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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that DH is selfish over my jury service?

470 replies

SeekChase · 23/03/2023 08:14

Hi Ladies...
So, around 2 months ago I was sent a Jury Summons. As I am a mum to 2 small (1&4) children, and with the Jury Service being set for first week or half term ( no preschool), I tried to get out of it, but to no avail. I do understand that they always invite a surplus of potential Jury candidates and there is a chance of getting out on the day...
However, I did give my DH plenty of notice (he is a roofer) and asked that he takes that week to 10 days off to look after the kids (I am normally the stay at home mum) - while I do the Jury Service IF I can't get out of it.

HE AGREED.
Well, last night, bearing in mind I have a week or so before the Jury service starts, he told me he wants to work and its tough. He said I'll have to not go. I said I can get fined £1000 for not showing up, he said "yes it's stupid isn't it" - but won't budge.
I have family but they are actually going away on a prearranged holiday, my DH said they will have to cancel and its not his problem. I am fuming. AIBU?

OP posts:
Goldbar · 23/03/2023 09:54

Aprilx · 23/03/2023 09:41

I think they do have to make it hard to opt out, otherwise you would still get the same groups of society refusing, e.g. parents of young children or people that think they are too important to be off work and consequently missing out on those cross sections of society.

Show quote history

I sort of agree but I do think the main/sole carers of young children are a different group to the others. Young children's needs ought to be considered, so a very young child who is breastfeeding or who is unused to being left with anyone else should not be expected to be left with a different carer if it will cause them distress.

That said, this is not the case here. They have another parent who can take time off to care for them as was originally planned. Even if the kids might prefer mum, I'm assuming dad is perfectly good.

The circumstances in which I think a parent with young children ought to be excused are mums with babies under 1, single parents of pre-school age children (or school-age children if wraparound care isn't available) and couples where one partner has a job they really can't take time off from (so in the military and on a posting or a brain/cancer surgeon and it would mean cancelling 30+ urgent operations).

But the courts should also reimburse childcare at cost price - including nanny costs for very young children and settling in sessions for children who are not already in a childcare setting. And if childcare really isn't available, they should take this into account.

Anotherturnipforthebooks · 23/03/2023 09:56

@GoodChat

But they don't - you can defer if you're in this situation.

They just try to make it difficult so juries don't end up being self-selecting.

UndertheCedartree · 23/03/2023 09:57

I'd just do as you suggested leave before he does and then he has to deal with his own children. He's a disgrace.

Stravaig · 23/03/2023 09:57

Tell him he looks after his own children as agreed or he moves out. There's no way I'd make alternative arrangements for childcare or jury service and allow him to still live with us. The marriage would be over.

Absolutely don't mess the courts around - why should you risk a fine, or be a less responsible member of society, just because your soon-to-be XH is a useless piece of trash.

sadieshavingashindig · 23/03/2023 09:58

Either:

  1. Get up early and just go, leaving your children for him to care for
  2. Take the kids with you and explain you have no childcare - they'll probably send you home
  3. I usually cringe on threads where posters shout LTB for tiny, petty issues but in this case I honestly think you should LTB!
IsItThough · 23/03/2023 09:58

Ring them up now and ask to defer.

You are allowed to defer at the point of being summonsed (as opposed to get out of it forever, which is what it sounds like you originally asked for). They come back and ask you when you can actually do it and you then have to stick to those dates. But as it is so close to the time they will probably have a full list and spares by now.

However your OH is being an absolute dick, prepared to let the mother of his children be arrested, fined and have a criminal record because he is disorganised. I think that says everything.

Aprilx · 23/03/2023 09:58

Blossomtoes · 23/03/2023 09:49

We can't have a situation when jury's only have people who don't have caring responsibilities on it

Why not? As long as there’s diversity in age, sex, etc. why can’t people with caring responsibilities just be excused?

Because it is supposed to be a random cross section of society and no groups should be eliminated. It isn’t just about diversity, it is also important to get the different perspectives from the cross section of society. Perhaps somebody with caring responsibilities / young children / important job / studying / (something else) will have a different perspective on a situation.

whatevrrrr · 23/03/2023 09:59

pinkyredrose · 23/03/2023 09:51

They need a cross section of society, that's the point.

