Is threatening illegal immigrants going to stop them coming?

[LadyGAgain]

Channel migrants face lifetime ban on returning to UK www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64848101

I read this with horror. I know we are a tiny island with limited resources but this legislation seems callous and cruel. These people are risking their very existence getting on these small boats and to then be locked up and shipped off again to who knows where. Plus the cost to us as tax payers. AIBU to suggest that I don't have a solution but this one seems extreme.

It is a huge problem, and understandably the EU, Australia, Türkiye, the USA and so on have to work out the best way to handle this issue.

So what the UN or other individual countries need to look at is, where are there systems/countries that handle it well? Is there currently a "best practice" example that can be used by other countries?

Obvs no two countries are the same, so there are further complications. But humans are resourceful and clever and we should be able to work this out.

I don't think the historical issues of Empire should or could be ignored here either. Perhaps it might boil down to, in some cases, building infrastructure with the governments of the countries/areas people are fleeing?

The issue of how to look after "our own" is not entirely, but largely separate. The UK economy could do both, if it were properly managed.

I know from personal observation that they will not play ball with the endless form filling system. If they got rejected, they would do anything (including making up new names, qualifications and DOBs) and apply again. Ultimately, they would still take those boats and come.
It would not change the costs incurred on the ground and massively increase the costs of pen pushers. There is a mindset prevalent that actions speak louder than words. They will break the law and expect the law to accommodate them afterwards. there are always the sob stories about illness and poverty (impossible to properly verify in most cases).
I am not saying that I know what the solution is. I just know that we are a distance away from finding one.

This💯

Surzy

”So basically you want us to wash our hands of helping people and leave it to other countries?

the only way to stop people coming in on small boats and similar is to set up proper channels to apply and be processed before entering the country. Cut off the need for them to use traffickers in the first place”

👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

With the best will in the world we cannot relocate the entire 3rd world into the UK

40k migrants crossed the channel last year, hardly the entire developing world is it?

Increasing tax isn't the answer - Astra Zeneca is moving to Eire because the rate of Corporation Tax is more inviting. Hunt has refused to reduce that tax because to do so would require more borrowing

Truss caused much of the financial (borrowing costs) problems in the UK and AZ moved to ROI because of the NHS drugs pricing policies for companies inside the UK, this is exactly what their CEO has said, tax rates can change and of course the ROI is IN the EU's SM and CU - a huge draw as Sunak has correctly pointed out with his new deal for NI.

I think people have forgotten that we are still paying off the costs of the Covid Pandemic which stood at an eyewatering £334 billion

Would have been far less if there hadn't so much fraud, e.g Furlough, PPE & business support loans.

Yeah, but there's immigrants being put up in luxury spa hotels and even getting three meals a day. Meanwhile the rest of us can't find 🍅 in the shops. Even if we could find them, we can't afford them.

If we can send the small boat people to Rwanda, or lock them up or send them back to where they came from, then food prices would go down. Our NHS would start working properly again. Energy costs would decrease. I don't understand why people don't want this.

The voice of sensible reason at last.

MrsSkylerWhite - And where do you suggest these centres are set up? France, Spain, Germany?

I very much doubt they’re doing anything about it, they’re just after the votes. Due to there being very few genuine asylum seekers, I’d send them straight back & tell them I’d let them know if they’re successful. There’s people here who’re struggling, no one’s bothered about them.

Not the same at all in most cases.

We are massively overpopulated. Try living in any working class Northern town- the services and investment is just not there as there is too much demand. The same people defending this are no doubt the same to complain when they can’t get a GP appointment and the like.

If they are coming from France then they are not in danger.

IClaudine - Immigration has got nothing to do with food costs or fuel prices. The temporary shortage of cucumbers and tomatoes is because of extreme weather conditions from the countries we import them from which meant there were less crops than previous years. Also fuel prices are because of the war in Ukraine as well as greedy suppliers who want more and more profit.

I agree that an increase in population whether by immigration or birth rate does put more strain on resources like NHS and housing, schools etc.

