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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Manager said no to holiday request

321 replies

Buddythecat1 · 15/02/2023 16:13

I'm probably going to get my arse handed to me on a plate here but fck it.
I asked for two days off on Monday just passed
I asked 10 days in advance.
Just been told today that it's been refused.
I asked why, was told 'I don't know'

I am very hot headed and I have such strong temptation to walk put right now. (I have another thread about my contract if anybody cares)
I've been spoken to like shit by this manager, talked down to on a daily basis, I've been micromanaged.
I dread coming to work, I cry most days. Management allowed another employee to verbally abuse me and no consequences were ever brought to the other person.

Would I be totally unreasonable to walk out? The thought of never having to work in this place again gives me great relief. Or am I just being stupid and should suck it up

OP posts:
LookItsMeAgain · 19/02/2023 17:34

My understanding @Buddythecat1 is if you hand in your noticed effective immediately, it basically means that you can leave the business there and then. HR then has to work out how many days of annual leave you might be entitled to pro-rata and Payroll should be able to transfer whatever wages are outstanding.

My advice would be to cut and run. You clearly feel no strong ties to this company that you're leaving so leave. Thank them for the opportunities and then leave. If you can, put an appointment in the calendar of the manager that you report to for first thing tomorrow so that they can start their recruitment process as soon as you leave.

That's my advice. Oh and well done on getting the other job.

DontMakeMeShushYou · 19/02/2023 19:40

This might not be accurate as I don't know all the details of your employment. Based on starting on August 1st 2022 and finishing work tomorrow, working 5 hours a day, 5 days a week, you would have accrued 78.3 hours of holiday. So the two days you've taken would leave you with 68.3 hours to take. Of course, that may change according to when your holiday year starts and ends.

Here's the calculations and result I got. You could try it again with accurate dates.

www.gov.uk/calculate-your-holiday-entitlement/y/hours-worked-per-week/leaving/2023-02-20/2022-08-01/25.0/5.0

T1Dmama · 19/02/2023 21:42

Did you get the other job?

I think you need to call in sick tomorrow, then book an urgent doctors appointment and ask them to sign you off, explain the situation, and they should sign you off for the notice period… which I assume is 2 weeks if paid fortnightly??
They can’t really argue with a sick note…. I would then send in both the sick note and resignation letter today.

lieselotte · 20/02/2023 09:14

I think Lookit'sme's advice is spot on. Hope all went well today OP, or as well as it could. Put yourself, your dd and your health first, not your horrible employers.

Jaichangecentfoisdenom · 20/02/2023 12:59

Congratulations on your new job, @Buddythecat1! I hope today went well. I'm a bit confused, you say you are on a part-time contract but working full-time - you are being paid for the full-time hours, aren't you? In which case, surely, whatever your contract says, you've been working full time and your holiday hours/days should have been calculated accordingly, particularly if, as you say, you've been clocking in at 7.45am and clocking out at 4.30pm, with no breaks.
Good luck in your new job, I hope you are able to get away from this one as soon as possible!

Original poster
Buddythecat1 · 22/02/2023 06:25

I quit with immediate effect on Monday.
Got my payslip through this morning, they've lumped in last fortnights pay with next fortnights pay which means the tax paid on it is higher than usual.. bit unfair
And no holidays paid, which I knew would happen

OP posts:
browneyes77 · 22/02/2023 07:09

OP, I would speak to ACAS to get some advice. They can help talk you through what you’d be entitled to.

You may even be able to raise a grievance still, but as you’ve resigned there’s a chance the business may decide not to deal with it.

If you’ve been working full time hours but they’ve only been giving you holidays based on your pt hours, then that’s very naughty of them and ACAS can advise you on this.

niugboo · 22/02/2023 08:06

So that may include holiday pay as you aren’t entitled to the next two weeks pay if you aren’t working.

the tax rate doesn’t change. It is what it is.

