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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask what stops you voting for Labour?

1000 replies

Winniethepoohandtiggertoo · 06/03/2023 09:21

No agenda I’m just interested as Kier is on LBC this morning…

For me it’s the TWAW magical thinking, and not being convinced they would prioritise average earners, which I want to happen.

OP posts:
Florissant · 08/03/2023 16:55

EffortlessDesmond · 08/03/2023 16:54

My observation is based on a wide-ranging read of threads, and IME it is often the left-leaning posters who are quickest with the slurs. There are equally many high-principled posters on both wings who play the ball and not the player, and can agree to disagree in their opinions.

Oh, yes. Tory scum is a perennial favourite. Unimaginative but perennial.

Exasperatednow · 08/03/2023 16:59

EffortlessDesmond · 08/03/2023 16:54

My observation is based on a wide-ranging read of threads, and IME it is often the left-leaning posters who are quickest with the slurs. There are equally many high-principled posters on both wings who play the ball and not the player, and can agree to disagree in their opinions.

Whereas my observation would be the opposite. Interesting how perception and personal interpretation works.

Buzzinwithbez · 08/03/2023 17:11

Men in women's spaces.

They provided very little opposition during the pandemic. Setting aside that they would have locked us down harder, they did very little to ensure there were mitigations for those that were the most likely to be adversely affected by the pandemic choices that were made.

I won't vote Tory though.

WiIson · 08/03/2023 17:16

EffortlessDesmond · 08/03/2023 16:54

My observation is based on a wide-ranging read of threads, and IME it is often the left-leaning posters who are quickest with the slurs. There are equally many high-principled posters on both wings who play the ball and not the player, and can agree to disagree in their opinions.

I would agree with this. As someone who has been a life long labour voter, (until they threw women under a bus), the extreme level of slurs and vile behaviour does seem to generally radiate from the left. Even towards other labour members who don't fall in with the group think. The highly principled and lovely Rosie Duffield springs to mind. Which is very off-putting.

Even if they hadn't thrown women under the bus, they've turned into a party who is very difficult to align with these days because of the appalling behaviour of some.

Labour needs a very good clear out before they start on the very long path of trying to regain some credibility. Starting with Starmer.

WifeMotherWorker · 08/03/2023 17:21

Labour refuse to acknowledge what a woman is and their members are advocating the erasure of women’s rights and safety.

Florenz · 08/03/2023 17:28

Labour would win a lot more than they currently do if they just decided who they wanted to vote for them, asked them what they wanted the government to do, put that in their manifesto and then implemented it once elected.

Most of the time they come across as having a "we know best" mentality which just puts people off.

db11 · 08/03/2023 17:34

In case you missed it, Tories have been taking no advice from anybody or any organisation. They fell out with most they dealt with. advisorsbresigned after their advice was ignored. They refused to work in a cross-party way during the pandemic.

Aishah231 · 08/03/2023 17:39

Starmer puts me off!

ScrollingLeaves · 08/03/2023 17:44

WifeMotherWorker · Today 17:21
Labour refuse to acknowledge what a woman is and their members are advocating the erasure of women’s rights and safety.

They may well get elected though, so it would be worthwhile trying in advance to get the muddled law that screws up the provision of women’s sex based spaces - in order to provide a bit of a shield
www.mumsnet.com/talk/petitions_noticeboard/4758082-petition-to-update-the-equality-act-thread-3

GPTec1 · 08/03/2023 18:26

Florenz · 08/03/2023 17:28

Labour would win a lot more than they currently do if they just decided who they wanted to vote for them, asked them what they wanted the government to do, put that in their manifesto and then implemented it once elected.

Most of the time they come across as having a "we know best" mentality which just puts people off.

Whilst true, that just leads to populist policies and history tells us they don't always end well.

I want leadership, clearly defined goals, some vision and how to get there.

TBF this is missing from both parties.

I also want an end to corruption, a minister lobbying for a firm with the NHS whilst taking £1000s from said firm.

How the heck is this allowed?

IntentionalError · 08/03/2023 18:47

Sunak absolutely hammered Starmer at PMQs today. It was by far Sunak’s best performance since he became PM.
Labour seem determined to fall into the trap that the government has set for them. By opposing laws intended to ‘stop the boats’, Labour are positioning themselves on the wrong side of white working class voters in places like Mansfield, Stoke & Hartlepool which the party desperately needs to win back if it is going to win the next election. Starmer sounded like the candidate of Islington based Guardian readers today, which is exactly where the Tories want him to be.

IcakethereforeIam · 08/03/2023 18:48

Them putting Eddie Izzard on a poster for international women's day.

twitterexile · 08/03/2023 19:32

Them putting Eddie Izzard on a poster for international women's day

Tell me they didn't put Suzie/Eddie on a poster for IWD...surely not?

Dammitthisisshit · 08/03/2023 19:36

@IcakethereforeIam no way! They didn’t did they? Surely not?

twitterexile · 08/03/2023 19:36

I have just seen it. They actually did. I am fucking speechless with rage. I will NEVER vote Labour ever again.
How fucking DARE they?

ReneBumsWombats · 08/03/2023 19:37

I can't find this poster. Could someone link?

twitterexile · 08/03/2023 19:37

It was the LGBT Labour account but EI is not a woman.

twitter.com/LGBTLabour/status/1633450878668623876

BreadInCaptivity · 08/03/2023 19:39

IcakethereforeIam · 08/03/2023 18:48

Them putting Eddie Izzard on a poster for international women's day.

I think really plays to just how tone deaf the LP is right now (especially in light of recent events in Scotland).

As many posters have already commented a prevailing narrative of "we know best" and if you don't agree with us then "you are nasty/selfish/out of touch/a bigot etc" is really unpleasant and I rarely see this form of attack thrown from right to left.

