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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Daughter accused of instigating a serious incident. Is she really wrong?

738 replies

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 20:37

I have name changed for this to not link to previous threads as this is outing and I have told people in real life.

I am going to preface this be saying my DD 13 is a gobby little sod so I know she can be annoying and hasn't got the best school record but she has no time for injustice which has led to conflict for her in the past but to todays incident...

My DD has several black friends (we come from a very white area). She was told today that one lad was going around using the N word. This isn't the first time and so she took it upon herself to confront him and tell him it isn't right and it is racist. Like I say she is gobby so I imagine she was heated when she said it. He pushed her away and told her to leave him alone, everyone gathered around and she said she wasn't going to fight and went to move away, he pushed her again and ran off. Two of her friends then caught up with the lad and several punches were thrown. I am not saying the fight was acceptable. It was 2 on 1 and he was hurt and fighting is never ok.

My DD has now been given a day of internal exclusion because she initiated a serious incident. Did she though or did she call out unacceptable racism? Was it not the lad who was using the n word the person who instigated it? I have said that she has to accept that she was wrong to get involved in something that wasn't to do with her but was she wrong? If people don't call out racist behaviour how is it stopped? I am going to be speaking to the head teacher tomorrow as I missed his call today but AIBU to be proud of her for taking a stand against racist behaviour and to be arguing with the punishment for starting this when if he hadn't made the comments it wouldn't have been necessary to 'talk' to him about it. And is the school wrong for punishing someone for calling out this behaviour?

OP posts:
Tomkirkman · 22/03/2023 21:12

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 21:04

Just so we are clear there are things I am not mentioning that are outing to the child involved and my child. I don't think that calling out this behaviour was a good idea for her safety as much as anything but no I haven't said to her that it's fine so she will learn nothing from this. She will learn from this and already has. She gave her statement to the head of year who according to my DD said that she thought she hadn't really done anything to be punished for. I am aware that from an outsiders perspective this is an innocent angel who has been targeted by a little shit who has got her friends to beat him up. That is far far from the case!

No one said he was an angel.

The fact that he isn’t an angel doesn’t make anything ok. You don’t have to be an angel for something f to happen to you that shouldn’t.

Your daughter has a reputation. Would it be ok if someone came to her in a gobby and heated way and accused her of saying something with a crowd encouraging then. Would it be ok, it 2 people then attacked her? Because she isn’t an angel?

I do not understand why, if one of the boys who hit him, heard him say it and it was about him, why your dd didn’t let that boy deal with it.

Why did she need to get involved?

EachTownLooksTheSameToMe · 22/03/2023 21:13

Iam4eels · 22/03/2023 21:04

And if he had to push her twice to get away from her, after her ignoring him saying "leave me alone", then it does not sound like it was a gentle conversation. It sounds like she was in his personal space and being verbally aggressive. A push in those circumstances is not an uncommon reaction and my own DC have been told that if someone is aggressively in their personal space then they are allowed to push that person back in order to make room for a get away.

This is a good point. If he felt like he had to push he twice that suggests she was behaving aggressively and potentially in his personal space. I wonder if you got the watered down version of this OP.

Eyerollcentral · 22/03/2023 21:14

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 21:08

I have said over and over that I agree she didn't handle it like I would have and many adults would have. She is 13 and made a mistake but she didn't lay a finger on him, she didn't hurt anyone. She is being punished for it. That's fine. She will take the punishment. She doesn't think she is special because she boxes. It has given her lots of control, it has helped her mental health. I am not excusing her. She has so many reasons for the way she behaves but they are not going to be shared here. She is passionate about her friends, loyal to a fault and this has clearly bitten her on the arse on this occasion

OP, your daughter clearly has had struggles to overcome. Many children do. It’s great you are doing positive things to help her mental health. You aren’t seeing the problem though, your daughter is a mouth. That’s going to continue to get her in to trouble. She now has a name for being a fight starter. Actually people don’t generally respect those who tend to make the snowballs and get others to throw them. It’s the two black boys who have now been in a physical fight because she stirred it up. You and your daughter should dwell on that a bit.

