To carry on applauding Gary Lineker....2 - hoping to see BBC bosses heads roll.

[Nimbostratus100]

Because he was speaking the truth and he is entitled to, without being censored.

I am delighted to see the number of other sports commentators supporting him.

Now lets see Davie resign

And yet the BBC said absolutely diddly to Sugar. And continued to air his programmes.

And heaven knows how many tweets have had to be deleted without the BBC ever expressing any concern whatsoever.

cakeorwine
This is about the use of language

In fact, John Mann (former Labour MP/chairman of the all-party group against anti-Semitism) used a similar phrase to describe Lord Sugar's tweet and Gary Lineker's tweet:
"The use of Hitler/ Nazi comparators"
"The use of Nazi comparators, by Lineker or those attacking Lineker..."

Mann publicly asked Lord Sugar to delete his tweet but not Gary Lineker.

Can you link to that please, I would like to read the wole exchange

It's about the use of language that there was in the 1930s.

I guess you don't want to engage with that.

I have seen the effect of dehumanising language.

We have people who cross the Channel in boats. People disagree with why they are coming here - but I am sure people can agree that they are people who cross the Channel. Not invaders.

The language being used is designed to stir up emotions. Use of words such as decent British patriotic people. Activist lawyers. Enemies of the people *As used by the Daily Mail to describe the courts

The language is being used for a reason. It's worked before so groups become an "outgroup" and people don't think the normal way we treat people should apply to them.

Then we can turn a blind eye to how they are treated. Detention camps. Denial of access to the courts. No claim ever allowed for asylum.

Notonthestairs
And yet the BBC said absolutely diddly to Sugar

How would you know what the BBC said to Lord Sugar about his 'offensive' tweet?
Perhaps you could fill us in with what the BBC said to Gary Lineker here;

Further action
The finding has been reported to the management of BBC Sport and discussed with Mr Lineker.

www.bbc.co.uk/contact/ecu/gary-lineker-and-twitter

The left reduce everything to simple black and white. Take national identity. Either you laugh at Britain, despise its history and think the whole idea of national identity is absurd, or you are a stupid, xenophobic right-wing nationalist. No middle ground.

They do the same with the migration crisis. Either you think every single one of these young men is fleeing ‘war and persecution’ and that we should open our doors, because mass immigration always ‘enriches’ us, or you’re a small-minded fascist bigot. Again, no middle ground. It’s a really effective technique, especially when it’s so cool to be liberal and left-wing.

I find moderate, middle of the road conservatives far more tolerant than left wing people. They are also more respectful of their opponents, more willing to listen, and more willing to change their mind. I began as a socialist, but have gradually morphed into a moderate conservative. And one of the main reasons has been my contact with left-wing people, who have frequently disappointed and even disgusted me. I find them insufferably smug, intolerant, sanctimonious, and mindless. In fact, many of them seem to me like liberal robots (or ‘lib-bots’ as I call them). Instead of thinking for themselves on each issue, they mindlessly regurgitate what they think the liberal-left viewpoint will be.

The left reduce everything to simple black and white. Take national identity. Either you laugh at Britain, despise its history and think the whole idea of national identity is absurd, or you are a stupid, xenophobic right-wing nationalist. No middle ground

Do you think you are stereotyping people with that comment? Taking a whole group of people and assigning a view to them that they all subscribe to?

That is very black and white thinking if I may say so.

Either you laugh at Britain, despise its history and think the whole idea of national identity is absurd, or you are a stupid, xenophobic right-wing nationalist. No middle ground.

No, I don't.

Either you think every single one of these young men is fleeing ‘war and persecution’ and that we should open our doors, because mass immigration always ‘enriches’ us, or you’re a small-minded fascist bigot.

Nope, don't think that either.

In fact, many of them seem to me like liberal robots (or ‘lib-bots’ as I call them).

That's not a very useful coining, is it? It's up there with 'sheeple' and 'libtards'. It's...ooh...if only I could find the words...

...smug, intolerant, sanctimonious, and mindless...

Ah, yes, Thank you. Those will do.,..

They do the same with the migration crisis. Either you think every single one of these young men is fleeing ‘war and persecution’ and that we should open our doors, because mass immigration always ‘enriches’ us, or you’re a small-minded fascist bigot. Again, no middle ground. It’s a really effective technique, especially when it’s so cool to be liberal and left-wing

Not really. I would say I am left wing - but I recognise that there are people who are fleeing countries and are seeking asylum, as well as some people who are trying to come here to work.

We need immigration but I recognise that there is a limit.

So you might be guilty yourself of binary thinking

It's easy to paint people like that though.
Just as it's easy for people to paint others as racist.