Show quote history

You may think it's stupid, but it's still the way we have to do it. Otherwise it would just be self-selecting group of people. I don't want to give up planned holiday time, but I'd rather do that than lose money (self employed) by having it forced upon me at a time that is monstrously inconvenient.

GoodChat · 23/03/2023 09:59

Anotherturnipforthebooks · 23/03/2023 09:56

@GoodChat

But they don't - you can defer if you're in this situation.

They just try to make it difficult so juries don't end up being self-selecting.

But deferral only delays the issue.

I understand why they do what they do, but some common sense wouldn't go amiss.

Throwncrumbs · 23/03/2023 09:59

Ponoka7 · 23/03/2023 09:48

I think that it is stupid to give up holiday time to do jury duty. There's enough people who are retired, employed who could be released for JD that they don't need to rope the parents of young children and the self employed in.

You cant have a jury full of retired people, it has to be people from all walks of life…otherwise the whole ‘jury of your peers’ is a complete farce. Idiotic comment from someone who has no idea how a court service works!

PrettyMaybug · 23/03/2023 10:00

Like a few others on here, I am also annoyed at the suggestion 'maybe a school mum or female neighbour can help.' WHY does it have to be a bloody woman who has someone else's kids foisted on them? Always the mum who's called out of work if the kids are ill, or the school closes for some reason, always the mum who's blamed if the kids misbehave, always the mums who have other peoples kids dumped on them when they CBA to look after them (or actually CAN'T like the OP.) Whenever someone has an issue with childcare, someone always suggests a certain WOMAN/MOTHER who could look after them.

Also, I am willing to bet that even though your husband earns/brings in a lot more money than you, he will expect YOU to fork out the £1000 fine yourself @SeekChase ??? Am I right? He sounds like a 'separate finances' kind of guy, and definitely keeps any surplus cash/overtime money HE earns to his selfish, mean-spirited self. (Then spends it on his 'hobbies and interests.') Bet YOU never see a penny of HIS money. Hmm

Blossomtoes · 23/03/2023 10:03

Aprilx · 23/03/2023 09:58

Because it is supposed to be a random cross section of society and no groups should be eliminated. It isn’t just about diversity, it is also important to get the different perspectives from the cross section of society. Perhaps somebody with caring responsibilities / young children / important job / studying / (something else) will have a different perspective on a situation.

Show quote history

That makes no sense. There will be people in all those groups who can and will do it. Excusing some members of a sector doesn’t exclude the entire group.

OxygenthiefexH · 23/03/2023 10:03

diddl · 23/03/2023 09:23

Hopefully there will be a neighbour or school mum who can help out Op.

I do wonder where they expect you to find childcare though?

Not everyone has someone available!

You’re part of The Problem.

CountZacular · 23/03/2023 10:04

It’s more than just jury service. It’s the fact you’ve said he’s rather work than spend time with his children, which is absolutely awful.

He has an opportunity over half term to spend some quality time with his kids without losing money and be a supportive partner to you. Instead he’s risking his wife being held in contempt, getting a criminal record and a hefty fine and on top of that making it clear that he doesn’t give a shit about his children. It’s the whole message this gives.

It doesn’t sound like there’s an easy solution, but this is one of those situations where I’d be saying if he doesn’t buck up his ideas then you should LTB. He’s shown you at a time of need where you all come on the priority list and it isn’t going to improve.

Newusername21 · 23/03/2023 10:06

SeekChase · 23/03/2023 08:41

He doesn't want to look after the kids and would prefer to work. He says he can't do it.

This response is simply unacceptable - for a Dad to say he doesn't want to look after his own kids is abhorrent IMO.
It's not like you've just asked him to cover while you go on a girls weekend with your mates or something. (which incidentally should also have been ok).
This is a call for Jury service - which you are legally required to answer to.
If he really feels he is incapable of looking after his own children - then he needs to find and pay for alternative childcare.
It's not for you to try and resolve as you rightly thought you already had "childcare" in place (ie their own father!)