Fluckinghell · 22/03/2023 21:14

People on this thread are so naive!

Well done to your daughter OP. 'Telling the teacher' won't get you very far in life, kids nowadays don't listen to adults!!

CinnamonJellyBeans · 22/03/2023 21:15

Scienceadvisory · 22/03/2023 20:42

Except she doesn't even know for sure this boy said anything racist. She just heard it from someone else and then went running round causing trouble. If she actually cared she would have reported to a teacher. But she just sounds like a hot-head who enjoys drama. I wonder if the person who told her about the alleged comments did so because they know its easy to wind your daughter up.

yep.

TellySavalashairbrush · 22/03/2023 21:15

I wouldn’t have been happy if this was my daughter. Unless she heard it first hand she was wrong to accuse the boy and even if she had, she could have reported it to a teacher, rather than causing all of this aggravation. What if the fight had got out of hand ? or he’d been punched , fell and hit his head causing serious harm or god forbid worse.
I certainly wouldn’t be praising her for her behaviour.

Iam4eels · 22/03/2023 21:15

Fluckinghell · 22/03/2023 21:14

People on this thread are so naive!

Well done to your daughter OP. 'Telling the teacher' won't get you very far in life, kids nowadays don't listen to adults!!

I work in a school and the children who listen are the ones whose parents don't undermine the school at every opportunity. Weird, isn't it?

WhatHappenedToYoyos · 22/03/2023 21:15

What I'd be reflecting on is whether she has form for verbally berating people in school, regardless of whether it's a justified cause, or was this is the first time she's got involved in a situation and it's unfortunately ended the way it did.

You say she is gobby and doesn't have a great school report for behaviour. Maybe she has been given warnings multiple times to stop behaving in this way and she isn't heeding those warnings. Now it has ended in a child being beaten up, albeit instigated by his own decision to shove your DD.

If this was a one-time thing then I'd be 100% saying the internal exclusion isn't right. However, if this is the only way the school can show her they're serious then you need to support them. You can agree she should call out racism whilst simultaneously supporting that the school need her to report it properly to a teacher or adult.

Only you know the full background to decide whether to take this further with SLT or if your DD just has to accept she made an error in judgement and handled a situation poorly.

RosesAndHellebores · 22/03/2023 21:16

Not every 13 year old has form for being gobby and difficult at school.

She should have told a teacher. Her actions precipitated a fight albeit she wasn't involved in it.

The boy was wrong and should be sanctioned.

Regrettably if your dd is generally a difficult and disruptive pupil, her behaviour over this supports the school to take definitive action against her.

I would support your dd's argument re the n word but not her actions.

TiredandHungry19 · 22/03/2023 21:16

Bunch of weirdos on this thread! Confronting someone and refusing to fight him isn’t deserving of that punishment, it’s not like she set her friends on him either. The fact he resorted to violence immediately makes me think he absolutely is the kind of kid to use the n word.

pictoosh · 22/03/2023 21:16

I agree that ‘telling a teacher’ achieves fuck all.

Dymaxion · 22/03/2023 21:18

Its the age old story of doing the wrong thing for the right reason.

If I were you I would be explaining to her that her intentions were good, but her execution was lacking, which is why she has ended up with a fairly minor punishment. Perhaps get her to ask teaching staff who is the best person to inform if the boy uses this language again ?

Livelovebehappy · 22/03/2023 21:18

It’s all Chinese whispers, and maybe she is lying to you to try to minimise the incident, to make it more acceptable. Sounds like she hasn’t got the best track record, and you really need to stop making excuses for her behaviour.

