My MILs partner smacked our 3 year old

[BubblingRage]

Sorry for this being very long winded!
A bit of background first. MIL moved her new partner into her house after talking to each other for a month during the first lockdown. Everything was very quick and he seemingly arrived at her house with nothing. No furniture, towels, tv… literally just a handful of clothes. I always found him a bit “iffy” and refused to let my then 2 year old round to his nanny’s without me or my husband being there. (Once lockdown lifted obviously). Fast forward nearly 2 years and I’ve warmed to him, so I finally agree for my MIL to have our 3 and 1 year old overnight near Christmas so we could go out a celebrate my birthday. For a couple of weeks afterwards my 3 year old didn’t want “nanny” and (I shall refer to him as) “R” to come round our house. He also started not wanting to go round to nanny’s house either. This was very unusual as he usually dotes on his nan. Alarm bells starting ringing.
They came round to ours on Boxing Day as their surrogate Christmas Day. I noticed that R was often rolling his eyes and shaking his head at our DS. He wasn’t doing anything wrong, he was just an excited 3 year old at Christmas!
DS didn’t mention anything for a couple of weeks so I assumed he’d forgotten all about whatever was bugging him. Every so often he would drop into conversation or just randomly say that he doesn’t like “R”. I lightly questioned him about it but never really got a proper answer out of him. My DH asked MIL if anything had happened. She said R told DS off for throwing a dice. So we assumed that was what was wrong!
This morning DS randomly said again that he doesn’t like R. I sat him down and said that I will always help him. I always believe him and will never be angry or sad if he tells me what is bothering him and that I will always help him. But that I can’t help him if he doesn’t tell me what’s wrong. He then said that “R” smacked him round the head when he had a sleepover at nanny’s. Nanny had gone to get him a drink, DS was playing with a dice and R smacked him. He didn’t tell him off or shout, just smacked him.
I am beyond livid and although he’s only 3, I believe my son implicitly.
I don’t know what to do. We’re going to mention it to MIL and not let DS round to their house. But I feel like that’s not enough!
im just absolutely gutted for my son. And I’m so annoyed that I didn’t listen to my own instinct.
What would you do in this situation?!

I think you need to ask your MIL what happened (if she knows). I assume you trust her and don't think she would lie about this? As you said yourself, small children can exaggerate massively, not out of malice but because they cannot grasp the consequences. I accused my mom of wrenching and injuring my arm when I was about 4 - I can still remember this, and the fact that she didn't do it - she just held my arm normally. Yet I told loads of people she had hurt me - no idea why. I loved my mom.

I've also worked in safeguarding. Children's complaints do need to be listened to and taken seriously, of course. It would be terrible and dangerous not to do so. But they also need investigating carefully, not just a blind assumption that they are totally accurate in all cases.

If it turns out that the guy has hit your child round the head deliberately then obviously that is really really bad and you have every right to react very strongly to that. But I would try and investigate it a bit first. I'm not trying to victim blame your son at all here - just trying to be sensible and realistic. Good luck - not a nice situation to find yourself in.

Please come back and tell us if you find he has a dodgy history. Him arriving with no belongings would ring alarm bells for me.

@MaireadMcSweeney is that definitely correct? I thought disclosure is allowed where the person has unsupervised contact with children? I genuinely don't know and apologies if you have knowledge of these things, but as the OP is already slightly wary of pursuing this with police as she isn't clear on the exact law and process I just wanted to check in case there is a route (even if not Claire's Law) to ask Police.

Op it's so hard but that is a lot of detail for a small child to remember.

Maybe it's the fact he did it whilst she was out the room that's absolutely scared him.

His behaviour has changed.

That's what I would say first and I wouldn't go in a guns blazing either.
I would say doesnt want to visit does she kmow why. Ask gently about the partner to elicit information out of her. She would be more likely to share any niggling doubts if she doesn't feel under threat.
Try and persuade her to get him checked out.
Obviously any sign of defensivness unfortunately just forget it.

The change in behaviour from your DS to being scared of R and suddenly afraid would have had me worried of sexual or physical abuse straight away.
I'd invite MIL out for a walk or coffee, just her, and let her know that the grandchildren will no longer be coming to hers while R is living there and that she is welcome to see them in their own home without R but he isn't welcome ever again in your house.

Then it's up to her what she does.
She can stay with him but you've clearly laid out your boundaries or she can break up with him.

Your DH needs to ask her if he's abusive and if she needs help to get him out of her house.

You need to tell her exactly what your child has told you , let her deal with her boyfriend but don’t leave your children alone with them anymore . Hopefully she will kick him into touch .

Def check with 101 or Clare's Law.

This.

Don't let her get in your head to say it didn't happen/he's confused, etc. Don't let her downplay it. Keep believing your child.
Simply tell her she won't be seeing your kids again if he's in her home and she can't visit alone (including if she mentions this to your DC). And still get the check. If anything came back I'd also take a picture of the report and send it to her - unless it states you can't.