All it does is divide people.

cakeorwine
As used by the Daily Mail

I thought Gary Lineker was criticising the government - not the Daily Mail. Would he be sanctioned for criticising the Daily Mail?

It's about the use of language that there was in the 1930s
I guess you don't want to engage with that
Detention camps

I have already mentioned that I watched The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas on BBC Two last week - words such as 'evil' and 'vermin' were read out by a 12 year old character in the film.

Well the BBC has made a number of statements this week about GL and removed him from MOTD.

In comparison there wasn't any BBC statements when Sugar tweeted a photo of Corbyn in a car with Hitler, or when he tweeted his support for Johnson in the election, or the racist tweet about the Senegal football team or the multiple tweets about Mick Lynch.
Sugar has a very long track record of tweeting impartial messages.

The Boy in the striped pyjamas is set in a concentration camp in the 1940s, how is that related to GL's tweet?

The Daily Mail was my words.

I am sure you remember the headline. All part of the environment that is being created and has been for a while now.

A slippery slope.

There is a lot going on with how things are changing in politics at the moment. It's important to keep an eye out, to listen to the language and to make people aware of their rights. Which are being taken away and reduced.

Did the film have any effect on you?
Have you ever been to Auschwitz or similar camps?

I have lived in a country which has a history of 2 groups who turned on each other after having lived peacefully for ages together. Families uprooted. People murdered. Refugee camps set up. People displaced. I was 10 and remember seeing a mortar shell that had killed a child just a bit younger than me.

That had a massive effect on me. Learning about how hate grows, how people learn to hate, to not care about their neighbours, their friends.

And I have witnessed where that hate ended.

Notonthestairs
Well the BBC has made a number of statements this week about GL and removed him from MOTD

If Gary Lineker had simply deleted his tweet, then I doubt the BBC would have needed to make any statements. Lineker's 'punishment' would have been a rather embarrassing headline like this one instead;

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43604058

cakeorwine
Did the film have any effect on you?

Of course!! What sort of question is that.

You can't provide a timeline for when Sugar deleted his tweets. It might have been an hour later or weeks. Regardless it's pretty clear from the quantity of tweets Sugar has had to delete over many years that he doesn't give a fig for impartiality - he's clearly not worried about his job with the BBC.

"Hi Owen, all I’d say is the inconsistency between the Sugar/Neil (as was) position and Lineker’s when it comes to tweeting is unfair & inexplicable. This should’ve been sorted ages ago but was left to detonate. However I worked with Andrew N and he was not biased on air."

twitter.com/robburl/status/1634545549897609218?s=46&t=Uw4lJNwxFZFnX0Xs3doHYg
Rob Burley - Ex Head of BBC News programmes.

I guess you know how Germany got to that state and how an environment was created where it was allowed to happen.

It didn't just happen overnight.

If Gary Lineker had simply deleted his tweet, then I doubt the BBC would have needed to make anystatements.

If the BBC thought he had broken the guidelines, I am sure they had told him so.

People not liking his tweet is not a reason for deleting it.

Irony.🤣🤣🤣

A common theme over all of these Lineker/immigration threads seems to be people arguing against what the Daily Mail (etc) characterizes as the left wing view (when it’s usually an extreme and not widely held left wing position).

Case in point, various posters arguing vehemently against open borders while precisely no-one argues for them.

And opening that post with “the left reduce everything to simple black and white” is really quite ironic.

It doesn’t matter how much you talk about Alan Sugar, he does not have a job working for the BBC. He appears on the Apprentice, an independent production company make the programme. He does not have a talent contract with the BBC. There is a huge difference. Nobody has ever stopped GL from tweeting. It really is very boring now and a huge distraction from other important news stories.

Case in point, various posters arguing vehemently against open borders while precisely no-one argues for them

It doesn't help when Sunak says things like this:

"We know what it is: it is open-door immigration and unlimited asylum. While he may be on the side of the people smugglers, we are on the side of the British people"

"The right hon. and learned Gentleman has been on the wrong side of this issue his entire career. He described all immigration law as “racist”, he said it was a mistake to control immigration and he has never, ever voted for tougher asylum laws. It is clear that while he is in hock to the open border activists, we are on the side of the British people"

"We know why, because on this matter—he talked about his legal background—he is just another lefty lawyer standing in our way."

That's the language of this debate - and misrepresentation.

It's division

He is a high profile figure appearing in a prime time BBC show. The vast majority of people will not distinguish between the nature of his relationship with the BBC and Gary Lineker's. Neither of them are BBC employees. There really isn't a huge difference at all.