So upset. DP called DD this

[peachesandcreamz]

Hello,

For a bit of context, I’m currently going through a miscarriage and I’ve been feeling absolutely shit and tired/weepy all day. DD (8) wanted to bake which I said I’d do but I felt so poorly I couldn’t face it.

DD had the biggest meltdown, started screaming at the top of her lungs, knocked the dining chair over, ragged my phone out of my hand (I was calling her dad to get some support).

DP is obviously trying to support me and hated seeing DD screech at me and talk to me like shit. He lost his patience with her and called her a “spoilt little brat” 😢. This then made things a hell of a lot worse, and DD was even more hysterical. I tried getting her to go to her room which she point blank refused and things just escalated from there, which riled DP even more. I just cried and felt despair.

Obviously DP isn’t DD’s dad. We don’t live together and I said I think it’s best if he goes home for the night.

I’m annoyed with DD for reacting so badly but at the same time, she has no idea what I’m going through. It wasn’t DP’s place to lose his shit with her, was it?

[GBoucher]

@Jazzabel Absolutely. Pretty much every kid I've known has behaved badly because they chose to, including myself. I was not traumatised by any stretch of the imagination.

[beastlyslumber]

Half of you on this thread sound like Mrs Trunchbull.

It's absolutely shocking how little understanding you have of child psychology and how little compassion for a small child.

You know who calls children 'brats'? The baddies.

There are ways to parent and manage bad behaviour without using abusive methods such as anger, threats and name calling. It's not a choice between accepting the behaviour or losing your shit. It's a matter of finding an effective way to communicate with the child and meet their needs without completely sacrificing your own. It can be difficult at times, but parenting isn't always easy.

Unless you're Mrs Trunchbull, of course.

[Jazzabel]

@GBoucher

@Jazzabel Absolutely. Pretty much every kid I've known has behaved badly because they chose to, including myself. I was not traumatised by any stretch of the imagination.

Exactly! I also knew that physical violence was not an acceptable way to behave. It did not stop me from smacking my brother round the head with my Sindy horse though!

Would like to say I’m very close with my brother these days lol

[GBoucher]

@emilytheresponsibleone My parenting was absolutely fine. It seems you are the one with the problem. If you are so empathetic why can't you empathise with the OP's DP? Why are you insulting the OP by putting 'DP' in inverted commas to invalidate how she feels about him? She clearly sees him as her partner because that's what she calls him, but you insist on calling him her boyfriend. You don't know me. But you think it's ok to insult me by saying I have no empathy and that my parents brought me up wrong. You have also repeatedly fabricated details about the OP and her daughter to fit the narrative you want to push. I don't think I'm the one with the issue here.

[aSofaNearYou]

@Summerbird11

I am very sorry about your situation OP, that’s horrible. However, I disagree with most of the replies here. She’s only 8 FFS and was presumably gutted about the baking, and likely to be unsure about if you’re ok etc. Give her a break and talk to her when she’s calmer.
And am horrified at your DP’s text - you’re honestly ok with him saying that about her. How do you know he wasn’t winding her up deliberately rather than it being ‘back chat’?

8 is way too old to have a meltdown about not baking. This is three year old behaviour.

[GBoucher]

OK, beastlyslumber, what would you have done in the situation? OP has just suffered a miscarriage and is feeling physically and mentally shot. She tells her DD she is not able to bake with her as planned as she is feeling poorly (having been crying all day which DD is fully aware of). DD acts unhinged, screams at the top of her lungs, bashes furniture around, aggressively lunges at the fragile OP to snatch her phone, etc. What should OP's DP have done, who no doubt is in an extremely precarious state himself having just lost his baby and is now watching OP's daughter acting violently and aggressively towards the OP?

[GBoucher]

While you think about what you would have done, let's talk about what the OP's DP did. He called the DD a spoilt brat. I admire his restraint.

[Blondeshavemorefun]

Sorry for your loss @peachesandcreamz and for your partners

From what you have said I agree with so many who said she was a spoilt brat

Yes she had disappointment but assume she doesn't behave like that at school

How long have you and partner been together

You say this was unplanned and don't live together so prob wise to sort out contraception so this doesn't happen again till you are both ready

Going forward boundaries do Need to be set in place. An 8yr saying shut up to an adult isn't appropriate

You need to be able to control and sort out your daughters tempers and not call for help of her dad who lives miles away

Once again. Sorry for your loss 💐

[Starwarslover]

She’s 8, old enough to hear a few home truths and he wasn’t wrong so I personally wouldn’t hold it against him.

Sorry you’re going through such a tough time OP 💐

[TrashyPanda]

“she’s just told me to shut up. I could kick her arse”.

so she’s still behaving like a spoiled brat.

I don’t blame him. Who would want to spend time with someone else’s rude kid?

[Baggal1983]

@beastlyslumber

Half of you on this thread sound like Mrs Trunchbull.

It's absolutely shocking how little understanding you have of child psychology and how little compassion for a small child.

You know who calls children 'brats'? The baddies.

