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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Daughter accused of instigating a serious incident. Is she really wrong?

738 replies

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 20:37

I have name changed for this to not link to previous threads as this is outing and I have told people in real life.

I am going to preface this be saying my DD 13 is a gobby little sod so I know she can be annoying and hasn't got the best school record but she has no time for injustice which has led to conflict for her in the past but to todays incident...

My DD has several black friends (we come from a very white area). She was told today that one lad was going around using the N word. This isn't the first time and so she took it upon herself to confront him and tell him it isn't right and it is racist. Like I say she is gobby so I imagine she was heated when she said it. He pushed her away and told her to leave him alone, everyone gathered around and she said she wasn't going to fight and went to move away, he pushed her again and ran off. Two of her friends then caught up with the lad and several punches were thrown. I am not saying the fight was acceptable. It was 2 on 1 and he was hurt and fighting is never ok.

My DD has now been given a day of internal exclusion because she initiated a serious incident. Did she though or did she call out unacceptable racism? Was it not the lad who was using the n word the person who instigated it? I have said that she has to accept that she was wrong to get involved in something that wasn't to do with her but was she wrong? If people don't call out racist behaviour how is it stopped? I am going to be speaking to the head teacher tomorrow as I missed his call today but AIBU to be proud of her for taking a stand against racist behaviour and to be arguing with the punishment for starting this when if he hadn't made the comments it wouldn't have been necessary to 'talk' to him about it. And is the school wrong for punishing someone for calling out this behaviour?

OP posts:
ittakes2 · 23/03/2023 05:53

Also I would like to add please - as a mixed race person myself - I think it would make me feel less empowered if someone took it upon themselves to create an argument about my colour. That person has taken my choice away on how to deal with something that happened to me. Better to ask me what I want done about it.

Whyarewehardofthinking · 23/03/2023 06:03

As a previous poster has said; she started it by shit stiring. Yes her views on racism are right, but that that word out of the situation for a minute.

She confronted someone about something she was told secondhand. It may not be correct. A group of kids then go looking for another kid. Kids being kids means that more will join the group amd then suddenly you have a pack running around trying to find someone to cause shit. That is the issue.

It is something that we are finding a growing problem. Some gossip/bitching gets spread around, everyone gets involved and wants to confront it. Then you get swarms of kids and then fights which are difficult to manage. That age group are becoming a nightmare with it and I know it isn't limited to just my school.

Maedan · 23/03/2023 06:26

The boy instigated the incident by using that word and then physically assaulting your daughter when she challenged him on it. I can't see what your DD did wrong, I'd go f***g mad at this.

78Summer · 23/03/2023 06:32

Challenging someone in a gobby manner is never going to end well.

AxolotlOnions · 23/03/2023 06:33

I think she did the right thing, the racist instigated the situation with his racism, then instigated the violence by assaulting your daughter. Calling out racism is the right thing to do. I would get the other side of the story but if your daughter is telling the truth she should not be in trouble and she should not have been accused of causing this situation.

Theos · 23/03/2023 06:34

She should have reported it. If you have kids going around school meeting out their own justice as they see it - you get anarchy.

Theos · 23/03/2023 06:35

I say this as a head of year. She dealt with it totally wrongly.

Mothership4two · 23/03/2023 06:37

Mothership4two · 23/03/2023 00:48

The only thing that the OP knows for sure is that she received a voice message from the headteacher which presumably said that her daughter was going to be excluded.

And I repeat my sentiments from nearly 6 hours ago

TheHoover · 23/03/2023 06:42

I agree with how your daughter has dealt with it and believe the school was wrong in treating the fight as a worse misdemeanour than the racism (or at least that’s the message they are giving out).

Those involved in the fight are responsible for their own actions. I don’t agree with punishing an instigator so harshly in any respect but in this particular case it’s outrageous

labamba007 · 23/03/2023 06:42

wasshereallywrong · 22/03/2023 21:04

Just so we are clear there are things I am not mentioning that are outing to the child involved and my child. I don't think that calling out this behaviour was a good idea for her safety as much as anything but no I haven't said to her that it's fine so she will learn nothing from this. She will learn from this and already has. She gave her statement to the head of year who according to my DD said that she thought she hadn't really done anything to be punished for. I am aware that from an outsiders perspective this is an innocent angel who has been targeted by a little shit who has got her friends to beat him up. That is far far from the case!

People aren't saying the boy is an innocent angel. But in life we can't go around confronting people based on second hand information. I am sure it's true and this boy will need discipline but it's not your daughters job to judge, jury and executioner.

BusyMum47 · 23/03/2023 06:53

Azandme · 22/03/2023 20:41

Yes racist behaviour needs calling out, but there are ways to deal with it, and the way she chose wasn't a good one.

She should have immediately raised it with a member of staff, instead of charging in - because that DID incite the incident.

I'm all for people standing up for what is right, but they need to do it in a way that isn't wrong.

This! Plain & simple. ⬆️

thebestbirtheraccordingtoDD · 23/03/2023 06:53

I don't think she's done anything wrong. Good for her for standing up for what's right.

If people people did that the world would be a better place.

KimberleyClark · 23/03/2023 06:55

Zuyi · 22/03/2023 20:45

I agree with PP. If she heard the word firsthand, it would be good to speak up then and there, but to react to gossip is something else entirely. Who knows if the gossip was true or part of a whole bullying thing against that boy who got beaten up.

This. She can’t go about meting out summary justice on the basis of hearsay!

LuluLehman · 23/03/2023 07:06

sashh · 23/03/2023 02:10

DD had the right motives but her actions were wrong.