Frabbits · 23/03/2023 10:07

GoodChat · 23/03/2023 09:59

But deferral only delays the issue.

I understand why they do what they do, but some common sense wouldn't go amiss.

Show quote history

It's not a perfect system by any means but being a member of society involves responsibilities, and jury duty is one of them. The system has got better as well, in Scotland at least you no longer have to attend in person for the initial ballot, so rather than having to attend on day 1 you just have to be contactable, and if you make it through the day without being selected chances are that is your duty done and dusted.

It quite obviously has to be a truly random selection process that means anyone and everyone can be selected, and the deferal system exists so that you can say that you can't attend on a given week if you have a legitimate reason not to.

5foot5 · 23/03/2023 10:07

Blossomtoes · 23/03/2023 08:57

Like most things, it depends. If losing ten days’ work would cost more than £1000, surely it’s reasonable? It would be ridiculous for him not to work for ten days if that meant losing more money than the fine.

He is not losing any money.
If you read all the OP's posts properly you will see that he is not self employed. He had already arranged that time off as leave.

Presumably he has now decided he does not fancy spending his time off parenting his own children rather than lazing about doing whatever he wants. So he is just saying "not my problem" and assuming anyone else but him can sort it out.

diddl · 23/03/2023 10:07

OxygenthiefexH · 23/03/2023 10:03

You’re part of The Problem.

Show quote history

Ok.

Of course.

I told Op I'd have her kids & then decided that no I wouldn't.

Viviennemary · 23/03/2023 10:09

You can get out of jury service with young children to care for. AFAIK. if not get a childminder or nursery and claim back expenses. If your DH is the only earner he can't afford to take a week off and shouldn't have agreed to in the first place.

IsItThough · 23/03/2023 10:10

GoodChat · 23/03/2023 09:59

But deferral only delays the issue.

I understand why they do what they do, but some common sense wouldn't go amiss.

Show quote history

But she has childcare/pre-school when it isn't half term, and her family who are away may be able to help. So it does address the urgent issue which is she is going to get in massive trouble if she doesn't show up.

It does, however get OH off the hook. But she cannot rely on him at all, so she will have to make her own arrangements

Eastmeetswest1 · 23/03/2023 10:11

I was given jury service a few years ago, at the time with 3 young children - the 1st week of the school holidays. The letter says children not allowed in court (obviously). I was the SAHP. I phoned the number given on the letter and a form was sent out which I completed saying above and that no available childcare (they never questioned about my husband). As I understood it, even if there was childcare and I booked it, if I was told on the day that I wasn't needed I would of been left to pay for the childcare as I'd been released from duty - at over £100 a day.

The lady on there phone couldn't guarantee I would be excused but said I had a good chance. I did get a letter excusing me. Even at this short notice could you not phone back and ask for the form? I was easy to complete - tick boxes of why your needed excused.

The only thing she did say was you could get recalled within a year.... And she didn't think I could get excused a second time but I've not had another letter. Worth a try...... It's so worrying when you don't have childcare on a daily basis.

CountZacular · 23/03/2023 10:12

Viviennemary · 23/03/2023 10:09

You can get out of jury service with young children to care for. AFAIK. if not get a childminder or nursery and claim back expenses. If your DH is the only earner he can't afford to take a week off and shouldn't have agreed to in the first place.

OP already said he won’t lose money and he’s only changed his mind because he doesn’t want to look after the children.

And by that logic, does that mean he can never take time off to spend with his children?

ilovesooty · 23/03/2023 10:12

FangsForTheMemory · 23/03/2023 09:06

You think it’s fun? I know three people who found it absolutely traumatic. You don’t know what sort of cases you’ll get.

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Where did she say she thought it would be "fun"?

emmetgirl · 23/03/2023 10:13

Turn up for jury service and tell the judge that your dh has refused to look after his own children. See what s/he says.

pinkthree · 23/03/2023 10:14

Get up and get out the house before him

What a complete idiot he is. I hate how some men just think it's the woman's responsibility no matter what to sort the children out