The tory government isn't bothered about them. Big difference.

About 70% of asylum seekers get their application approved so that would prove that the majority of asylum seekers are genuine which goes completely against your premise that there are very few genuine seekers and they should all be sent back.

Well said. You can see how low the bar the government is trying to pander to from some of the ignorant posts on here.

@IClaudine "Yeah, but there's immigrants being put up in luxury spa hotels and even getting three meals a day. Meanwhile the rest of us can't find 🍅 in the shops. Even if we could find them, we can't afford them.

If we can send the small boat people to Rwanda, or lock them up or send them back to where they came from, then food prices would go down. Our NHS would start working properly again. Energy costs would decrease. I don't understand why people don't want this."

The shortages of fruit and veg are because of 3 issues: reduced production across EU due to energy costs, reduced output due to weather and increased costs to supply U.K. due to the distance across the channel and the extra bureaucracy introduced by Brexit. Nothing at all to do with immigration.

The NHS is another multi factor issue, predominantly caused by an increase aging population and lack of social care funding/services. Not immigration.

I can't even begin to conceptualise why you think energy costs would decrease if we reduced immigration. Energy costs are high globally, in the U.K. the biggest difference we could make would be to produce our own energy, something the government has failed to do over the last 12 years through either nuclear, wind, solar or tidal forms.

Realistically, the only way to deter them would be a marked cultural shift towards hostility and a discriminatory removal of rights (as seen in France) which would make the UK unappealing. Before anyone says it, many of our immigrants are from former French colonies and speak French so they are not all wanting to come here because English is familiar to them. Any, yes, many have family here but only because they boated in a few years earlier and got to stay. it isn't the same as having established roots.

Watching this item on the news recently, I observed the graph showing how effectively asylum Seekers' applications had been processed (and those rejected deported) since 2010. The line plummeted faster than Liz Truss's popularity.

The only explanation can be the cutting of resources to dealing with asylum claims by the government since 2010...

My government? My generation aren't in power yet, so fuck all to do with "my governments".

It is your governments that have failed to keep their end of the bargain becuase your generation didn't hold them to account. It doesn't matter what as "sold to the people" 60 years ago, it has been apparent for decades that the UK would face an aging population crisis. And it was clear to anyone with half a brain that that model of the next generation funding the old age care of the previous generation would only work if there was constant economic and population growth.

We're now at the stage where the next generation is significantly poorer than the previous generation, yet the previous generation still expect to be funded for life because that was what "was sold to the people". It's not my generation's problem you chose to ignore all these problems on the horizon, yet you seem to think we should be the one's to bail you out.

As for what the plan for all these "useless eaters" is? Well, I think legendary Sanitation Commissioner Ray Patterson said it best "It's so gratifying to leave you wallowing in the mess you've made. You're screwed. Thank you. Bye."

I'm not in the UK. Not my mess.

But whatever. You are in a mess and you're keen to blame everyone else and show utter disdain for the older generations. FFS. Grow up

@FoxFeatures Let's look at how many countries Britain has invaded over the years. Then let's think about how those countries were affected and still are, due to empire building. The effects are still being felt today. We have a responsibility to help out as we are benefiting, even today, from our history.

Hmm, strange.

I don't recall UK ever invading and pillaging Iran, Eritrea, Somalia, Albania, Poland and the rest of Eastern Europe ? 🤔

Simon Clarke, the genius MP who supported Truss, has pretty much come out an said they know this will be a legal non-starter and it's really just an attempt to galvanise support to leave the EHCR.

He also said that like it was a good thing. Like this was a clever stategy.

@Mamamia7962 I think you have misunderstood my post! I was taking the piss out of people who fall for the anti-immigrant rhetoric.

People are NOT paying money to be trafficked FFS

The logic that making something illegal more illegal will solve the problem is how we ended up with the never ending "war on drugs". In fact, it's so patently obvious that it can't work that it can only be supported by the people who benefit from it.

Oh god, was I too convincing?