Page 9 | AIBU to not accept childs new name

PeskyPenguin · 2023-03-13T20:06:12+00:00

My eldest, 13 year old girl has a longish girls name with lots of options for shortening and nicknames. They told me yesterday that they are non binary and would like to be referred to as they them. Whatever, ok. Then they tell me that they want to change their name, to another long girls name. I don't get it. Surely the point of changing a name is to be less feminine? Their response is "it's just a name I like more" Well tough? Not everyone likes their name, but that is your name?? They went to a youth group night. And I said to the the leader "I'm here to collect X" and they corrected me and said their new name. So I was already miffed as I told them we need time and to think about this and to maybe test it out with friends. I don't like being corrected about my child's name at pick up. They get in the car and ask when I'm going to tell school their new name and that they can't use the female toilets or changing rooms anymore....... Help me understand or tell me I'm not going crazy to still call them their "dead name" according to them.

Moonlightdust · 13/03/2023 22:49

ScreamingInfidelities · 13/03/2023 20:09

I know it’s not PC to say so but I’m a secondary teacher and I’m so sick this absolute bullshit. It’s attention seeking nonsense.

🙌

Discofish · 13/03/2023 22:49

I think you have every right to continue to use the name you gave her. I think this term "dead name" is used far too much- you can understand it in relation to someone who physically transitioned twenty years ago and has a legal fiction on their birth certificate, so as to conceal their biological sex, because they didn't want anyone- emoloyers etc, to know they had transitioned, but today it's a completely different landscape- how many people (regardless of how they identify) actually conceal their biological sex - and if you call yourself non binary then it will be pretty bloody obvious what your biological sex is. It's just a term used in an attempt to add weight to the argument, to guilt trip etc.

Trino · 13/03/2023 22:49

YANBU buy as much time as you can with your child. Provide plenty of alternative activities, preferably outside and sporty. It might be a phase. Always remember your child is more than just non-binary or a name, so cultivate the other aspects to make this one less central and imposing.

I don't want to be alarmist but this is a dangerous slipping slop. Youth club leader with an agenda, child picking it up and going a step further after every meeting until you have a child crowdfunding to have what they call 'top surgery'.

I've being there, holding a friends hand with an autistic child that was convinced by similar path (youth club). She was lucky the leaders did not get her child a place of her own at 16 as it was suggested by them to the child. But they did help with deed pool name change. Be prepared to report them to the children's service if they keep interfering.

Nightmare2022 · 13/03/2023 22:51

Please read advice from Bayswater Support Group

This is a group of parents in same situation as you.

Leafstamp · 13/03/2023 22:52

This:

Socially transitioning other people's children is NOT a neutral act. It has a significant psychological impact on children who end up being dependent on other people's validation of their identity. As their body develops it's in opposition to what everyone around them is calling them.

Result - a fragile mentally unwell young person unable to reconcile the normal mind / body development that happens at adolescence.

It's an unethical social (and in the worst cases) medical experiment on children.

Billi80 · 13/03/2023 22:53

Weallgottachangesometime · 13/03/2023 21:08

This. I’ll call you whatever name you want. However I’d be clear that their sex remains the same regardless of how they choose to identify.

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yeah that’ll work…
13 you say? She/they will grow out of it and the more you reject it, the more fight there’ll be. Incidentally my ‘woo woo’ friends who encouraged gender fluidity from an early age, which I too found ridiculous, have turned out be the ones whose kids would never put them through this stuff.

Marchsnowstorms · 13/03/2023 22:55

MargaretThursday · 13/03/2023 21:02

Ask her if she's ever put a head into the boys' toilets at school. One day of using them will cure her of wanting to ever go in them again.

Never a truer word said. Plus where is the sanitary bin

eastegg · 13/03/2023 22:55

lordloveadog · 13/03/2023 21:04

I'd give in on the name but not the gender nonsense.

Had to call one child after that penguin on octonauts for about a year in late toddlerhood, but he got over it eventually.

Ah, Peso! I remember him (them?) well! I’m sorry but that’s hilarious. It’s the sort of thing my 5yr old would do. He’s currently working through a Spider-Man book and taking on various identities every day. Mum I’m Kraven! You can be Nova!

Doggydooda · 13/03/2023 22:56

My son was at school with a guy who really was transgender..he was literally born in the wrong body.She has now transitioned and has definitely made the right decision..She is the only person I know where hervdecision was genuine and have massive respect for her parents support.

