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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

I think my boss is scared of me - should I call it out?

302 replies

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 00:58

My boss is very able and experienced but not a massive people person so we’re a small team. We’re each other’s key colleague. What’s bothering me is my boss seems to dread being in a room one-to-one with me. I don’t know if it is weird or AIBU to think it is weird or what.

Around November my boss took me into a meeting room to give me what he thought was a dressing down (closed door). It didn’t go well, I had plenty to say from my side and HR ended up involved. After that, any meetings he instigated were either with the door open or in weird places round the office without doors, so in open plan. A marked change from previous years of working together.

We’re both mainly WFH so it doesn’t come up much and I thought we’d got through it. But again today we had a meeting and he left the door open. The implication seems to be that I am too unpredictable/toxic/not sure what really? to be in a room with. I find it hurtful, unprofessional and odd but … should I say something?

YABU - he can leave the door open if that’s how he prefers it, everyone’s entitled to feel at ease
YANBU - weird and unprofessional, you need to be able to work in a meeting room in your company’s office with the door shut.

OP posts:
Alexandernevermind · 15/02/2023 08:48

If you wfh and these one to one meetings are infrequent then I can't see why it is bothering you. Also, unless the meeting is about a personal or confidential matter, then why should the door be shut? The door will be open probably on the advice of HR because your working relationship became acrimonious. This might not now be the team for you. Are your skills transferable?

Original poster
CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 08:49

pinkdelight · 15/02/2023 08:47

It’s just another way of ‘othering’ women.

This is such an odd way to take this. He's not othering you. He's protecting himself - and both of you in fact. If he's being extra sensitive to the risks because you're a woman then that's no bad thing, it'd be naive to think there aren't risks in a closed door situation given your recent history. You simultaneously seem to think he's scared of you and that he's being PA, and to keep bringing up the Teams calls us weird as that's clearly so different as to be irrelevant. I'd be glad he's being professional about it and not be calling him out on anything.

To be clear - the ‘othering women’ remark was about the weird policy mentioned upthread about leaving the door open ‘a crack’ when there were meetings of both sexes. Nothing to do with my situation.

OP posts:
Ceryneianhind · 15/02/2023 08:50

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 01:04

I should maybe add - at the November closed-door meeting I didn’t do anything that might need the input of colleagues! I did cry though (it was a bad week for one of my DC’s health - not that I shared that). Boss has a bit of form for difficult behaviour with other colleagues, nothing major but does have a mean streak.

Around November my boss took me into a meeting room to give me what he thought was a dressing down (closed door). It didn’t go well, I had plenty to say from my side and HR ended up involved

I would have tried to move you out of my team into another one if that was possible

I would definitely not be in a closed door room with you

Streamside · 15/02/2023 08:52

BethFromThisIsUs · 15/02/2023 01:08

I mean you could call him out.

But I somehow doubt it’ll resolve the issue of him being scared of you 😬

sounds like he’s scared of a tribunal/bullying/harassment claim or something to be honest.

I think the distinction is that he's not scared of you, he's scared of the potential outcome and has been warned by HR.

Ceryneianhind · 15/02/2023 08:54

And I have never, ever heard of a policy to leave the door open a crack - that is madness. It’s just another way of ‘othering’ women

We’ve worked together for a while and I’ve never cried in the office - although he has tried hard to make me! - but this time I was not strong enough and too worried about personal things.

How has he tried to make you cry? And why?

ClairDeLaLune · 15/02/2023 08:54

I’ve never cried in the office - although he has tried hard to make me!

This is not right OP, your boss sounds like a horrible bully. Good for you standing up for yourself. I don’t understand why you’re getting such a hard time on here. What are we women supposed to do? Meekly accept male toxicity?

What was the dressing down about? It’s not exactly a professional way to tackle issues.

CrescentMoons · 15/02/2023 08:56

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 01:20

There’s no-one note taking on all the many, many normal Teams calls we have had since that meeting.

It is an ‘in person’ thing. And definitely deliberate because in our workplace we have confidentiality requirements for our matters - almost all meetings take place with doors shut just because of the nature of the work. (Not as exciting as it sounds).

This. He is protecting himself.

Are they recorded though? Or recorded on his home computer?

to be fair I would do the same - I once had a line manager who was a right bitch and I insisted the door was open and someone else around.

Original poster
CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 08:57

To those posters writing off anyone who cries at work, most people have cried at work at some point! You’re writing off a lot of potential and actual colleagues. I’d bet hard money every single woman in my office has.

My boss has a mean streak and worked hard to make me cry. I am not the first. However, I am an experienced professional who has lasted longer in his team than almost anyone who has worked with him, and generally I let it wash over me.

OP posts:
Streamside · 15/02/2023 09:00

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 08:42

Could HR have advised him to always have one to one meetings in a public area?

I don’t think so. A very senior member of staff who knew about the November incident and was involved with the fallout, asked me later how it had all gone. I mentioned the door thing and Senior Person said ‘Oh you just have to cut through that kind of crap and get up and shut the door’. So I don’t think it is a management technique from HR.

Be careful this senior person isn't just trying to stir things up. Your manager has every right to control the layout of the meeting and he can't go against hr advice.

Butchyrestingface · 15/02/2023 09:00

My boss has a mean streak and worked hard to make me cry. I am not the first. However, I am an experienced professional who has lasted longer in his team than almost anyone who has worked with him, and generally I let it wash over me.

