Childfree people ranting about parents

[the7Vabo]

Came across a thread on another site full of people ranting about children entitled “parents not everything is about you.” I get it to a point, as a parent I think society has become somewhat a overly child-centred. I assume however that the odd stories you see about parents demanding people give up train seats for ten year olds are just that, the odd story of unreasonable behaviour that people in all groups can be guilty of.

The extent of the comments on that thread baffled me. Full of I’m so glad I don’t have children because X, Y. It’s one thing to want to be child free which to me is a perfectly valid life choice, but I’m baffled by the level of bitching about parents & children. If someone wants to be child free why can’t they simply be child free & accept that others didn’t make that choice instead of ranting about how parents are always on at them about how fulfilled they are while at the same time ranting about how terrible it would be to have kids.

Well according to @Cosyblankets it's our own fault if we happen to end up around people who say offensive things anyway 🙄

If someone could point me to the all women, mixed race and POC only, disabled people only, childfree/childless workplace then sign me up!!!! Otherwise apparently its my own fault for any ableist, sexist, racist, digs about being childless etc comments that come my way for not "surrounding myself with better people".

So yeah some people on this thread might read the experiences but they don't give a shit about them

This is the point though

You made a dig about childless women daring to book holiday in the school holiday and its turns out its based on something one woman did once.

If a woman with grown children, and no grandchildren (aka didn't need childcare) had done it you would have said it was because she was being mean or whatever

But because a childless woman did it you labelled all childless women petty, flexible and having ugly behaviour

This is the shit we are complaining about. And when childless people say something bad about parents as a whole we get threads like this berating us. But you are showing the exact same behaviour

If this is your experience, then there are far greater issues between those colleagues (which as a manager you should also be aware of??) – absolutely no one takes holidays during half term for the sole reason of pissing off parents. If they are, perhaps ask yourself why. Has this person been discriminated against by co-workers / management for not having children (expected to pick up slack, work late etc) and is a bit sick of it?

This was certainly the case at my previous two places of work – parents were allowed to leave early, arrive late, work from home etc with not so much as an eyelid being batted by management. Childless/childfree employees were expected to work around this, pick up slack, and were certainly not afforded the same flexibility. The message, loud and clear, was that having children was 'more important' than anything that could possibly be going on in the lives of someone who was childless/childfree. It hugely devalues that person's existence and is insulting.

Logically though why would parents' 'hate and despise' people that are childfree. I'm not suggesting that being told what you are missing out on is acceptable but actually, parents as they are responsible for the children that behave in a way that is unacceptable in a gallery, a pub, a restaurant, the cinema, a park (even) etc. take your pick, are surely more open to judgement and hate because there are more reasons to use as the hater is not only hating your individual actions as an inadequate parent, they are also casting judgment on the individuals you are responsible for. Therefore, the occurrences to hate someone for their actions are increased! Even the PP asked why I am expecting them to shoulder my parental responsibilities of childcare in the holidays and didn't I think about all this before I had children, they are not just criticising me they are criticising the person I had a child with and perhaps even the child for existing and having needs! Not suggesting the poster hates children but my point is there are more opportunities to criticise and judge.

I think there is lots of dickinesa on both sides, but there is group of mainly mother in my experience who are very "oh no poor you withoit meaning in life" type. Problem is, these are the loud ones.
But they are loud because it's their whole personality. Mummyof4♥️, Stayathomemummy #lovemykids on bio and have literally no other interest in anything and anyone.
Same like with some childfree who also make it their personality.

People saying they never were made to feel less. It's everywhere. If I die no one will give a fuck because "a woman died" will not read in newspapers as well as "mum of 3 died". One is meh, one is "awwww". We are daily reminded our lives don't matter much.
Holidays at work, needing to do extra time because we don't have school elvent, the aforementioned article examples, bending our time to friends with children, never allowed to be tired, are unnatural, sad, unfulfilled, without love in our lives.
There are everywhere subtle suggestions we don't matter really.

@Prinnny I see you are judging why people want to take annual leave.

I think this is inevitable for big things like weddings. But I personally do not always want to say what I am planning on my annual leave. Private life should be allowed to be private life.

Even the PP asked why I am expecting them to shoulder my parental responsibilities of childcare in the holidays and didn't I think about all this before I had children, they are not just criticising me they are criticising the person I had a child with and perhaps even the child for existing and having needs!

Erm, no I absolutely wasn't doing that. I also wasn't talking specifically about you. I don't even know you, nor do I work with you.

@ConfusedNT sorry to ruin your narrative but I would say anyone who is inconsiderate towards others is petty and selfish regardless if they children, grown or young.

If you read it as a dig maybe you need to look at your own behaviours and actions as it was simply a factual description of an event.

The attitude demonstrated by yourself and others shows why some childless women have the reputation they have.

As a manager though if two people want the same time off and aren’t willing to compromise and I have to make the decision I need to know why to make that decision. If you aren’t willing to share why, with myself or HR, then that is fine but it may not support your case.

And what's that reputation? Or are you just judging others by the actions of your "petty" employee?