Original poster
Buddythecat1 · 22/02/2023 08:21

niugboo · 22/02/2023 08:06

So that may include holiday pay as you aren’t entitled to the next two weeks pay if you aren’t working.

the tax rate doesn’t change. It is what it is.

I should be as I worked part of last week but no it's definitely the two wages paid as one
Usually for holiday it'll say holiday @ 5 hours

Mine changes? If my wages go down then I don't pay as much tax

OP posts:
niugboo · 22/02/2023 09:19

again, if it’s pay for the next two weeks you aren’t entitled to that as you aren’t working.

The amount of tax you pay is a percentage of what you earn. The actual figure is more because you have been paid a higher amount but the overall amount you pay won’t change.

anon2022anon · 22/02/2023 09:20

Your tax will even out with the new job. Can you go to HR and ask them to sort out holiday pay? Don't worry about going over bosses head now, you don't have to see him again.

gawditswindy · 22/02/2023 09:39

All of this is why you should be in a union, OP, and anyone in a similar role. They can help you work out exactly what you're entitled to and help you ensure you're not working 8 hour days when only contracted for 5 and not being given any breaks. God knows how much longer they'll let us be in a union in this country, so join while you can!

Pollymollydolly · 22/02/2023 09:56

Well done op!

Just read your thread now and cannot believe some posters are saying you sound like hard work, not a good employee etc. your (former) employer sounds shite and I am glad you didn’t work notice, given the way they have treated you so far I can only imagine how difficult they would have made your notice period.

I agree with others that you should look into the legality of their actions re not paying you for unused annual leave.

I’m sure you feel a huge weight has been lifted knowing you don’t have to go back there.

Best of luck with your new job!

EilonwyWithRedGoldHair · 22/02/2023 14:34

Badger1970 · 15/02/2023 17:19

I run a small business and there are times when I have to refuse leave. However there needs to be consideration on both sides and if it was for a medical appointment or something of similar importance then I'd try to come to some level of compromise.

But please don't phone in sick or get signed off. I'd be banned if I said what I think about people who do this.

And I'd probably be banned if I said what I thought of employers who don't allow people time off for medical appointments.

I worked with a lovely young man who needed time off for a hospital appointment. Work said no, so he cancelled, got another appointment, work said no again. So he handed his notice in, went to appointment. He was diagnosed with cancer. He popped into see us a year or so later, was doing well thankfully.

And funnily enough they were shitty employers in many other ways as well.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 15:24

T1Dmama · 19/02/2023 21:42

Did you get the other job?

I think you need to call in sick tomorrow, then book an urgent doctors appointment and ask them to sign you off, explain the situation, and they should sign you off for the notice period… which I assume is 2 weeks if paid fortnightly??
They can’t really argue with a sick note…. I would then send in both the sick note and resignation letter today.

She has less than 2 years service and is already under investigation for sick leave taken. They can sack her if she goes off sick.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 15:25

niugboo · 22/02/2023 08:06

So that may include holiday pay as you aren’t entitled to the next two weeks pay if you aren’t working.

the tax rate doesn’t change. It is what it is.

The two extra weeks will be the weeks worked ‘in hand’ when the OP first started work.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 15:27

niugboo · 22/02/2023 09:19

again, if it’s pay for the next two weeks you aren’t entitled to that as you aren’t working.

The amount of tax you pay is a percentage of what you earn. The actual figure is more because you have been paid a higher amount but the overall amount you pay won’t change.