In three pages, we've gone from "not a massive people person" to a horrible bully with a mean streak who "works hard" to make you cry.

Anyways, if he's as bad as all that, I would WANT the office door open during meetings for my own protection. Makes no sense to me that you're pondering calling him out over something that would surely benefit you.

Charlize43 · 15/02/2023 09:03

HR may have told him not to put himself in the position of being alone in a room with you.

Alwayswonderedwhy · 15/02/2023 09:04

I don't think he's scared of you Sounds like he's covering himself.

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 15/02/2023 09:06

Can you get another job? Because whoever is ‘right’ , it sounds miserable for both of you.

sweeneytoddsrazor · 15/02/2023 09:11

I would have the door open as well if I was your manager, or alternatively I would have a witness in the room.

Intrepidescape · 15/02/2023 09:11

I had my boss crying after she tried to discipline me.

Admittedly, I had had enough and stopped performing when I found out she stopped me from getting a job I was being head hunted for.

You clearly weren’t performing and refused to accept criticism. Your boss isn’t afraid of you. They don’t trust you and they probably don’t like you after you went to HR. Quite frankly - what did you expect?

Figmentof · 15/02/2023 09:15

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 08:57

To those posters writing off anyone who cries at work, most people have cried at work at some point! You’re writing off a lot of potential and actual colleagues. I’d bet hard money every single woman in my office has.

My boss has a mean streak and worked hard to make me cry. I am not the first. However, I am an experienced professional who has lasted longer in his team than almost anyone who has worked with him, and generally I let it wash over me.

You are sounding worse and worse OP. Of course he didn’t try to make you cry, men can’t stand women crying at work, they don’t know what to do. You are a trouble maker, I would be looking to get you out. Why don’t you do everyone a favour and leave, although pity the poor sod who inherits you!

Original poster
CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 09:16

sweeneytoddsrazor · 15/02/2023 09:11

I would have the door open as well if I was your manager, or alternatively I would have a witness in the room.

This is bizarrely unworkable though - we have meetings together on Teams every day. The November meeting was a verbal disagreement that might have happened by Teams but we were in the office. To be clear, we didn’t have a punch up!

OP posts:
BaroldFromEastenders · 15/02/2023 09:17

Sounds like the women in your office might need to be a bit more professional.

when you said you had “plenty to say” and that led to him getting HR involved - what did you mean by that?

“calling someone out” is a confrontational, quite aggressive thing to do, normally when someone feels like they’re absolutely in the right. Guaranteed to get the other persons back up.

Quveas · 15/02/2023 09:19

To be honest, you seem to spend an awful lot of time "having a lot to say" and "calling out", and an awful lot of that talking to HR. If I were managing you then I wouldn't be leaving the door open - there would be an HR witness in meetings with you going forward. Especially since you do seem to have a habit of elaborating your version of events - for example from "able and experienced / not a people person" to "having a mean streak" and "passive aggressive", Does he trust you? Well if someone I managed was in the habit of running to HR over things then I wouldn't trust them, no. And I am frankly shocked at the "very senior person" that you also went running to (you do a lot of running to other people, don't you?) actually criticising his actions to you - which is highly unprofessional.

IloveRickyGervaisAndHisTeeth · 15/02/2023 09:20

GCAcademic · 15/02/2023 01:07

If I’d tried to have a meeting with a member of staff I manage to discuss something I wasn’t happy with, and they’d “had plenty to say”, cried and HR had got involved, I’d certainly avoid being alone in a closed room with them again.

this

Figmentof · 15/02/2023 09:20

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 09:16

This is bizarrely unworkable though - we have meetings together on Teams every day. The November meeting was a verbal disagreement that might have happened by Teams but we were in the office. To be clear, we didn’t have a punch up!

Show quote history

I am very curious as to why you need a door closed so badly anyway.

Original poster
CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 09:20

You are sounding worse and worse OP. Of course he didn’t try to make you cry, men can’t stand women crying at work, they don’t know what to do. You are a trouble maker, I would be looking to get you out. Why don’t you do everyone a favour and leave, although pity the poor sod who inherits you!

Have you actually read the thread?

How am I the troublemaker? I didn’t start the November meeting or raise the issues, I didn’t chose to cry, I didn’t go to HR, and I haven’t (yet) raised the issue of the door with him. Quite bizarre.

OP posts:
YukoandHiro · 15/02/2023 09:21

He sounds like an arsehole. I would welcome that open door. It protects you as much as him - he can't rip you a new one if everyone else is listening as there will be witnesses to his unreasonable behaviour.

MisschiefMaker · 15/02/2023 09:21

Wow a woman who doesn't take criticism lying down really rubs people up the wrong way!

Have the people here never had an unprofessional bullying boss or colleague?! Why are you all so sure she's the one in the wrong?!

Quveas · 15/02/2023 09:22

CaponeOnTax · 15/02/2023 09:16

This is bizarrely unworkable though - we have meetings together on Teams every day. The November meeting was a verbal disagreement that might have happened by Teams but we were in the office. To be clear, we didn’t have a punch up!

Show quote history

This is bizarrely unworkable though - we have meetings together on Teams every day. The November meeting was a verbal disagreement that might have happened by Teams but we were in the office. To be clear, we didn’t have a punch up!

What makes you think that Teams meetings aren't recorded - we have that ability. Or that he isn't recording your conversation on a phone or similar - easy to do if you are both working from home. So not "bizarrely unworkable" at all - having a virtual open door is easy.