To think this is bats**t crazy? Don’t know what to do

[Puddingypops]

My DS is 14 and in year 9, his girlfriend from school is 13 and in year 8, they were born in the same year (2009) and there is 7 months age gap between them. She is also FAR more mature than my son, because she’s a girl!

apparently if now you go out with someone in the year below you are a none and pe*o and every other foul name under the son.

my lad is getting the most vile abuse at school but I don’t even know what to do because it’s everyone, in every year group and it’s constant, being shouted at in corridors, voice messages to his phone saying he’s weird and should be locked up, people approaching him at school and saying what he is doing is wrong.

I checked with other kids in other schools and it’s true there too?!?!? When the hell did this happen? When I was at school girls went out with boys in the year above!

Ive spoken to my lad about what he wants to do because he can’t stand the bullying, he’s gone from being really popular to a total pariah in 3 months.

I agree. Dd is year 8. Very few of the yr 8 children have girlfriends/boyfriends. The ones that do are basically just friendships. Don't kiss, hold hands and don't see each other outside school. There is no way in hell I would be allowing my year 8 dd to be going round to a year 9 boyfriends house to spend time alone in his bedroom, whether the door was open or not. I'm not saying your ds has done anything wrong BTW, just that from what I know of my yr 8 and my friend's yr8s in other schools is would be out if the ordinary.

If, as you say, they are just friends, didn't your our ds just tell his mates that. If he'd framed it as them bring mates there wouldn't be all this trouble

I agree with a lot of the PPs here.
You need to take this up with the school as they are bullying and harassing him.
It was quite normal at school for people to go out with each other in different years.
Clearly attitudes have changed.
Maybe the bully’s are all jealous….I’d tell your son that.

I really worry about what the world will be like when the kids are adults, they’re such puritans. Hope you manage to get it sorted OP, I’d be discussing it with the school.

@Sisisimone would you let her go to the house of a boy friend? Or a girl friend? Because either of those could easily be a boyfriend or girlfriend they haven't told you about.

"Even one week end of august to the beginning of september still means they older is a year ahead, not a week older."

So eloquently put. Were you put down a year by any chance?

I was only in secondary 13 years ago and it was considered a bit weird to date out of your year group back then even. It's obviously not but it just wasn't really the done thing. I think when you're in year-groups it seems like there's more of a gap between you than there is. Anyway, the name-calling is unacceptable but an assembly will probably make it worse because everyone will know it's about him.

When I was at school, year 8 was "prep school" and year 9 was "senior school" - and it would have been completely inappropriate for them to be dating.

Even now, there are areas of the country with a three-tier system where a year 8 would still be in middle school - so I can understand why people feel it's inappropriate, even though age-wise they're only a few months apart.

That said, it doesn't mean the behaviour towards your son is appropriate.

Poor boy. That's awful

Yes, the 21yr old (to my 18) was very nice. He never pressured me for sex and we didn’t do anything more than ‘heavy petting’ (remember that phrase) for the first four months. This was years ago. Everything today just seems so toxic. I’m glad I grew up in the 70s. Today’s weirdness in so many areas would f*ck with my head too much.

Ok, op…there are a number of issue going on with your tennants and I think you need to address them directly with them

I’d ask to have a meeting with them. First of all say how much you’ve appreciated them as tenants and that by and large you are very happy with how they are using the property and their responsibilities towards the house.
There are now a few issues that have been building up and causing potential problems and “damage” to the property that you need to discuss with them.

1. You will be requiring a new tenancy agreement to be signed that contains clauses about the garden maintenance and dog . - have this to hand and give them copies at end of conversation saying they obviously need to read and then come back with any queries in 2 weeks time (for instance) and the new tenancy will be needed to be signed before (say) next months rent due.
2. the new garden clause will reinstate as it was before, that you “let go” and now know is giving issues in terms of amount of work that will be needed to get it back to state it was at start of tenancy (you need to have good evidence of what state was at that time). Right now, you are having to maintain garden yourself at your cost for a gardener which was never the original agreement and you rather naively thought it would be ok to remove the clause and they’d step up of their own volition. As they haven’t which is fair given you remov3d the clause) you now need them to Either do it themselves, pay for gardener themselves or pay you increased rent for the cost of your gardener. Point out that the garden was in original tennacy and is standard (despite what people are saying here) that tennants are responsible for garden maintenance- specify what maintenance is exactly: . Mowing, weeding, cutting back. Their choice as to how they want to approach but doing nothing but allowing it to over grow is not an option . If they say they’ll take it on then go outside with them and show them- ideally have a written clause in contract or ano piece of paper to state what is expected (within reason ) that they need to do. They cannot be expected to do heavy labour, pruning (they might not be gardeners and therefore could do more damage), but sweeping, mowing to a length of maximum of 4 inches at all times, edging, and weeding is entirely reasonably. But, it is also reasonable you pay for gardener to get it back to condition you want firs, that they then go on to maintain , given you dropped the clause.
3. the new dog clause will be put in to stipulate how the house must be managed wrt to dog. This includes that dog waste MUST never be left in house or garden. That is a health issue and can be reported as bad neighbour issues to environmental health so is utterly unacceptable. All dog waste must be removed to appropriate dog waste bin immediately. It must not be put unwrapped into your domestic bins (council will not replace dirty bins for next tennant even if health hazard). There must be no waste left in the house at any time. Any damage to the house OR garden by the dog is not considered “normal wear and tear” and they need to pay for replacements/repairs themselves. (E.g if dog pees on carpet they must pay for cleaning and if you’re not satisfied they pay for replacement, similarly scratches to doors, if dog damages lawn over time for. Digging, scrapping and weeding then they’ll need to cover cost of reseeding and repair, etc) . This needs to be spelled out in tenancy agreement and they must sign it if they keep dog and tenancy . You will require an increased deposit to be paid for the dog being there to cover any waste removal at end of tenancy, carpet cleaning and repair of any dog damage in the house or garden. This is entirely fair. I know tennants who have to pay extra rent each month now for a pet fgs. I don’t believe that is fair, but do believe an additional deposit is fair and entirely sensible. It will need to be substantial if damage is done to lawn, house etc that they don’t repair properly.
4. You held off against rent increases in line with government requests during pandemic. You will be increasing rent over next 3 years to bring it in line with interest rate and market rental values. This year the rent will increase by 5%, at the maximum the government suggest as responsible landlord. This is in addition to an additional increase for the gardener if they choose not to take that on themselves. There will then be further increases over next year and beyond