She should have taken it to a teacher.

I've no reason to think what I am about to type next happened, just a pause for thought and maybe something others might want to discuss with their teens.

There is a 'thing' going around at the moment where some children sell an 'N word pass' to their friends, this allows the friend to use that word for a day / week.

It's not always an N word, other racial slurs are also 'sold'.

Why would any child want to buy such a thing? Why would a child sell it? Schools should be promoting anti racism, as should parents.

Dd at least has attempted to stand up for something. It is not uncommon for allies of anti racism to become isolated and made into targets themselves. That is presumably why many people choose not to stand up to racists. I would look into the schools’ claims and I wouldn’t take anything they say at face value until I’d examined the facts for myself. Institutional racism has many invidious facets.

LuluLehman · 23/03/2023 07:14

Eyerollcentral · 23/03/2023 00:58

What do you think about a white child winding up two black boys to do the punching whilst scuttling off saying I don’t want to fight you to the alleged racist?

Show quote history

I wonder why many of you seem to think that the two black boys don’t have minds of their own. They made a decision to act as they did. Why do you (and the teachers?) assume that they were being controlled by the white girl?

Tomkirkman · 23/03/2023 07:17

LuluLehman · 23/03/2023 07:14

I wonder why many of you seem to think that the two black boys don’t have minds of their own. They made a decision to act as they did. Why do you (and the teachers?) assume that they were being controlled by the white girl?

Show quote history

I agree. They chose those actions.

But it does make me wonder why the dd thought they didn’t have minds of their own and couldn’t deal with in it themselves and needed her to deal with it in a way that escalated it.

LuluLehman · 23/03/2023 07:19

sugarspices · 22/03/2023 22:39

@Eyerollcentral I do agree that she didn't deal with what she was told appropriately and shouldn't have confronted the boy, however I do not agree that therefore anything that happens after that point is her fault. Every person in that situation had a decision to make about their own actions, and they all decided poorly.

You've said previously that this isn't a feminist issue however your repeated use of the word "mouth" to describe OPs daughter is telling.

You also said that she was lucky not to be punched for her intervention. Women (or people generally) should be empowered to use their words and are not "lucky" not be physically attacked as a result. It is a basic expectation to be able to express yourself without being on the receiving end of violence.

You have also repeatedly sought to blame her for every dimension of this situation. It seems that you just don't like it that OPs daughter has a lot to say, which is ironic considering how much you like to add your voice to matters.

This!

And all the posts calling her a “gobshite” etc are so offensive. Insults like that are intended to silence women and black people who speak up.

TenTwentyAtCheltenhamSandwich · 23/03/2023 07:19

You can’t knock someone for standing up & fighting for what they believe in. That kid was me years ago. It appears that your daughter’s been made a scapegoat in all of this. I’d be asking questions as to why the racist kid never been pulled up on his behavior.

StayBased · 23/03/2023 07:20

Phoebo · 23/03/2023 00:49

Hilarious, yes people pretend someone is being racist so they can bully them Hmm Gosh, now I've heard it all!

Show quote history

Were you never at school? Fabricating reasons to be offended was a classic bullying tactic at mine. One of the reasons I’ll never trust people like that. Good on the leadership of OP’s daughter’s school for having the gumption to Stand up to it and not losing their critical thinking when someone screeches “racism”.

stampitout · 23/03/2023 07:26

She did well for calling out racism and school should be encouraging others to do the same.

My son is a gentle giant. He's literally the only black kid in his school. The only time he got angry at school was when he was called the N word. The Head Teacher said that he didn't blame him!

Please thank her for me!

Aprilx · 23/03/2023 07:28

You should no be proud of your daughter, it is no wonder she is a trouble maker when you condone her behaviour. She doesn’t even know for a fact that anything racist was said and who made her judge and jury anyway. It very much looks like she incited an attack on another child and she should be punished every bit as much as the others involved.

JJ456 · 23/03/2023 07:31

As a teacher I can see why they did decide to punish her as the school likely has a zero tolerance policy on this sort of thing that they have to follow.

However as a person I’m really proud of your DD and you should be too! Hopefully knowing she did the right thing will help her get through the exclusion. I bet some of the teachers will go easy on her during it as well because of her actions which they’ll probably support!

StayBased · 23/03/2023 07:33

JJ456 · 23/03/2023 07:31

As a teacher I can see why they did decide to punish her as the school likely has a zero tolerance policy on this sort of thing that they have to follow.

However as a person I’m really proud of your DD and you should be too! Hopefully knowing she did the right thing will help her get through the exclusion. I bet some of the teachers will go easy on her during it as well because of her actions which they’ll probably support!

I hope you don’t teach English. OP’s daughter didn’t even hear the boy she assailed saying anything racist.

Tomkirkman · 23/03/2023 07:36

stampitout · 23/03/2023 07:26

She did well for calling out racism and school should be encouraging others to do the same.

My son is a gentle giant. He's literally the only black kid in his school. The only time he got angry at school was when he was called the N word. The Head Teacher said that he didn't blame him!

Please thank her for me!

She didn’t call out anything.

Your son heard a racist comment and took action. That’s not what happened here.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 23/03/2023 07:38

StayBased · 23/03/2023 07:33

I hope you don’t teach English. OP’s daughter didn’t even hear the boy she assailed saying anything racist.

Show quote history

Clearly doesn't teach history, either. History is littered with the bodies of entire groups and individuals murdered/exiled on the basis of 'did you hear what they did/said?'.