Marchsnowstorms · 13/03/2023 22:58

@Lindy2 our local small high has a non binary teacher in a key subject. So of course it's totally normal

ArabellaScott · 13/03/2023 22:58

Doggydooda · 13/03/2023 22:56

My son was at school with a guy who really was transgender..he was literally born in the wrong body.She has now transitioned and has definitely made the right decision..She is the only person I know where hervdecision was genuine and have massive respect for her parents support.

It's literally impossible to be born in the wrong body.

MsRosley · 13/03/2023 23:02

ScreamingInfidelities · 13/03/2023 20:09

I know it’s not PC to say so but I’m a secondary teacher and I’m so sick this absolute bullshit. It’s attention seeking nonsense.

Amen.

Billi80 · 13/03/2023 23:02

ArabellaScott · 13/03/2023 22:58

It's literally impossible to be born in the wrong body.

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It is possible to have gender dysphoria though, assuming that’s what she meant.

FOJN · 13/03/2023 23:04

Doggydooda · 13/03/2023 22:56

My son was at school with a guy who really was transgender..he was literally born in the wrong body.She has now transitioned and has definitely made the right decision..She is the only person I know where hervdecision was genuine and have massive respect for her parents support.

No one is born in the wrong body. Someone may feel uncomfortable with the body they have but that doesn't make the body wrong.

Only time will tell if it's the right decision, there is evidence to suggest that a significant number of transitioners have a period of relief after transition but for many it doesn't last and they end up feeling as bad as they did pre transition but with added physical health problems.

And yes I do know a post op trans person who, after many years, still seems content with their surgical outcome but that isn't the case for many.

bridgetreilly · 13/03/2023 23:06

She’s 13, she’s going through puberty, she feels weird in her body: you need to explain that is totally normal. When she is an adult is the time to consider whether that is actually gender dysphoria. For the moment, however, she can’t legally change her name, but if she wants to pick a new, gender neutral nickname, that’s fine. She also can’t start using single sex spaces for the other sex, because that is a protected right based on sex not gender. She can’t change her sex at any point, because her body will always be female in its chromosomes and hormones, even if she later chooses to have surgery on her genitalia. You could also explain the associated health risks with messing around with hormones, puberty blockers, and surgeries. Again, her choices when she’s an adult, but not now.

MeinKraft · 13/03/2023 23:07

StephanieSuperpowers · 13/03/2023 20:33

I wonder what would happen if you also discovered your inner non binary identity, OP? I would certainly be tempted to move away from being a boring old cis mum. You could escape the ennui.

You may have found the answer to this crisis...if anything is guaranteed to make something untrendy, it's getting middle aged parents onboard

EmbracingTheEyeBags · 13/03/2023 23:08

Ohhhh my god 😳 what's happening to our kids?! The world has gone bonkers 🤪

RichardBarrister · 13/03/2023 23:10

Thisismenow2 · 13/03/2023 22:45

I get why you are cross OP and it seems (from your post) that your DD has arrived at this decision very abruptly. You should let the dust settle for a while.

What I would say though is that my DD has a class mate who announced back in Year 8 that she wished to be known as he and changed their name accordingly (to a gender neutral one) - which everyone then used (including the teachers) and they cut their hair and dressed accordingly. Their parents kicked off though and gave the school a really hard time - leading to the absurd situation that the school was forced (by parents) to use the dead name in newsletters etc even though all the child’s contemporaries knew them by their new name and they had been utterly accepted as a boy by both the boys and girls! Fast forward five years to Y13 and the DC legally changed his name as soon as he turned 18 and moved out of his parents house and is living with a cousin. Now estranged from parents who, over the course of five years, refused to accept the situation. Tread carefully OP!

The school should not have allowed this social transition in the first place.

School teachers are not qualified or authorised to diagnose such a serious mental health condition as gender dysphoria and presuppose a treatment without involvement of the parents. If the school had not let it get so far, the child could have had whatever nickname she wanted but it would not have been cemented as a male identity throughout the school.

If the child cut contact with the parents over this I suggest there were other mental health/family issues at play.

I don’t think it is helpful to worry OP with stories like that in order to pressure her to affirm this new decision by her child. Mermaids and other trans orgs threaten parents that don’t want their child to medically transition that they will commit suicide if not allowed. This is an unfounded and highly manipulative threat that goes against all Samaritans guidelines.

ChocSaltyBalls · 13/03/2023 23:11

Rachie1973 · 13/03/2023 20:22

The name thing is irrelevant really. I’d go along with that. She can change it legally at 16.

The loos etc though, I’d tell her she needs to address it with the school as she already has appropriate areas in place.