There are ways to parent and manage bad behaviour without using abusive methods such as anger, threats and name calling. It's not a choice between accepting the behaviour or losing your shit. It's a matter of finding an effective way to communicate with the child and meet their needs without completely sacrificing your own. It can be difficult at times, but parenting isn't always easy.

Unless you're Mrs Trunchbull, of course.

While I don’t disagree with you (in principle) I think that this is a bit unrealistic. I have a strong willed and very intelligent little girl (she’s my world) and generally all is well and pretty blissful. However, as all children, she can be difficult too, pushing all the hot buttons and wanting to argue her case, determined not to give up.

I wish I could say that I never raised my voice, never got angry but I have and so has my DH. Not all the time, not every day, but very occasionally. Does it make me a bad mother? Does it mean that I don’t show enough love? That my child will be traumatised one day? Of course not…

I have on rare occasions called my child spoiled when she was ungrateful or that I didn’t like her behaviour (followed by: and for the avoidance of doubt: I always love you). Explained to her that she’s not better but a little more lucky that her parents have well paid jobs, urged her to do homework, etc. I think it’s rare and very unrealistic to expect parents never to get angry as your post seems to imply.

[AllOfThemWitches]

@TrashyPanda

“she’s just told me to shut up. I could kick her arse”.

so she’s still behaving like a spoiled brat.

I don’t blame him. Who would want to spend time with someone else’s rude kid?

Not me and I wouldn't choose to. He has chosen to though. Quite a lot by the sounds of it.

[AaaaaandBreathe]

I think that's completely unacceptable behaviour for an 8 year old! It's really not normal so I don't know why some posters are pretending it is.

I wouldn't be angry about her being called a spoilt brat in those circumstances...I would, however, be angry that he said he could 'kick her arse'. Even if he didn't say it to her, that's how he felt.

I'm very sorry for your loss I hope you manage to get some rest then look into what is causing your DDs behaviour.

[BadNomad]

I think a lot of parents don't realise that children always remember when parents/significant adults in their lives call them negative names. Just look at the damage something like "chubby" or "stupid" can do. It can trigger a lifetime of issues. If you call your children names, please stop, and don't allow other people to do it either.

[aSofaNearYou]

You know who calls children 'brats'? The baddies.

The baddies in films are not generally talking about children behaving like OPs daughter, are they? In fact they're usually talking about a child that is objectively well behaved.

There's certainly an argument that saying it in front of her wasn't very effective parenting for a variety of reasons, but he's not some villainous monster for viewing her behaviour that way.

[aSofaNearYou]

@BadNomad

I think a lot of parents don't realise that children always remember when parents/significant adults in their lives call them negative names. Just look at the damage something like "chubby" or "stupid" can do. It can trigger a lifetime of issues. If you call your children names, please stop, and don't allow other people to do it either.

Chubby and stupid are very different from "spoilt brat", though. The latter is essentially saying they're behaving badly. Different from insulting their appearance or intelligence.

[ToBeFrancesca]

I don't think you have to look very far to see what's causing the DD's behaviour. The universe has revolved around her (probably too much so, but you can see why) for 8 years. That isn't her fault. Now she's trying to cope with changes that would test any adult, plus the presence of a man who doesn't live with them, is not her stepfather, and has no right whatsoever to involve himself in her discipline. Especially not when his primary concern is his own feelings and his own desire/willingness to exclude the child in order to get her mum on her own. If you start a relationship with a single mother of a young child, you have to actually want to be in the relationship with both of them, not shove the child out when you're fed up with them or they're cramping your style.

The DD shouldn't be telling an adult to 'shut up', even as a joke. It suggests that she has been allowed to rule the roost. But that's a problem for the OP and her DD's father to try to sort out in the context of a stable co-parenting relationship with agreed boundaries and natural consequences for poor behaviour. It's not going to be sorted out while the child feels insecure, frightened and 'second best' to her mum's boyfriend. If the OP wants to be in a relationship - and there's no reason why she shouldn't - it needs to be with a man who has bucketloads of understanding for children and their needs. If any man had ever sent me a message saying he felt like kicking my DC up the arse, that would have been the end for me. No relationship is worth that.

[Tandora]

@emilytheresponsibleone

I bet you believe that children adopted at birth have no trauma either?

I'm willing to believe that OP's relationship was the first ever one to end completely amicably with no conflict at all, shortly after her child's birth, and be followed by a perfect co-parenting relationship. With no parental upset on either side. Congratulations on her having the first ever incidence of this, as I've never heard of it happening before.

Don’t be absurd, no coparenting relationship whether in the context of a traditional (cohabiting) marriage- or not- is entirely devoid of conflict or upset. That doesn’t mean all children who don’t have two biological, cohabiting parents are traumatised.

[aSofaNearYou]

the presence of a man who doesn't live with them, is not her stepfather, and has no right whatsoever to involve himself in her discipline. Especially not when his primary concern is his own feelings and his own desire/willingness to exclude the child in order to get her mum on her own.

