To pull away from my close friendship because of her kids

[abouttimeforu]

My close friendship is with my sister. We are extremely close. My child can be very challenging , currently waiting on ASD assessment , attention seeking and has a hard time managing his anger although this has improved greatly .
My child struggles socially and doesn't have many friends.
He is also so kind and loving, very sensitive , thoughtful and funny He is 11.

My sister's two children are by and large, rude and moody. Their mother will often put this down to tiredness and hunger but reality is they are actually just rude and moody, mostly

They will engage with my child when there's no other option but if there are other kids around, they will practically ignore him.
So for example if we were grouping up for an activity, they will purposely say that they want to do x with 'Jen' and completely omit to mention my child's name or include him.
Despite him being the only one left out.
My sister does not intervene or correct them. I would be disgusted if my kids did this and very ashamed tbh.

Her attitude is that they don't have to socialise with people they don't want to socialise with .... until they have no one else and then ask to socialise with my
Child .He has been too available .. my fault.

To me he seems only good enough for them as a stand in but tbh I'm highly sensitive about this issue and biased.
I am very protective of himSo at times I am guilty of overthinking and over reacting when it comes to how I view his interactions with others , when In fact, he is absolutely fine with being on his own sometimes.

My child is always with me when we see my sister and her family. I generally make the effort more as her kids are younger and I have the time.

I think that for my sons self esteem and general happiness, I need to move away from the intensity of the contact , when with my child. He craves their attention and his self worth is so low that he will tolerate being second choice or not a choice at all, as the case may be.
This has only developed recently and I'm
Disgusted if I'm honest but then again , I'm highly sensitive when it comes to him.

My sister has zero insight with her own kids and has never once stepped in and said to her children, for example, to include my child or insist that he be part of a specific group that they were creating. They feel
Very Comfortable leaving him out and she feels very comfortable enabling that .
So, can you advise me here. I really need objectivity thanks.

I will add again that I can be very defensive as he was always labelled the 'troublemaker' which he was mostly, but not always, and always the one that was blamed when there was trouble among them... again, it was mostly him but not always. He has that label now though sadly as it has stuck.
Thanks .

What a nasty and rude response, completely unwarranted. If your son has the aggression you have, it's no surprise children don't want to play with him. Your response was absolutely uncalled for.

*Kind, loving, sensitive, funny children who have problems managing their anger do not tend to come across as kind, loving, sensitive and funny to other kids. And if his cousins have had 11 years of putting up with him they may have learnt to cut him out to protect themselves.

You see his difficulties from an adult perspective, but they will see a peer who cannot be trusted.*

Exactly.

Well said. Her son isn't even diagnosed, my gut feeling is it is a lack of discipline more than anything else and the OP is looking for something to blame for her son's behaviour. Perhaps her sister's children may have a disability too, after all, it's the go-to explanation.

I still don't understand why you'd want them to spend time with your ds OP. You clearly have a great dislike for them, most recent post is calling them 'sly and shitty' you expect his previous behaviours to be forgiven and forgotten but are still bringing up their response to his behaviours?.

@LolaMoon - you and most posters on here have described autistic behaviours repeatedly as bad behaviour rather than seeking to understand it.

You're right, there's no point in discussing it further when people like you won't acknowledge that and work with the parents of autistic children. Families in particular really should try to find a way through without putting some children in the good box and others in the bad one.

As I said in my post that you quoted, I am not saying that any child should be taught to accept that aggressive and controlling is fine and dandy. Parents need to supervise closely. There need to be open and honest conversations.

Autistic children are much, much more likely to be victims of bullying than NT children. Excluding a child for being disabled is a form of bullying.

She said their behaviour is sly and shitty, not them

the ways and means of excluding him were sly and shitty

Absolutely. Her son does not come off well at all in her posts. I understand her wanting her son to be happy, but it's no surprise that if her nephews have a better offer so to speak, they'd rather take that. It's understandable. When I was that age, all I wanted to do was read or play on the computer, so I think they're all getting too old to be playing together anyway.

BTW, for anyone critical of my posts, I speak as someone actually diagnosed with ASD. But I also know it's not an excuse for bad behaviour and ASD doesn't make anyone more aggressive or antisocial than the next person. It's how you're brought up more than anything and parental influence.

And finally, yes I do take it personally. My autistic child is barely at school because he's been bullied and excluded his whole life for being autistic by neurotypical children meaning that school is a pretty horrendous experience for him. And I get really fed up and frustrated by parents defending that kind of behaviour.

It's difficult not to take it personally to be honest.

By your own admission your son had anger issues, aggression, desire for social control and was mostly the troublemaker...AND you are very defensive of him (I think that probably reads that you don't want to make him accountable)... and you wonder why the cousins aren't choosing him as #1?