i do suspect though, that they will try to move - may not be immediately, but they’re probably staying becuase of lower rent. They’d be idiots not too. But the fact they’re happy for garden to be overgrown, dog shit left outside, doesn’t make me think they’re people who actually take much pride in where they live and “it’s just a house “ to them. That’s not an issue, entirely fair for rental, but I suspect they have far less loyalty to you than you to them. Their loyalty is probably down to what they pay and convenience of being close to where they need to be.

Your relationship, if they stay, won’t be where it was. You will be giving up some trust towards them to stipulate these things- which isn’t nice for you and certainly not for them. Trust is reciprocal , so they will trust you less and deem you more money grabbing. However, I really think if they’d done a good job on garden, were being super careful with dog, you’d be looking to minimise rental increases anyway to keep them as tenants form heaven.

It is not on and should stop.

But also @Puddingypops if it encourages him and other boys not to date younger (even if only the year below) girls at this age, then that's no bad thing.

Ok if 7 months younger is too young, what do you think the acceptable amount of months is? Is 5 months ok? Or 1?

Ok, wrong post🤦‍♀️🤷🏼‍♀️🙄
god knows how that happened 🤣🤦‍♀️🤣🤣

I know hahahaha it was so long too! Poor you lol

Where I am yr 8 is middle school and yr 9 high school so massive difference.

Imo kids of that age shouldn't be having boyfriends/girlfriends.

That’s crazy
I would ask to sit down with the head

I would ask them to educate the children about defamation and the seriousness of accusations like that

not sure what else but off that’s normal note schools sound horrible and I’ll give educate again come secondary

Im now more concerned by the amount of people talking about the maturity levels of a 13 year old girl as a way of justifying age gaps. That is something you need to think right through.

Totally agree with this. Girls are seen as more mature because behaviour that wouldn’t be tolerated in a girl in nursery is indulged in men long into adulthood. The other reason is of course, it lets men off the hook for noncey behaviour. Men can shag kids if they are suitable “mature”. Look how mature those kids in Rotherham were painted as. A y8 girl hanging out with older pupils, drinking and vaping, going into boyfriends bedroom etc sounds vulnerable, not mature.

How about in this scenario?

say your daughter is in year 8 middle school, but for the last 2 years she has gone regularly with you to a very wholesome out of school activity, quite a professional one that requires hours and hours of dedication and practice. There she meets a boy who you also meet, and meet his parents, they are both 12 you spend a load of time with the boy, and his parents simply because you all have to stick around during the activity.

when they are both 13 they are selected to partner in a high profile event, lots of reversal together and over the 3 month rehearsal time become very close friends she tells you she wants to ask him out. He won’t ask her because even though he likes her he’s scared of being bullied at school because of how it’s viewed. So she asks him out.

do you still think it’s totally wrong?

Oh my GOD. Why is the word mature now about sexual maturity?

mature is about being more sensible

And I said she had tried those things, she’s not vulnerable, why are you painting my son to be a predator? Gid help young men and
boys these days, truly god help them, when a respectful and kind boy like my son is being painted as a villain by adult women.

I wouldn’t be cool with a year 8 going round to a year 9 boyfriends house.

But this is ridiculous, the words ‘paedo’ and ‘nonce’ are completely over used and unhelpfully.

I didn’t say screaming voicemails, I said voice notes and I heard them mainly from girls in his year and year 8 saying “I’m sorry we don’t care that you’re 13 and she’s 13 it’s weird and you’re a nonce you should be in prison”

Totally unacceptable. All of these messages need to be sent to the Head Teacher and they need to be suspended, and only allowed back to school when they apologise and on a final warning that any such further comments will mean being expelled.

My Year 11 ds thinks the same, though I have tried to educate him about it. Teens can be so judgemental.

Your poor ds. I'd talk to the school.

What about summer-born children whose school entry was deferred? Where do they fit in under these 'rules'?

Obviously can't date anyone in their year, because they're older than everyone else. But cross-year dating isn't 'allowed', so can't date anyone in the year above, either, even though they're probably older than some of them.

What if a deferred Yr8 dates a Yr9 who is six weeks younger? Which one is the 'paedo'?

People can ask out whoever they want to ask out. That doesn't mean other people have to agree with it or find it appropriate.

Like PP - where I grew up, Year 8 and Year 9 students went to different types of school and it would have been seen to be totally inappropriate for them to date, even if they were only a few weeks/months apart age-wise.

That of course doesn't mean your son is a bad person who is doing something morally wrong, but I can see why other children find it uncomfortable.