria, not just academic achievements.

My own experience of grammar was that because I came from a low wage and mildly dysfunctional background, while I did ok up to O-levels, I wasn't emotionally equipped for discovering that I couldn't afford to keep up with the better off kids, plus as an only child my parents were quite strict, so socialising was regarded as high risk and I predictably went off the rails in college for a while.

Not entirely sure what point I'm trying to make - sorry.

Other than the original premise of grammar schools has apparently been corrupted and many bright kids may well miss the opportunities that the system was supposed to provide.

Quite.

So is grammar (better not show myself up spelling it wrong as the mother superiors are out in force) just a way to get your kid, who you consider a cut above the riff raff, into a better school without you paying for it?
No wonder mn is so obsessed with it, if it is. Some folk on here just love another excuse to look down on others.

No, it is a way for academically bright children from poorer backgrounds to be able to access a similar standard and quality of education that used to be only available to rich people.

That’s what the original premise was, but now they are only accessible to people who can afford and access tutoring. As a pp said, her son was told not to bother as he hadn’t been tutored for years!

Those that are in favour ,tend to.assume their kids will.get in I live in greater Manchester ,there is only one borough ( that I'm aware of )/that have a Grammar school system and that's Trafford ,I often read it being suggested that people who are considering moving from the South East ,consider Trafford because of the Grammar schools,,because of course they assume their kids will get in.

Read on here*

So basically its like everything else, if you have money you assume of course your kid will get in because you’ll pay for all the tutoring going to get them in.
The usual bollocks.

If you are naturally academic at that age you don't need to be professionally tutored. Many aren't tutored.

"No, it is a way for academically bright children from poorer backgrounds to be able to access a similar standard and quality of education that used to be only available to rich people"
@BadNomad Then why do grammar schools have a significantly lower number of poor and disadvantaged children than the % in the catchment? Because better off children are naturally cleverer?