She sure went for my jugular! Often on here if you read threads about people's children being bullied, you read that their parents are loud and aggressive and bullying too. I think that's the same situation here. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree. And my experience as a child (with ASD) and as a parent is that the mothers of angry bullying children with anger issues were as angry if not angrier than their children. I could tell by her reaction to me that OP is that type of parent.

There is no doubt in my mind that he has ASD . It is familial and has masked well for many reasons.
The reason that so many ND kids are treated so badly , comes normally from the parents attitudes . As we can see in the most recent few posts

John: Mummy the new boy beside me is deaf/ annoying/ academically weak/ slow at soccer/ fidgety ( delete as appropriate)

Mummy: Don't worry dear, I'll ring your Teacher. He/ she'll be moved to someone else by lunch time .

@IAmWomanHearMeRoar1 Your aggression intolerance and ignorance surrounding children with additional needs is astounding but not uncommon, sadly

I know right, fucking hell.

i get it OP, having been through something similar. What I would say to you is to make boosting his confidence a priority. Keep him away from the kids who treat people how they want, you don't want them hanging around with your bairn when they're mid teens. He used to come across as bossy and wanting control because he needed control to soothe any anxiety. The fact he doesn't do that now and meekly accepts being picked up and put down is alarming.

Look for some groups or charities for ND kids and their parents. Put your relationship with your sister on the back burner if need be

They're happy to engage with him when there is no other option. And as soon as there is another option, they drop him.

I think we all do this to a certain extent. We all have friends we're closer with and would choose to spend more time with friend A than friend B. But see B if A isn't around. That's normal. I really don't see why that's wrong. If they have friends around of course they'd choose to spend time with their friends and not their cousin. I really cannot understand what is wrong with that. So they play with him when it suits them. And? I don't see the problem. You don't have to play with someone every single time you see them.

👏👏👏

The reason that so many ND kids are treated so badly , comes normally from the parents attitudes .

I think you're in danger of turning what is a particular family situation into a broader children like mine are the victim point.

I'm ND and suspect one of my DC is as well. I will always tell any DC that if they are not feeling safe or they don't feel like a friendship situation is one of trust and respect they can, and should, walk away from it or withdraw.

As an adult I can see that some of your DC's behaviour could stem from ND, but I also entirely understand that from the perspective of your sister's children they've had quite negative experiences with your child. It's understandable that children would prioritise playing with friends over a child who, if we are really honest, they're only having to socialise with because the mums are related.

On lots of threads about parent friends finding their children don't get on people remind posters that just because the adults are friends, doesn't mean the children have to be. The same is true here. Just because the children are related doesn't mean they have to be friends.

Sorry it was not my intention to be one sided . It was in fact my intetion to be balanced .
My nieces and nephews interact and have great fun with my child when there is nobody else around eg another cousin or neighbour etc.
If my child is in the vicinity where additional children join the group, they will actively exclude him through nasty and underhand ways.
To give an example so I'm not confusing anyone.
My child was talking to another at my sisters house. A friend/ neighbour of my niece.
My child and the girl were laughing and having fun.
My niece walked into the centre of their exchange , whispered something into the girls ear and physically pulled her away.
The girl was deeply uncomfortable and my child looked very hurt.
This is a new behaviour I've noticed in my niece. It's happened a few times so I've decided to pull back completely .

BTW, for anyone critical of my posts, I speak as someone actually diagnosed with ASD. But I also know it's not an excuse for bad behaviour and ASD doesn't make anyone more aggressive or antisocial than the next person. It's how you're brought up more than anything and parental influence.

Oh, seriously 😆😆😆 has ASD so thinks they are the expert on the behaviour of every person on the spectrum. This is the funniest post on the thread, almost satirical. Well done 👏

Well that was a dripfeed when the thread started to drift away from you.

However if what you're saying is true then there is no excuse for your niece's behaviour, it is rude, hurtful and your sister needs to be told what niece is doing and why it is bullying and wrong.

I'm not the one acting the expert. I was telling OP that she can't say her son's behaviour is typical of ASD because not everyone with ASD is the same. That, was my entire point.

It's not a drop feed. She was very clear in her OP that they purposely and intentionally exclude her son when other children are around.

That is completely and utterly different from actively being nasty to him and encouraging other kid to be nasty to him.

Don't punish your sister just because her children are acting exactly like most children their age would. You definitely have my sympathies but this isn't the answer.

It's not though. Purposely and intentionally leaving someone out is nasty. They want him to know he's not welcome.

I had the same in school. In my class there was one girl who would sit beside me and copy my work off me. Then when we went into the next class she would put her hand up to my face and say "See ya!" then sit with another girl (who wasn't in the first class) and not let me join their table. I was too young and autistic tbh to understand what she was doing. I still thought she was my friend because she sometimes sat with me. But as an adult it is plain to see she was a bully.

No, it is not. Not at all, not even remotely. Choosing to spend time with someone else and not with a certain person is not even remotely nasty. It's is normal behaviour. It's completely normal to choose not to associate with someone.

I think you were probably a bully as a child too.