OP will have worked 2 weeks ‘in hand if she’s fortnightly paid. The two weeks pay will be for that.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 15:37

Buddythecat1 · 22/02/2023 06:25

I quit with immediate effect on Monday.
Got my payslip through this morning, they've lumped in last fortnights pay with next fortnights pay which means the tax paid on it is higher than usual.. bit unfair
And no holidays paid, which I knew would happen

OP the two weeks extra in your final pay will be the two weeks ‘in hand’ you will have worked when you first started - you work two weeks in hand in case you leave suddenly and without notice, which is what you’ve done. They still owe you up to 28 days statutory untaken holiday pay. Be careful how you handle it because if you have left without working the two weeks statutory notice the employer cold claim against you for the cost of replacing you at short notice. They probably wouldn’t because of all the other crap that’s gone on, but you need to contact ACAS for advice on that, and holiday pay, and also on any pay they owe you for working 8 hours when you’re only contracted for 5.

Original poster
Buddythecat1 · 22/02/2023 15:53

DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 15:37

OP the two weeks extra in your final pay will be the two weeks ‘in hand’ you will have worked when you first started - you work two weeks in hand in case you leave suddenly and without notice, which is what you’ve done. They still owe you up to 28 days statutory untaken holiday pay. Be careful how you handle it because if you have left without working the two weeks statutory notice the employer cold claim against you for the cost of replacing you at short notice. They probably wouldn’t because of all the other crap that’s gone on, but you need to contact ACAS for advice on that, and holiday pay, and also on any pay they owe you for working 8 hours when you’re only contracted for 5.

Show quote history

Yeah it makes sense it's just frustrating because I only worked 3 days last week so wouldn't have been taxed on that pay but because they've lumped it in with last fortnights pay I've actually lost money but hey ho. It's done now.
They haven't replaced me, it's still just the 1 person working by herself. It's hard to explain but it'll be a while before they can get someone else (they've had other positions advertised since october)
But I'm fucking free and it's a relief.
I did feel so guilty on Monday and Tuesday but now I'm seeing the other side of it.
I'm hopeful my new job will start next week

OP posts:
DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 15:59

It sounds as though the relief you feel at not having to go back is worth any hassle getting what you’re owed. Really pleased for you and i hope you’ll be happy in the new job. Good luck🤞

Comefromaway · 22/02/2023 16:00

Tax is cumulative so you won't lose money. When you start your new job you will give them your P45 which will state how much you have earnt to date this tax year and how much tax you have paid. If you paid too much in your old employment you will get a tax rebate.

You might however have paid extra national insurance if you were paid two lots of pay together but that will be minimal.

EilonwyWithRedGoldHair · 22/02/2023 16:00

Jaichangecentfoisdenom · 20/02/2023 12:59

Congratulations on your new job, @Buddythecat1! I hope today went well. I'm a bit confused, you say you are on a part-time contract but working full-time - you are being paid for the full-time hours, aren't you? In which case, surely, whatever your contract says, you've been working full time and your holiday hours/days should have been calculated accordingly, particularly if, as you say, you've been clocking in at 7.45am and clocking out at 4.30pm, with no breaks.
Good luck in your new job, I hope you are able to get away from this one as soon as possible!

When I worked on a part-time contract but usually worked extra hours, quite often full-time, it didn't effect my holiday allowance - if I took a week off I was paid for 16hrs as that was my contracted hours, if I took 1 day off I was paid for 4hrs as that was my contracted hours.

niugboo · 22/02/2023 16:00

No. That’s not how it works. If she works 2 weeks in hand it means she works two weeks and then gets paid. She is only owed money up until her last day of employment. They don’t her money for the next two weeks. She hasn’t worked that.

niugboo · 22/02/2023 16:01

You really aren’t understanding how tax works. Tax free allowance is based on earnings across the year. It’s cumulative.

DotAndCarryOne2 · 22/02/2023 16:06

niugboo · 22/02/2023 16:00

No. That’s not how it works. If she works 2 weeks in hand it means she works two weeks and then gets paid. She is only owed money up until her last day of employment. They don’t her money for the next two weeks. She hasn’t worked that.

No, working two weeks in hand means no pay for four weeks if she’s fortnightly paid. The first two weeks is paid back when you leave. She will have been paid up to the day she left plus the two weeks in hand from when she started.