TiredandHungry19 · 22/03/2023 21:18

The kid got beaten up because he instigated violence. She didn’t react and it wasn’t her that beat him up, talk about victim blaming to blame OP’s daughter for that. Disgusting.

raspberrywine · 22/03/2023 21:18

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 20:53

This boy is known for being trouble. He is known for using horrible language towards and about people. I agree she could have made some much better decisions. I don't for a minute think he didn't say the word. He is far from an angel (as I am aware she is too)

But did he actually say it in this instance? Your DD didn't know for sure though, right?

spidereggs · 22/03/2023 21:19

Not a chance I would accept that.

Have read op posts

Will go back in, but

She heard racist comments

She challenged those

She walked away from violence and was assaulted twice? Albeit on a minor scale?

Then two others hit him?

She is a young person standing up for our values, punished for actions of others.

Nope, that's not good and I would be absolutely discussing that with school.

LilLilLi · 22/03/2023 21:20

My answer would be completely different IF she had heard him say it herself because I’m all for calling out racism, but she didn’t.

She confronted him based on hearsay and this led to him being assaulted. She caused that.

She is completely in the wrong here.

Laptopneeded · 22/03/2023 21:20

@wasshereallywrong

My two dc wouldn't have done this at 13 and would have alerted a teacher.

So saying she's like any 13 year old no.

LilLilLi · 22/03/2023 21:20

spidereggs · 22/03/2023 21:19

Not a chance I would accept that.

Have read op posts

Will go back in, but

She heard racist comments

She challenged those

She walked away from violence and was assaulted twice? Albeit on a minor scale?

Then two others hit him?

She is a young person standing up for our values, punished for actions of others.

Nope, that's not good and I would be absolutely discussing that with school.

No she didn’t hear the racist comments.

Reinventinganna · 22/03/2023 21:20

I think the punishment fits her part in it.

Nothing excuses racism but nothing is solved with violence. I wouldn’t tell her (because I wouldn’t want her to think that she can take matters into her own hands each time) but I would be pleased that she stood up against a bully.

Newmum0322 · 22/03/2023 21:20

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 20:46

This isn't the first time he has used the word, I agree she should have maybe spoken to a teacher and was a bit hot headed but she is 13 and doesn't always think, like any 13 year old!

And like all 13 year olds who ‘act like a hot head’ and go looking for an argument, she needs to learn there are consequences. That’s why she’s been internally excluded.

If she was genuinely concerned the she should have found a teacher and reported his racist comments. She didn’t because she’s gobby and confrontational, the school are right to stamp out that kind of behaviour and I’d recommend you do the same.

Tomkirkman · 22/03/2023 21:20

She didn’t hear racists comments.

Itsneverwhatitseems · 22/03/2023 21:21

Why are people telling her about someone using the N word
Why aren’t they telling a teacher.
Why didn’t she tell a teacher, although as she didn’t hear it herself that would be here-say but at least the teachers could investigate.

Why is she verbally abusing someone when she has no proof first hand of what happened and even if she did she should be talking to someone in authority not taking matters into her own hands

If this guy was hurt based on here-say one day of exclusion is quite tame. We don’t do witch hunts anymore

TiredandHungry19 · 22/03/2023 21:21

LilLilLi · 22/03/2023 21:20

My answer would be completely different IF she had heard him say it herself because I’m all for calling out racism, but she didn’t.

She confronted him based on hearsay and this led to him being assaulted. She caused that.

She is completely in the wrong here.

Actually it was his own violence to Op’s daughter that led to him being assaulted.

Pointerdogsrule · 22/03/2023 21:21

TiredandHungry19 · 22/03/2023 21:16

Bunch of weirdos on this thread! Confronting someone and refusing to fight him isn’t deserving of that punishment, it’s not like she set her friends on him either. The fact he resorted to violence immediately makes me think he absolutely is the kind of kid to use the n word.

This

The boy sounds like a little shit who got what he deserved. Any teenage boy that voilently pushes a girl, twice is a piece of shit, end of.