Total projection here. She had asked him to take her out so actually yes on that occasion he DID have a right to discipline, anything else would be taking the piss.

And you simply cannot extrapolate the rest of what you've said from him reacting negatively to the behaviour she's shown. There is absolutely no reason to think his primary concern is trying to get her mum on her own. He was pissed off with how she was acting, which is completely different.

[GBoucher]

@ToBeFrancesca
'Especially not when his primary concern is his own feelings and his own desire/willingness to exclude the child in order to get her mum on her own.'

Curious as to where this came from. OP has never said anything remotely close to this.

[Tandora]

@StalkedByASpider

Sorry for your loss OP, but you have all kinds of red flags waving here.

Your DC got upset because you weren't able to do baking with her as promised - understandable. Expressing emotions is important and she's allowed to be angry and/or upset.

Your DC knocked furniture over and smacked your phone out of your hand when you were trying to call her dad for help - not OK.

The fact you can't manage to calm/cope with your DC when she's upset without phoning for help - concerning.

The fact that she point blank refuses to respect you or listen to what she's being asked to do - not OK. (I don't agree with sending kids to their bedrooms as a punishment - but if you asked her to do that, she doesn't get to decide she's going to refuse).

Your DP calling your child a "spoilt brat" and saying he could "kick her arse" - absolutely fucking not. I have a DP who's not the bio father and he would not be in this house if he ever spoke about my DC like that.

For all the PP who think the DP was in the right, I think he was right to be annoyed with the DC but he didn't handle it the right way. I don't think it's ever acceptable to call a child names. You're modelling the way to behave and even if you're furious with a child, I don't think you should be calling them names. That just teaches them that if you're angry, it's OK to call other people names and be aggressive/unpleasant. And I get that it's hard and kids can push your buttons - but resorting to name-calling is just not OK ever, imo. And that coupled with his comment about wanting to "kick her arse" just because of a bit of back chat - I wouldn't see him as a life partner, and I wouldn't want him around my child.

I have autistic twins, one with high needs, and over the years, fuck me, it has been difficult at times. And I was a single mum for a large portion of those years. But I have never, ever said that I wanted to "kick their arse" and I've never called my DC names in the heat of anger. I wouldn't have anyone in the house who did either.

All of this exactly.

OP, I think it’s disturbing your partner is talking about “kicking the arse” of your 8 year old child. That would be a major red flag for me..

[Nowhereelsetogo90]

@emilytheresponsibleone I agree with you about the use of empathy and natural consequences. But is there any chance that your own lived experience as an adopter is colouring your views here? Lots of adopted children are obviously subject to trauma very young, even from the womb. But a child who has experienced an amicable break up before she can even remember it isn’t the same thing? And amicable break ups and peaceful co parenting relationships do exist, my family is very much in that category. He also didn’t “threaten to kick her up the arse,” as you said in a previous post, that’s hyperbole at best and a complete twisting of the OPs words at worst. Are you honestly saying as a Mum you’ve never had a moment where you’ve muttered similar to another adult when your DC are having a tricky day? Empathy is a lovely way to parent and natural consequences and a peaceful household is optimum, but none of us are saints. We have feelings. Maybe OPs DP was just at the end of his rope - length he’s lost a baby too. I think everyone in this situation needs empathy.

[BadNomad]

@aSofaNearYou

Chubby and stupid are very different from "spoilt brat", though. The latter is essentially saying they're behaving badly. Different from insulting their appearance or intelligence.

I don't agree. Calling someone a "spoilt brat" is not commenting on their behaviour, it is commenting on them as a person. Same how saying "you're stupid" is different from saying "stop acting stupid" when someone is misbehaving.

[Shz]

@GBoucher

While you think about what you would have done, let's talk about what the OP's DP did. He called the DD a spoilt brat. I admire his restraint.

This I agree with.

Parenting is hard work and regardless of all those claiming to only ever parent with sunshine and sparkles we have ALL been in the position of wanting to scream at the top of our lungs when the kids behaviour has pushed you to the end of your rope - that’s called being human.

The child was 8, she had a tantrum and was verbally and physically aggressive towards her mum. Mums partner who us also grieving the loss of his own child had a very human moment of losing his temper - he called a spoiled brat a spoiled brat - he was restrained tbh.

Honestly sounds like people forget how much more difficult badly behaved kids are to tolerate when they are not your own badly behaved but much loved child. And it sounds as if a big part of the issue is the mother is completely passive regarding the child and the partner is just meant to put up with bratty behaviour while she just lets her child behave badly.

[emilytheresponsibleone]

I'll say it again- separated parents is considered an ACE. This child isn't behaving like a securely attached, happy child, so the evidence is she isn't one.

Are there really amicable break ups, with nothing traumatic going on, that go on to have perfect co-parenting relationships? Why would those couples break up? I've never seen a case where a family has broken up in the first year of a child's life where it's been completely amicable and all roses.

This child didn't behave like a spoiled brat. She behaved like a confused, frightened child.

And no, I'd never use violent language about my children to another adult.