It’s one thing to want to be child free which to me is a perfectly valid life choice, but I’m baffled by the level of bitching about parents & children. If someone wants to be child free why can’t they simply be child free & accept that others didn’t make that choice instead of ranting about how parents are always on at them about how fulfilled they are while at the same time ranting about how terrible it would be to have kids.

Unless you ARE child-free, you just don't notice how cruel and judgemental public opinion is about women who don't have children. It is relentless. And even worse if you dare to be a single, childless woman.

You may as well be ducked for a witch.

We are expected to give up our seats for someone else's precious darling, jump out of the way when they scoot or cycle on the pavement.

We are expected to nod along with the idea that "You don't know what real love is".

We are meant to retreat silently to commune with our cats.

We are meant to put up with other people's children disturbing our meals in public restaurants - even throwing up all over us (see a thread from last night).

We are expected to give way at any public event or attraction "Oh, it's for the kiddies."

We are expected to pay for keeping them healthy and educating them, but mut be grateful that they might grow up to be people who will contribute to the community. But we can't know that - the PFBs of MN may well all become drug addicts & thieves. But we're expected to be grateful to parents for having children who will "look after you in your old age" so I'm regularly told.

I love kids - I have many nieces & nephews and I have adored them since their births.

But YABU.

Applesandcarrots, is that true about if you die as a woman without children it unnoticed or not reported on in the press, sadly there are some very much reported cases of murdered childless women fairly recently and there has always been interest in that kind of story.

As PP have said – annual leave should be allocated on a first come first served basis. If people need to work on major holidays, this should be allocated on a rotating basis, regardless of whether the employee is a parent or not. There is absolutely no need for management to be making value judgements on whether parents "deserve" annual leave during half term more than childless/childfree employees. Nor should there any need for employees to make a case as to why they deserve annual leave when they request it.

I did not say it was your fault. You reeled off a list of things that have happened. I pointed out that not one single thing like this has happened to me. You seem to be very unlucky

If I die no one will give a fuck because "a woman died" will not read in newspapers as well as "mum of 3 died". One is meh, one is "awwww". We are daily reminded our lives don't matter much.

Yes @Applesandcarrots

I have a rather thick sister-in-law who is sooooooo proud her sons will "carry on the family name" - well it's my family name, not hers, frankly. And I think I'll be the one to carry the name on in reality, as I've published more books than she's had sons.

I do get that society and others do unfairly judge, but I mean all of us have been child free, most of us adults so do understand what it's like as we have also experienced it. Also entitled parents and children are annoying to most people, again not a unique experience to child free people. The majority of parents don't believe the world revolves around them

Blimey

And we have to put up with their screaming in the garden because its just kids being kids but then get a load of crap if we dare to want to play music in our garden on very low volume

Or be told to go live in the middle of nowhere if we don't want to have to put up with listening to the kid having multiple ear splitting tantrums everyday cos the walls aren't insulated enough

fitzwilliamdarcy, you literally responded to my post with your position on how you see it, why wouldn't apply to me, I'm a parent?

@backoftheplane we don’t do it that way, we have a ward meeting when we all sit and pick our weeks, so any crossovers can be discussed and compromises made. If it was a first come first served that would put colleagues on leave or different shifts at a disadvantage as they weren’t around to put their name down. It has worked well for decades, the team feel it is the fairest way.

That is because absolutely unusual circumstances.
If I just drop dead at home no one will care because it doesn't make for clicks. Because people don't care unless there is an extra layer to the story. That's the reason why articles, outside of unusual circumstances, are titled "loving mum of x died at home". If I die in the same bog standard circumstances there would be no "loving wife/woman died at home".
Well it would be if I lied here 2 years and then they found me. But again, that's the unusual circumstance.
It also goes for men to an extent. Lots of men die daily but unless it's unusual it doesn't appear. But "dad of 4 battled cancer" will.

Sorry for brutal examples. It's just hard to otherwise show the difference.

The one thing I don't get is that a lot of child free people seem to forget that every parent was child free at some point (if with young children then not all that long ago!) So it's not as though they have nothing to compare to when talking about either the positives or negatives of parent hood compared to non parents

For me it has been mostly a positive and the love I feel for my child is very different to anything I felt beforehand

I know that's not the entire point of the OP but I just wanted to say as I feel so many people forget that every parent knows what being a non parent is like while not every non parent can understand what it's like to have children

P.s I was someone who never wanted children and probably wouldn't ever have had them if it wasn't for my pill failing 🙃 I'm sure I would have still been happy with that choice but I wouldn't have appreciated what I was missing and I'm glad things worked out the way they did

I don't agree most of us have been childfree so understand what it is like. Most women are treated as if they will be mothers until about forties. That is when people realise you are probably never going to have a child. Until then they assume even if you say you do not want children, that you will change your mind.

They made headlines because they were young. I guarantee you the death of a middle aged childless woman wouldn’t cause much of a stir.

Nobody loves their pet as much as your average decent parent loves their child. They don’t; no matter what they say. They might think they do because they have nothing to compare it to, but whenever I read somebody asserting they love their dog as much as people love their kids I roll my eyes and laugh.