In all honesty, I don't even believe people who say they've split up with partners when they've been forced to because family have gone NC. On here there have been several cases of people lying and keeping partners in their life and homes to continue to harm others. I think it does happen. Keep that in mind.

Also, he's assaulted your child and I'd be inclined to report this. He could be a danger to children and this build a case for the future too, even if there's nothing in the past.

You all owe him for unmasking his intention.

Heaven only knows what else he's capable of but his intention toward those he perceives as vulnerable is bad!

You said you warmed to him- this is what predators do they work their way him, disarm you with charm then do what they do right under your nose.
i would be very concerned especially when your 1 year old probably can’t communicate if they were harmed during that stay.
ask for a check through Sarah’s law, speak with your MIL - expect that she will say it didn’t happen and that she was in the room.
but trust your child over her protecting her boyfriend,

I agree with this.

If your husband wants a relationship its his business but she would habe no relationship with me or my child if she didnt jetison this bloke immediately.
There are a lot of red flags.

Agree with background check suggestions. I'd be concerned that his sudden appearance with little belongings may coincide with being released from prison. Best to be on the safe side.

I don't doubt what your son said, but even if he is exaggerating or R or your mil vehemently denies the slap, i would still keep him away from mil's house. He is no longer happy to go there and doesn't like R, and you have seen with your own eyes how R behaves around him. He would be banned from my house for sure.

Yeah I'm usually a bit tempted to roll my eyes about calling 101 but in this case I would call them.
He may already have form for violence in which case the police will look into him

And no contact whatsoever with either of them until you can find out who this guy is.
I can't see how they can have a serving hatch and not hear the difference between a smack found the head and a telling off.

As someone with a grandmother who thought nothing of snacking me as a kid and the fact I've not spoken to her in 30 years, stand up for your son

What a supportive post 🙄

this is a parenting forum. The OP is allowed to ask for advice. If you don’t have anything helpful to say maybe don’t post?

Zero contact with this man. Tell your MIL exactly why.

I disagree. The hitting alone is a hard red line, but hitting a defenceless, tiny three-year-old around the head is nothing short of dangerous. There are no shades of grey here: this man is a threat to children.

In OP's shoes, if my MiL wanted to continue a relationship with a partner she knew had acted in this way, my child would not be having a relationship with her either.

I'd have a good think about how you want to approach it. It will be difficult for your MiL to believe this has happened, she will likely ask her partner who will deny it and then she will have to choose between the man she loves or the word of a 3 year old. I do think it happened but it will be a natural reaction for her to question it. And she will likely see criticism of her partner as criticism of her etc.

I do agree with posters saying that he partner shouldn't see your child again. But just warning you that it's unlikely your MiLs first reaction will be 'what a bastard, I'll chuck him out tonight'. So you might want to think about how that will work practically (presumably contact will be in your house or out in public).

Is there any chance he is abusive or controlling to her as well do you think? In which case she may not be 'allowed' to see your son and I wouldn't make it about 'picking sides' just keeping your son safe.

Your poor boy, what a horrible thing to happen to him. It's good he told you though

I would take parts of that out, send your husband round to hit him.

Sensible and measured advice here OP.

Before I spoke to MiL I think I'd try to find out what info I could on R. Google, Clare's/Sarah's Law, hire a PI, dating apps, FB, whatever. Info is usually 'out there' somewhere, although not always easy to find.

Then I'd have DH and I speak to MiL alone or have DH do it if it's likely that MiL would feel 'ganged up on' if both of us were there and if I was sure that DH would be able to get our points across accurately, calmly, and 'forcefully'.

I'd calmly tell her what DS has said and that you believe him. And that the two of you (you and DH) have made the decision that R is never going to be around your DC again and that R is not welcome in your home nor will the DC be in her home if he is there. But that she is welcome in your home and can see the DGC there, without him. This puts the ball straight in her court. If you want to make it a condition that she requests a Sarah's Law and Clare's Law report before she is allowed to see the DGC, then fine. But prepared that if it shows up nothing she will use it as 'proof of his innocence' and that you are being unreasonable and vindictive against R.

I wouldn't give her an ultimatum of 'leave him or else' as her relationship with him is really her own decision to make. That'll only muddy the waters and make her even more defensive and right now you want to keep your decision focused on the safety of the DGC. But I would try to gently raise the issue of whether or not she has experienced any behaviour from him that is either troubling her or has frightened or confused her. Let her know that you have her back if she wants to end things. Just don't expect her to willy nilly agree to throw him out. She's been lonely before and isn't going to want to be lonely again. People make foolish choices in that situation.

No, police are very protective of their information. If OP asked for disclosure on the basis that she sometimes leaves her child there the police would tell her to stop leaving her child there. DVDS is to reduce the risk of domestic abuse. Disclosure is only given to current or very recent partners.

You can't do Clare's law as the OP in this situation. 101 won't tell her anything either.

OP can't get a background check.