The worry is that the school may also go along with this crap

moonpixel · 13/03/2023 23:12

Doggydooda · 13/03/2023 22:56

My son was at school with a guy who really was transgender..he was literally born in the wrong body.She has now transitioned and has definitely made the right decision..She is the only person I know where hervdecision was genuine and have massive respect for her parents support.

How did you conclude this person was genuine but others are not?

MrsOvertonsWindow · 13/03/2023 23:13

Lavender14 · 13/03/2023 22:39

Thing is- I'd say the young person is socially transitioning themselves if that is how they are introducing themselves to new people, if it's what their peers are using etc. In this scenario the youth worker is only one person and I can just imagine the backlash they'd get if they decided to continue using the young persons given name. For a start Youth Work is young person led always at its core. If a young person is exploring something you go with them on that journey as a neutral person and sounding board. You're not leading them one way or the other, just encouraging them to think about who they want to be and what their values are. For example do you think Youth workers who work alongside young people who offend etc are promoting their behaviour? Do you think that giving them a good telling off would encourage that young person to engage? They accept where the child is at, set it to one side and then accept them for them. You have to tread carefully and pick your battles.

I've worked with many young people who became homeless because their parents decided this very issue was a hill to die on and the young person felt they couldn't remain in that home any longer due to the impact of being repeatedly misgendered on their mental health. The trust ended up having to place them in care- this happens a lot and I really do think that if the parents had just gone along with it in a neutral way then it wouldn't have got to that stage, those kids would still be in their homes and the family would just take time to figure each other out. An accepting parent still allows room for the young person to change their mind - it's not a matter of saying yes you are non binary and called x now forever and always, it's just saying OK that's where you're at right now I love and support you no matter who you are. That's really all ops child needs right now. They will figure the rest out for themselves as they get older. And if the op is accepting and supportive it will be easier to have discussions about it openly without the child feeling judged and easier for the op to point out potential concerns they have because the child knows their parent is still trying to meet them halfway.

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I'm sure you mean well Lavender14 but few of us are qualified in this area - it's poorly researched and what evidence there is shows that that socially transitioning is not a neutral act (see Dr Hilary Cass's interim review).

Parents are trying to navigate all this - setting boundaries that keep children / teenagers safe is what they do. They're not helped by other adults working with their children who unthinkingly undermine the parent child dynamic.

Of course parents need to handle these issues with their children with thought and care. But they're not helped by unqualified in this area adults making critical interventions without thought. The youth worker in this case openly challenged the parent - that's professional arrogance and unhelpful.

For may teenagers this will be just a fad - and it will pass. For the more vulnerable (and the data about children caught up in this with other mental health problems is frightening) socially transitioning them leaves so many of them mentally fragile with their other mental health issues being ignored.

Whatisthisanyidea · 13/03/2023 23:20

I know it’s not PC to say so but I’m a secondary teacher and I’m so sick this absolute bullshit. It’s attention seeking nonsense.

Brilliant - well said!

I would think a mother would know of their daughter was meant to be a boy from an early age -

These teens are being self serving and it’s a national disgrace that they are allowed to take away the services of those in genuine need.

And I believe it’s a cult and nowhere else would we be allowed to encourage our children to join a cult and say such crap - this is all teens talk about and someone somewhere needs to make it stop.

GemmaSparkles · 13/03/2023 23:21

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howmanybicycles · 13/03/2023 23:21

Billi80 · 13/03/2023 23:02

It is possible to have gender dysphoria though, assuming that’s what she meant.

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Thats not what she said though and we should not accept people saying things which are untrue when they have such damaging consequences. The whole concept of born in the wrong body I dangerous and no one should accept others saying it.

Agapornis · 13/03/2023 23:25

BibbleandSqwauk · 13/03/2023 20:30

There was a really great interview on radio 4 a few weeks ago, with a 19 yo girl who had detransitioned and her mum. Her mum never used her "new name". When the girl realised after about 5 years that it wasnt her sex that was preventing her being herself but other social, teen factors , she found it much easier to go back as there was still a route, a firm line. She said whilst it caused her much angst at the time, she was forever grateful that her mum and retained a sense of reality and prevented her from doing anything physical / hormonal that was damaging or irreversible.

This. It's not about the name. Teens have been talking about changing their names for many years - because it's something their parents chose for them, and they want to build their own identity.

Have you sat her down to chat about what she believes this will change? Does she feel she is limited by being a girl/women? Can you show her life is more than social and teen expectations? I know I struggled with puberty because the society I grew up in had limited expectations for women. It took me a long time to realise and break free.