Labour should be my natural comfy political home as a long time left of centre voter (as a former member it was for a long time). But right now it resembles a wasteland of tumbleweed filled with sink holes.

As I've posted on other threads, when myself and a number of women (long standing members left the party) over self id what did they do? Engage in discussion? Consider the impact that the women leaving were actually doing a lot of the party legwork in terms of canvassing/CLP admin (as opposed to "likes" on social media).

No, they threw a bloody party to celebrate our departure.

Ultimately voters go to the ballot box on the basis of self interest. Even if that self interest is a sense of moral superiority in voting for policies/ideals that might not be to their overall advantage.

The LP continually seem to think their job is not to listen to the electorate, but to educate them.

Moreover educate them in the middle class utopian political ideals that pay no regard to the experiences of many, many voters and then are "shocked" when the push back is that they are out of touch.

Parties who celebrate the loss of former loyal party members don't deserve an easy ride back nor the votes of many people for whom they deem their aspirations selfish.

It's a bloody shame as we need an effective opposition and I would like to see the Tories out of power - but I won't vote for a party that not only seeks to erode women's rights, but celebrates their achievements in doing so and rubs it in our faces by gaslighting us about why Eddie is a person to champion on IWD.

twitterexile · 08/03/2023 19:41

Excellent post Bread

BreadInCaptivity · 08/03/2023 20:02

twitterexile · 08/03/2023 19:41

Excellent post Bread

Thank you.

Just to add, it's interesting comparing the traction this thread has vs its opposition (what stops you voting Conservative

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/amiibeingunreasonable/4757573-to-ask-what-stops-you-voting-for-the-tories)

MN is generally IME left of centre in terms of its contributing posters.

You would expect the other thread to have hit 1k by now for all the reasons why most left wing women can garner for not ticking the blue box). But no....the activity is all here about why so many of us won't vote Labour.

That's very telling...

Icandothattoo · 08/03/2023 20:25

Interesting thread.
@BreadInCaptivity as a left of centre voter what policies appeal to you ? what good things have they done to make you want to vote for another 5 years ? I was under the impression that the government have adopted many of labour's suggestions so I'm puzzled that you think the LP doesn't listen. As a left wing voter what's your opinion on plans to leave the ECHR ? The upcoming legislation on the small boats issue ? Corruption. NHS. The list goes on...

BreadInCaptivity · 08/03/2023 20:28

Icandothattoo · 08/03/2023 20:25

Interesting thread.
@BreadInCaptivity as a left of centre voter what policies appeal to you ? what good things have they done to make you want to vote for another 5 years ? I was under the impression that the government have adopted many of labour's suggestions so I'm puzzled that you think the LP doesn't listen. As a left wing voter what's your opinion on plans to leave the ECHR ? The upcoming legislation on the small boats issue ? Corruption. NHS. The list goes on...

I don't understand your question.

It's not clear whose policies you are suggesting would appeal.

I've made many posts on this thread and I think my position has been made very clear.

beguilingeyes · 08/03/2023 20:40

Sunak's new lectern has disgusted me today. It might as well say 'Dogwhistle'.
He keeps saying that this is a priority. I'm more worried about paying my gas bill than a few people in boats.
They could solve the problem with cooperation from the French, but that would leave them nothing to campaign on.
Braverman is foul.

GPTec1 · 08/03/2023 21:39

twitterexile · 08/03/2023 19:37

It was the LGBT Labour account but EI is not a woman.

twitter.com/LGBTLabour/status/1633450878668623876

Who to vote for ? Seems both parties are tone deaf too or do we only look at Labour?

As we celebrate this day, it is important to acknowledge that the definition of "woman" must be inclusive and intersectional. This means recognising and honouring the experiences of all women, including those who are transgender Trans women face significant discrimination and violence, both within the LGBT+ community and in wider society. They often experience heightened levels of discrimination and exclusion from social, economic, and political opportunities due to their gender identity

It is crucial that the feminist movement embraces an intersectional approach to gender justice that recognises and addresses the intersecting forms of oppression that women face, including racism, ableism, homophobia, and transphobia. We must center the experiences and voices of trans women in our conversations about gender equality, and ensure that their rights are protected and upheld

On International Women's Day, let us commit to standing in solidarity with all women, including trans women, and fighting for a world where everyone can live free from discrimination and oppression. Only by centreing the experiences of all women can we truly achieve gender justice and equality for all

www.lgbtconservatives.org.uk/news/pride-and-politics-february-newsletter

OMG12 · 08/03/2023 21:54

GPTec1 · 08/03/2023 21:39

Who to vote for ? Seems both parties are tone deaf too or do we only look at Labour?

As we celebrate this day, it is important to acknowledge that the definition of "woman" must be inclusive and intersectional. This means recognising and honouring the experiences of all women, including those who are transgender Trans women face significant discrimination and violence, both within the LGBT+ community and in wider society. They often experience heightened levels of discrimination and exclusion from social, economic, and political opportunities due to their gender identity

It is crucial that the feminist movement embraces an intersectional approach to gender justice that recognises and addresses the intersecting forms of oppression that women face, including racism, ableism, homophobia, and transphobia. We must center the experiences and voices of trans women in our conversations about gender equality, and ensure that their rights are protected and upheld

On International Women's Day, let us commit to standing in solidarity with all women, including trans women, and fighting for a world where everyone can live free from discrimination and oppression. Only by centreing the experiences of all women can we truly achieve gender justice and equality for all

www.lgbtconservatives.org.uk/news/pride-and-politics-february-newsletter

Ffs - they even hijack today.

it’s not fucking “crucial” to embrace this shit.

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